Author Topic: Larry Bird on Shooting...  (Read 11668 times)

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Re: Larry Bird on Shooting...
« Reply #15 on: March 06, 2009, 07:20:02 PM »

Offline bdm860

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"They might show some [highlights] at the end of the game I hit to win games or tie it up,'' he said. "But I was never really a three-point shooter, and I never wanted to be known as a three-point shooter.''


Great reading indeed. And this is so true: "It's funny how a few enduring highlights have skewed the reputation of one of the league's great players.".



Maybe it's the highlights OR MAYBE it's the 3 straight 3-point shootouts he won, and the trash he talked during them like when he looked around the locker room and said ""I want all of you to know I am winning this thing. I'm just looking around to see who's gonna finish up second."

Or maybe Larry just has selective memory

Here is where Larry finished in total 3 pointers attempted each season
79-80 Bird finished 6th
80-81 Bird finished 11th
81-82 Bird finished 26th
82-83 Bird finished 7th
83-84 Bird finished 10th
84-85 Bird finished 8th
85-86 Bird finished 1st
86-87 Bird finished 5th
87-88 Bird finished 4th
88-89 Bird did not place, played only played 6 games
89-90 Bird finished 20th
90-91 Bird finished 17th
91-91 Bird finished 40th, in only 45 games!

So 7 top 10 finishes in 3-point attempts 12 years.  Ya so maybe it's the highlights or maybe Bird is remembering wrong here.


The problem is his stats compared to players nowadays.  Back then players didn't shoot the three nearly as often.  Lokk at it this wy.  The most three Bird ever attempted in one season is 237.  Ray allen already has 373 this season.  Eddie house has 251.  It was a different mind set back then when it cam to threes.  So while he was one of the tops in the league, he doesn't come close to guys today.  From 80-81 through 84-85 Bird didn't break 80 attempts.  Ray Allen averages 435 a season for his career. 

No doubt it's a different game today, but when you lead the league in three point attempts, guess what, you're shooting alot of threes compared to the players you're playing with.  Why do we remeber Bird as a 3 point shooter?  Because he was shooting more 3's during his time than anybody else!  And if Bird was playing in today's NBA he'd probably be among the leaders now with like 400-500.

If Bird said I wouldn't be known as a 3 point shooter in today's NBA that would be one thing, but to say "I was never really a three-point shooter, and I never wanted to be known as a three-point shooter" is ridiculous.  Lead the league in 3 point attempts, talk trash about your 3 point skills, and win 3 straight 3-point shout outs.  Right Larry, sure.

He never said he wasn't good at it.  He said he didn't shoot them alot. Barely taking one a game isn't alot, no matter how many other people are taking. And there were players who took a lot more of them in those years (except the one where he led the league obviously).  Hell, the year he took his most Danny Ainge took over 100 more then he did. 

cordobes makes a great point, it's about percentages.  He hardly took any threes (10% according to cordobes).  He's not complaing thst people think he was a good three point shooter, he complaining that he's known as a three point shooter.  Like Eddie house is.  I.e. he just bombed away from three land ala Antione Walker.   

He shot them alot for his time!  One a game is alot when nobody else or only a few players are taking more than that.

I understand cordobes point, but I think he's twisting it comparing Birds 10% to players playing today.  I think we'll all agree it's a different game today.  cordobes, do you have a spot you pulled the stats about Bird's shot attempts being only 10% from 3 point range compared to Jordan, LeBron, Pierce, etc. or did you just do the math manually?

Manually doing some math (and I'm only going to do a little until I know if there is a spot for this or not).  Looking at 85-86 (clearly I'm taking a year that is helping my opinion, but I also think of '86 as Bird's best year).  Here's how the League Leaders in points broke down and percentage of their shots that were 3's:

Rank   Player   Team   PPG   Year   FGA   3pa   % of shots that were 3's
1   Dominique Wilkins   ATL   30.3   1985-86   1897   70   3.69%
2   Adrian Dantley   UTA   29.8   1985-86   1453   0   0.00%
3   Alex English   DEN   29.8   1985-86   1888   5   0.26%
4   Larry Bird   BOS   25.8   1985-86   1606   194   12.08%
5   Purvis Short   GSW   25.5   1985-86   1313   49   3.73%
6   Kiki Vandeweghe   POR   24.8   1985-86   1332   8   0.60%
7   Moses Malone   PHI   23.8   1985-86   1246   1   0.08%
8   Hakeem Olajuwon   HOU   23.5   1985-86   1188   0   0.00%
9   Mike Mitchell   SAS   23.4   1985-86   1697   12   0.71%
10   Kareem Abdul-jabbar   LAL   23.4   1985-86   1338   2   0.15%
11   World Free   CLE   23.4   1985-86   1433   169   11.79%
12   Mark Aguirre   DAL   22.6   1985-86   1327   56   4.22%
13   Jeff Malone   WA1   22.4   1985-86   1522   17   1.12%
14   Walter Davis   PHO   21.8   1985-86   1287   76   5.91%
15   Rolando Blackman   DAL   21.5   1985-86   1318   29   2.20%

(sorry for the crudeness of this presentation, still at the office)

Of the top 15 scores, Bird took more 3's as a % of his overall shots than any of them.  So again, Bird took more 3's than anyboby in 86.  And he also took more 3's as a percentage of his overall field goal attempts than any other top scorer. 

