Trade idea that will spark some heat on here...

[Lucky17]

Not a bad idea. Ricky is on short money, and might help provide some scoring for the 2nd unit, assuming he can get healthy. Davis, while less gifted than BBD, is also closer to what we actually need from the bench: size.

Still, if we're trading Tony, who's really our best bench defender, I'd like to get more in return. I have no qualms about trading BBD for either scoring or size.

I think you turn that second unit into a scoring unit vs. a defensive one. They don't have the size or ability to be a great defensive team like the first unit, so why try and pound a square peg into a round hole?! If you can't defend very well, then just outscore the other guys while out there. They try real hard on defense any way, so I am much less concerned about that than the offense drought we have.

I hear what you're saying, but I believe it's more important that our 2nd unit be able to keep a lead than try to make up a deficit. I think it's easier to do that with a primarily defensive-minded bench.

Powe and Allen have the ability to be good defenders. If we could add some length at the wing and frontcourt, I'd be much happier about our chances.

I agree that Powe and Allen are decent defenders, but that is 2 out of 5. The others are too undersized to play defense. I think there is starting to be a big consensus that TA causes more damage than positives, so there would be one less if he was traded out.

If the other squads second unit comes out and puts 25 pts on the board during a game and we play good D and hold them to 18 but can't score more than that ourselves, how is that any different than us coming out and dropping 25-30 on their second unit. All I want from our reserves is to not lose the lead our starters will build on anyone. As long as it is a wash it doesn't matter if it was due to defense or offense. Sure I would love to have a good scoring defender, but teams don't let those go...

I think part of the growing--and not incorrect--criticism of Allen is that, because House needs the ball in someone else's hands to be most effective, TA is handing the ball way more than he should on offense, with poor results. Keeping Pierce out on the floor with those two kind of mitigates against that scenario (as I'm seeing right now with the 2nd quarter). But I digress.

I agree that outgunning the other teams' benches would have the same result as shutting them down. But I think we're actually closer to having the good defensive bench than the high scoring one.

[RebusRankin]

So who's a worse idea Ricky or Marbury?

[greg683x]

So who's a worse idea Ricky or Marbury?

TP.  Great point.

Im not saying I'm in favor of bringing Davis in, but how can the idea of bringing Marbury in be such a back and forth debate, but as soon as Ricky would come up he gets tossed out the window.

At least with Ricky he would be an easier fit at backup SF, rather than having to deal with a Marbury, House, Pruitt, and maybe TA at backup PG/SG.  Not to mention that Marbury, although the better individual player, is obviously much more of a detriment to a team, at least at this point.

[EJPLAYA]

I was at the Bulls Celtics game a few years back (the real snowy night one where a lot of people didn't show) and since no one was there sat 3 rows behind the Celtics bench. Here is what I observed:

When things were going poorly out there PP came back to the bench, bypassed everyone with a nasty pouty look on his face, and went and sat at the end sulking. Ricky on the other hand was giving everyone a pep talk and encouraging them to go out there and give it their best. He was complimenting things that guys were doing vs. whining like a baby. This wasn't meant to slam PP, because I think he has grown up since then, but I never really understood why Ricky got such a bad rap. Yes he was very high strung wanting to win and got a little fiery at times in practice with guys, but it was always being competitive. I don't think throwing him and Marbury in the same sentence is a fair comparison. Marbury is 100% cancer.

[Brendan]

Who cares about attitude, Ricky Davis is a substantially worse player than Tony Allen right now. This idea should not spark heat because its such a bad idea, everyone can agree and say "no".

[Chris]

I think Ricky would be an interesting player on this team, but his health is a problem.  If we are going to be trading Allen and Davis, we need to be getting at least one, and ideally two quality rotation players in return, and Davis is just too much of a questionmark.

[EJPLAYA]

Who cares about attitude, Ricky Davis is a substantially worse player than Tony Allen right now. This idea should not spark heat because its such a bad idea, everyone can agree and say "no".

Ahh... So that whole UBUNTU thing was a waste of time and didn't matter... Attitude means nothing I guess. I'm sure everyone, since you are obviously allowed to speak for everyone, must feel the same way.

[Chris]

Who cares about attitude, Ricky Davis is a substantially worse player than Tony Allen right now. This idea should not spark heat because its such a bad idea, everyone can agree and say "no".

Ahh... So that whole UBUNTU thing was a waste of time and didn't matter... Attitude means nothing I guess. I'm sure everyone, since you are obviously allowed to speak for everyone, must feel the same way.

I agree that attitude is important.  But I also think that this team has a strong enough leadership base to handle a player who is not a great character guy. 

I think Ricky (if he is healthy) would be a great fit for this team, and his personality would likely not be a problem.

[Andy Jick]

ricky davis is a cancer...

...he has so much appeal, always carries that fair contract, and each coach/gm believes that they have the "right environment" for ricky to finally succeed.

...then after a couple months (if even that long) you've seen enough and want to pawn him off to the next fool.

[Who]

Ricky's attitude doesn't concern me greatly .... but I lack confidence in his present ability to play. He was very poor for the Clippers earlier this year. It would be a big risk.

At this point I'd rather stick with Tony.

[cordobes]

The Clippers would get the 2 best players, in my opinion.

[Chris]

ricky davis is a cancer...

...he has so much appeal, always carries that fair contract, and each coach/gm believes that they have the "right environment" for ricky to finally succeed.

...then after a couple months (if even that long) you've seen enough and want to pawn him off to the next fool.

Here is my only question...what good team with leadership has he ever played on? 

He played on a Cavs team where their leader was an 18 year old kid, and was pretty terrible.

He played on a Celtics team that was incredibly mediocre, and who traded away their veteran leadership to get him.

He played on a Minnesota team that was in full tank mode, and were in a general disarray, despite KG's best efforts.

He played on a Miami team that went into full tank mode when they realized their superstar was injured, and the rest of their roster looked like an NBDL all-star team.

Although I agree there may not be much evidence that he is a good character guy, there also is little evidence of him actually being a cancer.  He just is a guy who has never been in a good situation.  There are a ton of guys in the league with similar personalities, but have been lucky to be in the right place at the right time (see Rasheed Wallace, Josh Howard to name a couple).

[Chris]

Ricky's attitude doesn't concern me greatly .... but I lack confidence in his present ability to play. He was very poor for the Clippers earlier this year. It would be a big risk.

At this point I'd rather stick with Tony.

This I can't argue with.  He is not the same player he used to be.

[Finkelskyhook]

Rivers' history with boneheads is so stellar that I would have no problem with this? 

After all, wasn't Ricky the person who Rivers classlessly threw under the bus after we traded him?  I love Ricky's exhuberance and very little else.  For those who want boneheads, I doubt Danny will do it until he has a different coach.

Sad part is that Ricky probably is more talented than Posey and very capable of playing Posey-type defense.  He just is too boneheaded (and too well paid) to participate in winning basketball. 

Ricky makes Tony looks like a laser focus-wise.

[EJPLAYA]

The Clippers would get the 2 best players, in my opinion.

Which is why I think they would pull that deal, but what do we get? We get a 6-7 guy who can score at will when given the green light without committing as many turnovers and boneheaded moves on the offensive end. He also passes the ball better, actually kicks the ball out to a shooter like House when he penetrates, and has the size to give them someone who can legitimately guard the 3 spot. He may not be as good a defender as TA, but I don't recall him being a bad one. Paul Davis also has the size and athletic ability to be able to help down low that BBD doesn't.

This move would be only about helping this second unit allow us to win #18. Not a long term good move by any stretch. There may be other similar guys that we could get with that package that would be a better fit, so let's hear them.