Refs/Bavetta/Injuries result of bad reffing (merged ref threads)

[huzy]

I’m a certified High School referee and here’s my biggest criticism of Bavetta (Joey Crawford is in the same class)…

Each allows themselves to get caught up in the emotion of the game. Especially in a Utah arena that has an environment similar to a “college crowd” as I think Donnie Marshall stated last night. It’s of utmost importance that an official maintains a level head. This means your calls are based on an objective assessment of a play rather than related in anyway to the atmosphere or emotion of the game.

You can tell just by Bavetta’s demeanor and body language that he makes certain calls that are driven by the game and crown atmosphere. He’s overly animated and prepared to defend himself immediately…not good signs. This is a fatal mistake for any official, and also what makes the job so challenging.

The key thing that any official has to acknowledge is that they are NOT part of the game. That’s why no one should want to make a final call that determines the outcome. Unfortunately, Bavetta enjoys being part of the show….(see: Charles Barkley footrace, ASG 2006)

Unfortunately, this is what tips the scale on the NBA being a league of entertainment rather than objective competition. Everyone wants to shine for the bright lights.  
I don’t want to blow this out of proportion and look at the league as whole. However, my simple point is that Bavetta allows himself, no feeds off of, getting involved in the emotional aspect of the game…which causes a sever disadvantage to one or both of the teams involved.

Officiating 101…control your emotions and stay objective.    

[paintitgreen]

I'm not assuming Bavetta isn't crooked and I certainly don't know, I'm just using what I've seen to reach that conclusion. To me, he is incredibly egotistical and overly influenced by home crowds compared to other officials I've seen. I don't begrudge anybody thinking he's crooked. I just believe professional games aren't fixed by referees in order to get a certain team to win, but to get an over. Bavetta just seems old, incompetent and an attention Edited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline..

LB, I also don't think the second half was about make-up calls. If that's the case, how can you justify that the Celtics were whistled for 4 fouls in the first 3 and a half minutes of the third quarter. As with Pruitt, it seemed that the officials saw a Celtic bench player in at a time when you'd usually have starters and started whistling him for everything. The amount of away-from-the-basket and especially offensive foul calls on the Celtics was ridiculous.

The second half free throw discrepancy to me had more to do with the Celtics attacking the lane more and being so active on the offensive glass. Powe kept getting boards and being in a position where the Jazz had to commit obvious fouls. Even then, on the most important one with a minute to play, the Jazz were allowed to manhandle Powe. The Jazz were still getting all their fouls, they were just off the ball to put Boston in the penalty immediately and on the offensive end. I get that the Celtics set too many moving picks, but there was one called on the Cs right after a play on the other end where Rondo got around a pick by Collins, then Collins moved with Rondo to knock him down and keep him away from WIlliams, so Collins' defender (Powe I think) had to switch onto WIlliams leaving Collins open for an easy layup on a "beautiful, classic Utah pick and roll." If you're gonna keep calling offensive fouls like that on Boston, I just don't see how Utah kept getting away with it. Again, though, it seemed more like home crowd favoritism than corruption. But that's just me.

And again, I can't ignore the fact that while we all care about because we love the Celtics, why would the NBA try to have the outcome of a nationally-televised February game fixed? There's just nothing in it for them.

[cool breeze]

Take from this what you will:
http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/story?id=5065551&page=1

[tgreanier]

Seems about right to me. The Keeper might have a little more meat on his bones.

[Brickowski]

And again, I can't ignore the fact that while we all care about because we love the Celtics, why would the NBA try to have the outcome of a nationally-televised February game fixed? There's just nothing in it for them.

Maybe there was something in it for Bavetta. I have no idea. Assumptions in either direction are just that, assumptions.
 
The NBA standard of officiating is so low that it is almost impossible to spot the crooked ones, and there are certainly enough terrible calls to support the hypothesis that Donaghy wasn't the only dishonest referee.

People tend to focus on the blown calls at the end of a close game.  But the blown calls and non calls in the second and third quarters add up, and can be just as game changing as the officiating at the end of the game.

[crownsy]

Could you not agree with you more.  Bavetta was a joke tonight.  He allowed Harpring to manhandle Pierce to the point where Pierce could not even move to set a pick.  Then, He calls Pierce for an offensive foul when he is trying to discard Harpring from him.  

It was just god awful.  And that call on Pruitt for touching Williams going up the floor is as ticky-tack as you'll ever see.  

espcially since he blatantly did it because gabe complained williams got away with the exact same thing. That was a message foul, and the fact that dick thinks it was ok to "teach a young player a lesson" is why out of the four major sports, the NBA is a joke officating wise.

You know why you can tell its a joke? I know one, mabey two umps by name. same with NFL refs, and its not because there bad, its just because i heard there name somewhere and it stuck. thats the way it should be as cor said, they should be invisable if thier doing there jobs right.


But the NBA? not only do i know 8-12 officials by name, i can tell you what ones tend to screw the home team, what ones tend to favor the away team to prove their impartial, and what ones have ridiculously over the top signaling styles to try to be showman and try to make themselves a part of the game(im looking at you here mostly dick, but joey, your not far behind)

Its sad that my first move when i watch the C's is to look at who the refs are, and more often than not, i can predict the general flow of the calls based on who's the head official. its awful.