So my conclusion, Bird was rightfully known as a 3 point shooter for his day.   Compared to today's NBA, no, but for the NBA he was playing in he took a lot of 3's.  That is why he was considered a 3 point shooter, because he was for his day.

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Re: Larry Bird on Shooting...
« Reply #16 on: March 06, 2009, 07:29:24 PM »

Offline steve

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Interesting point regarding shooting free throws underhand…I’ve never heard or considered that.

I’ve coached travel ball at different levels for several years and I’ve always taught BEEF (Balance, Elbow, Extension, Follow Through) with the emphasis on B and T.

There was an interesting point that David Thorpe on ESPN made about emphasizing follow through for a jump shooter rather than following the shot. I think it was in reference to Luol Deng sacrificing offensive rebounds to further emphasize finishing his shots. Hold the “goose neck” so to speak.

Interesting stuff though. Bird fundamentally had a difficult shooting style to teach to youngsters, more shooting above his ears rather than off the strong the shoulder…

Love these fundamental discussions though! Thanks, Roy….


You've never heard or considered shooting free throws under hand?  I find this rather difficult to believe. 

Re: Larry Bird on Shooting...
« Reply #17 on: March 06, 2009, 07:40:27 PM »

Offline Roy Hobbs

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Interesting point regarding shooting free throws underhand…I’ve never heard or considered that.

I’ve coached travel ball at different levels for several years and I’ve always taught BEEF (Balance, Elbow, Extension, Follow Through) with the emphasis on B and T.

There was an interesting point that David Thorpe on ESPN made about emphasizing follow through for a jump shooter rather than following the shot. I think it was in reference to Luol Deng sacrificing offensive rebounds to further emphasize finishing his shots. Hold the “goose neck” so to speak.

Interesting stuff though. Bird fundamentally had a difficult shooting style to teach to youngsters, more shooting above his ears rather than off the strong the shoulder…

Love these fundamental discussions though! Thanks, Roy….


You've never heard or considered shooting free throws under hand?  I find this rather difficult to believe. 

I read huzy's comment to mean that he had never heard about the advantages of shooting underhand as described by Larry, i.e., the backspin / deadening of the ball making it more likely to go in.

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Re: Larry Bird on Shooting...
« Reply #18 on: March 06, 2009, 07:42:24 PM »

Offline Roy Hobbs

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So my conclusion, Bird was rightfully known as a 3 point shooter for his day.   Compared to today's NBA, no, but for the NBA he was playing in he took a lot of 3's.  That is why he was considered a 3 point shooter, because he was for his day.


There's no question that Bird was one of the premier three point shooters of his day.  His objection, though, seems to be that some see his legacy as a three point specialist.  That's far from the truth.  The three pointer was just one of many weapons that Bird had in his arsenal.  As he mentioned, the mid-range game was his bread and butter, but he could go inside or outside, as well.

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Re: Larry Bird on Shooting...
« Reply #19 on: March 06, 2009, 08:06:28 PM »

Offline furball

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So my conclusion, Bird was rightfully known as a 3 point shooter for his day.   Compared to today's NBA, no, but for the NBA he was playing in he took a lot of 3's.  That is why he was considered a 3 point shooter, because he was for his day.


There's no question that Bird was one of the premier three point shooters of his day.  His objection, though, seems to be that some see his legacy as a three point specialist.  That's far from the truth.  The three pointer was just one of many weapons that Bird had in his arsenal.  As he mentioned, the mid-range game was his bread and butter, but he could go inside or outside, as well.

Roy is right on with this.  This is what I was trying to say when I mentioned Eddie House and Antione Walker.  Did Bird shoot threes?  Yes.  Was he good at them? Yes.  But it's not what he was.  He was a mid range player that could hit threes. 

Re: Larry Bird on Shooting...
« Reply #20 on: March 06, 2009, 09:18:27 PM »

Offline RAcker

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I love Larry...in a totally heterosexual way of course.   ;)

Re: Larry Bird on Shooting...
« Reply #21 on: March 06, 2009, 09:32:08 PM »

Offline Andy Jick

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I love Larry...in a totally heterosexual way of course.   ;)

i don't know, bro...i told my wife that he may be potentially be the ONLY man i'd go gay for.  :)
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