[cornbreadsmart]

matt harpring is MADE into a good defensive pplayer by the refs/nba whatever. he's not. how could he be. he has bad foot speed. somehow this guy with bad footspeed can consistently stay in front of paul pierce without help. umm.... noooo. it was the same thing as luke walton. sorry./ i hate to do it but i'm calling race in these circumstances.both these guys SHOULD be very poor defenders.the old clutching grabbing crap went out awhile ago. rule changes were put in place. but they are just completely ignored. bad officiating on perimeter defense i think has been the worst of the worst.i'm heated still from last night's game. but it just makes me feel embarassed as a white guy when i hear what a good defender harpring is, how luke walton has a really high bball iq, how scal is good at the little things.(oh my god no he is ESPECIALLY BAD AT THE LITTLE THINGS!!!,nash getting two straight mvp awards when he was the very worst defensive guard in the entire nba minus dan dickau. just embarassing.

[butterbeanlove]

Just started watching the replay on Tivo, but having said that, based upon the members' comments, this reminds me of the road games at Atlanta in the playoffs.

We drove to the hole and get hammered, so we started "settling for jumpshots." Which a lot of people blamed us for, but I couldn't blame us.

And we couldn't play our defense because they called at least four blocks on blatant charges, mostly involving Posey and Powe I think, that had been charges all year. So we got frustrated.

[butterbeanlove]

I'm going to take Bavetta out for a nice seafood dinner and never call him again.

Too bad Mr. Burns had to steal it from us.

And Deron Williams looks like a gigantic albino mouse.

[butterbeanlove]

Well, would have been nice. At least I don't live in Utah.

[Andy Jick]

look at what bavetta's officiating did to larry miller...










(and it's just a joke, so please don't think i'm being a jerk...)

[liam]

look at what bavetta's officiating did to larry miller...

I was thinking the same thing...








(and it's just a joke, so please don't think i'm being a jerk...)

[liam]

 I'm watching the Houston and Dallas game. I don't care who wins but the calls are as bad as last night. The NBA needs to clean this up maybe add a REF or a Video Ref that watches the game monitors and can overrule really bad calls.

[Andy Jick]

when i was a kid growing up in ohio, we used to have a saying about our then governor: "Dick Celeste before Celeste dicks you..."

change the celeste to bavetta and you get my drift...

[Rondo_is_better]

1. The touch foul on Pruitt mentioned above
2. the no-call on Pruitt's drive right before the touch foul
3. the no-call on Powe's rebound in the last minute
4. the play where Miles stepped out of bounds twice chasing a rebound, didn't re-establish position, then threw it off Pierce with one foot AGAIN out of bounds (all 2-5 feet from Bavetta)
5. Rondo getting knocked over by a big (I think maybe Harpring) on a layup attempt - he made the shot but it was a clear And-1
6. Pierce literally getting shoved into a doubled-over position by Harpring while trying to hold his position (multiple times)
7.Pierce being called for an offensive for bumping Harpring back
8. Collins getting a bogus charge on Pruitt where he was clearly still sliding his feet
9. Williams shoving Eddie House off while driving to the basket
10.  Okur grabbing Scal's arm and flailing into a called 6th foul.

Just a couple quick points - the Powe non-call was by far the worst call because it had such a huge impact on the game since it happened in the final minute. The Pruitt call was a joke, but he did technically put his hand on Williams, the problem is not calling it both ways, which is why the non-call on the preceding drive by Pruitt is much more egregious as well. I like that you pointed out Williams' push off on House. I specifically remember Collins talking about what a strong player Williams is as they showed a replay in which he was clearly giving a full push off with his right hand. Obviously he's gonna power his way to the basket if he's allowed to shove his defender out of the way. Considering the questionable offensive fouls called on the Celtics (I would definitely put the offensive off-the-ball foul called on Powe with less than a minute left in the third on your list - Pierce had a clear path to the basket and Jason Collins just dove to the ground to get a foul call and it worked - that was one even the announcers questioned.)

Here's what was interesting - they were letting everything around the basket go. That's one of the reasons Perk had such a great game. When he's allowed to be physical, he's one of the better centers in the NBA because it becomes [dang] near impossible to score around the basket when he's free to play his game.  But they were calling every touch on the perimeter by the Celtics. Thus, the Jazz end up going to the line from about 5 minutes into each quarter on. Without those constant trips to the free throw line, I don't think the Jazz top 80. The Celtics turned the ball over too much, but I'd say 3-5 of the 19 (against a bad defensive team, that's just unacceptable) were on plays that would have been foul calls at the other end.

It's just frustrating to watch the Celtics play such a fantastic defensive game, they were just on the ball at all times, their rotations were immediate, very few open shots (althought a few open 3s for Okur). The Jazz couldn't get anything going on offense barring the fact that the Celtics were in the penalty halfway through the second, less than four minutes into the third, and halfway through the fourth. But every time the Celtics made a good rotation and stayed on top of guys, they were called for body bumps, etc. It was especially frustrating having just watched a physical Spurs-Pistons game in which both teams had fouls to give in the last seconds of quarters because they were allowed to play a little. It just baffled me to watch the contrast.

From what Donaghy said in his statement was that the refs routinely got orders from above to keep games close or to influence the game so that one team won in order to keep a playoff series going longer or to influence the standings.  Stern supposedly investigated and said there was no evidence of it but what else would he say when it would indict him as well since Donaghy said the orders came from above.  Bavetta was one of the main targets of that investigation since Donaghy cited several games that he supposedly influenced and there was evidence of one sided calls in the games he listed. 

 It could have nothing to do with Bavetta hating the Celtics or the Jazz but it could be to influence the standings.  Stern could want to be sure that the Jazz make the playoffs and is helping them out until they get all their players back.  Or he could be trying to keep the standings as close as possible at the top of the league to make it more exciting down the stretch.  We wouldn't want the Celtics running away with it now, would we?   

I normally am not one for conspiracy theories, but Donaghy had some very good points and he was already convicted and got nothing out of it other than to set the record straight.   What this league needs is a new commissioner.  Stern is as crooked as they come. 

I just really don't think the NBA is running a oonspiracy to decide February games. Whether they would affect playoff series is one thing, to keep them going to increase revenue, that makes some sense, but a non-conference game in February on national TV? Why would they mess with that?

Plus, the thing to remember with Donaghy is that gamblers weren't asking him to fix the game for one team - that is too obvious. A game is "fixed" in that the ref calls way too many fouls to keep sending teams to the line in order to hit the over. Free throws give both teams more points so that you hit the over without directly deciding which team wins the game. And before you ask, the over-under last night was 200, so don't go talking fix.

Last night's officiating problems were not about corruption, they were about incompetence. Lost in the fun and games of Barkley racing Bavetta TWO YEARS AGO was Barkley's point in doing it - if an NBA referee can't outrun an extremely overweight and out-of-shape retired player (who runs backward for some of the time), he should not be in the position of officiating NBA games between world class athletes in peak physical condition. His winning the race even though he looked terribly out of shape should have set off the alarm that Bavetta is too old for this league. He needs not to retire, but to be relieved of his duties.

How about Doc playing Paul like he was playing Captain ball when he was playing cold? Personally, that was the worst call of the night for me.

Yes, that is 100% true and lost in this thread which raises valid points but misses some too.

With the wet ball thing or whatever it was, what's most important about that - far more important than Bavetta being a self-important jerk, which we all knew already - is the fact that it showed Pierce's head was completely out of the game at that point. He even pulled out his old, I'm gonna grab my leg and wince a little to make excuse for missing the first free throw as he walked to the bench for the timeout. He bricked both free throws, then when Perk grabbed the board, just stood there and called for Perk to throw him the ball, completely choreographing it for an easy Jazz steal and dunk. It might be Bavetta's fault that he's a jackass, but it's Pierce's fault that he let it get into his head and affect his team at a time when they really needed him focused.

The free throws or a made shot after the offensive board would have pushed the lead to double digits midway through the third. Instead, turnover and dunk, it's a 7 point game and before you know it 4. After that turnover, Doc should have realized that Pierce's head was not in the game at that moment, and he needed to be pulled out. Give Pierce his 3-5 minutes' rest there, then give Allen his rest when Pierce goes back in, and they'd both be rested and ready for the bulk of the third. Instead he stayed out there and didn't really heat up.

The thing is, it's never just about bad officiating - a good team overcomes bad officiating. Christ, in game 6 of the ECF last year, Salvatore decided it should go seven and made a series of blatantly horrible calls against the Celtics, including the offensive foul on the 3 Pierce made. But the Celtics powered through it by keeping their heads calm, making good decisions, tightening the D, being MORE instead of less aggressive and protecting the ball. They didn't do that last night.

And in the Lakers, Spurs and Jazz losses, what is most concerning to me is that the Celtics are not showing a killer instinct. Not only should they have won all three of those games, but they should have won all three by double digits. But they didn't put the games away when they had the chance. Turnovers, poor shot selection and general sloppy play are killing them when they have 6-10 point leads that should turn into 12-15 point leads instead of evaporating. It's like they think that's enough cushion and lose the intensity, and that, much more than one-sided officiating, is unacceptable. Bad officiating happens sometimes. Bad play shouldn't.

Outstanding post. That is exactly my position-- refs like Bavetta aren't corrupt, they are simply incompetent. The leagues is caught at a crossroads in which the "experienced" group of referees are far too old to manage a game well and the young, up and coming referees are too green and totally, totally unable to ref a game consistently.

Also, a note: bad officiating, while not the sole factor in determining a win or a loss, makes a big difference in deciding the outcome, because while it is all well and good to say that good teams overcome bad officiating, that is an inherently unfair proposition. Games should not be made into more even contests by lopsided refereeing; the games should be called fairly, which would ensure that the better team won a greater percentage of the games. Then again, maybe Stern wants some parody in his league, so he does instruct officials to call games unevenly in order to get everyone closer to the .500 mark. The NFL is a very successful league, and that's largely because of their parody.... some food for thought....