Author Topic: Breaking News: Allen Iverson for Chauncey Billups deal to go down  (Read 40128 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Re: Breaking News: Allen Iverson for Chauncey Billups deal to go down
« Reply #30 on: November 03, 2008, 12:44:08 PM »

Offline wdleehi

  • In The Rafters
  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 34023
  • Tommy Points: 1607
  • Basketball is Newtonian Physics
I think it's important to note that Iverson can play defense when the mood strikes him. He did for Larry Brown in Phily. Put him in a tough Detroit squad full of capable defensive players and he could raise his D in a big way. Iverson has been dogging it for the last few years on the defensive end, but he is a capable defensive player.


He played the passing lanes.  Philly had defensive players at every other position and a big shot blocker (ratlif then Mutumbo) to cover for AI.  

It worked in the weak east then.  It hasn't worked since.  Certainly not going to work against Boston who has guys that will hurt them if they have to scramble to cover for AI playing the passing lanes.

Re: Breaking News: Allen Iverson for Chauncey Billups deal to go down
« Reply #31 on: November 03, 2008, 12:44:57 PM »

Offline GroverTheClover

  • Bill Walton
  • *
  • Posts: 1296
  • Tommy Points: 167
At best, this is a sideways move for Detriot and Denver. Neither team got better as a result.

Re: Breaking News: Allen Iverson for Chauncey Billups deal to go down
« Reply #32 on: November 03, 2008, 12:53:56 PM »

Online CelticsWhat35

  • Jim Loscutoff
  • **
  • Posts: 2904
  • Tommy Points: 353
I'm not afraid of the team it makes Detroit this season.  I think they take a step back, actually.  But with all the cap space they'll have for either this summer or next, they could be big players in getting some good free agents.  That's my only concern.

Re: Breaking News: Allen Iverson for Chauncey Billups deal to go down
« Reply #33 on: November 03, 2008, 12:55:40 PM »

Offline moiso

  • Tiny Archibald
  • *******
  • Posts: 7640
  • Tommy Points: 441
I think this improves Detroit a lot.  Iverson is a much better fit with this squad.  I also think Billups is declining faster than AI.  Billups couldn't guard the quick points.
I can't believe Denver didn't try to get one of Detroit's good young players.  Denver is a mess and their future doesn't look very bright.

Re: Breaking News: Allen Iverson for Chauncey Billups deal to go down
« Reply #34 on: November 03, 2008, 12:58:57 PM »

Offline cordobes

  • NCE
  • Ray Allen
  • ***
  • Posts: 3556
  • Tommy Points: 576
  • Basketball is like chess, only without the dice
I like this move for Denver. They haven't had a true PG for in a long time. Detroit is scary with AI.

i dont know, see above. are they really that scary with a guy who doesn't really move the ball in offenseive sets? (and i love AI, but PG has never been a strength of his)

remeber, rip needs a pass first PG like billups or stucky to be truley effective. he struggles to set up hs own shot, he's much, much better at moving off the ball and catching the pass from his PG.

the only way this would really make me go "oh bleep" is if AI says "ya, stucky is a better true PG than me for this team, and rip needs a true PG to set up his offense, so i'm cool being the 6th man"

that is scary, because AI would tourch second units. He'd be liek the eastern conferance manu. that would scare me.

The AI/rip paring for 30+ a night, not so much.

Oh, I'm pretty sure that by the end of the regular season, Stuckey will be playing starter minutes at the PG.

I think Dumars did well, Billups is not the guy who was able to hold Jason Kidd scoreless anymore and he still has four years in his contract.

is that goign to sit well with two guys who have massive Ego's?

thats my question, the smart move is to start stuckey. Neither Rip or A.I is going to want to be the bench player. That could lead to the dreaded "locker room unrest"

I think both stars will be the starters, just saying that Stuckey will be getting 33-35 mpg as long as he keeps playing well and improving.

Who starts is not that important.

Re: Breaking News: Allen Iverson for Chauncey Billups deal to go down
« Reply #35 on: November 03, 2008, 01:04:09 PM »

Offline wdleehi

  • In The Rafters
  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 34023
  • Tommy Points: 1607
  • Basketball is Newtonian Physics
I think this improves Detroit a lot.  Iverson is a much better fit with this squad.  I also think Billups is declining faster than AI.  Billups couldn't guard the quick points.
I can't believe Denver didn't try to get one of Detroit's good young players.  Denver is a mess and their future doesn't look very bright.


How? 

Detroit is a defensive team known for sharing.


AI is selfish player that doesn't play good defense.


Billups was a leader on a team that has been to the conference finals 5 straight years (is my number correct?)

AI has been a leader of a team losing in the 1st round every year recently.

Re: Breaking News: Allen Iverson for Chauncey Billups deal to go down
« Reply #36 on: November 03, 2008, 01:05:24 PM »

Online Who

  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 47135
  • Tommy Points: 2401
I think it's important to note that Iverson can play defense when the mood strikes him. He did for Larry Brown in Phily. Put him in a tough Detroit squad full of capable defensive players and he could raise his D in a big way. Iverson has been dogging it for the last few years on the defensive end, but he is a capable defensive player.
He played the passing lanes.  Philly had defensive players at every other position and a big shot blocker (ratlif then Mutumbo) to cover for AI.  

It worked in the weak east then.  It hasn't worked since.  Certainly not going to work against Boston who has guys that will hurt them if they have to scramble to cover for AI playing the passing lanes.
Iverson did more than play the passing lanes. It wasn't a constant but he did play good all round defense at times under Larry Brown. He's capable of being a good defender.

I remember games where Iverson held Kobe to something like 10 points and 30% shooting (Kobe did the same to him). The season they made the finals he played quality defense, especially the first half of that season (before a larger offensive burden was on his shoulders).

I'm not a fan of Iverson, I think he's overrated as a player and that he does a lot of things that hurts his teams. But I also think it's important to say he's capable of playing good defense and has done so in the past .... and that it's premature to write him off defensively before he suits up for the Pistons. He might surprise us and start putting effort in on that side of the floor once again.

Iverson is capable of playing good defense when he puts his mind to it ... which does not happen nearly often enough.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2008, 01:10:48 PM by Who »

Re: Breaking News: Allen Iverson for Chauncey Billups deal to go down
« Reply #37 on: November 03, 2008, 01:05:45 PM »

Offline Kwhit10

  • Antoine Walker
  • ****
  • Posts: 4257
  • Tommy Points: 923
Technically AI/Rip/Stuckey can get 32 minutes each between the guard positions, but I doubt that's how it will work.

This just seems like one of those trades where they were bored and wanted to see what would happen with aging stars.

Re: Breaking News: Allen Iverson for Chauncey Billups deal to go down
« Reply #38 on: November 03, 2008, 01:07:50 PM »

Offline moiso

  • Tiny Archibald
  • *******
  • Posts: 7640
  • Tommy Points: 441
wide load- I meant that iverson fits better with the pistons than he did on Denver.  The Carmelo/AI pairing was horrible.

Re: Breaking News: Allen Iverson for Chauncey Billups deal to go down
« Reply #39 on: November 03, 2008, 01:07:56 PM »

Offline KCattheStripe

  • Danny Ainge
  • **********
  • Posts: 10726
  • Tommy Points: 830
I think this improves Detroit a lot.  Iverson is a much better fit with this squad.  I also think Billups is declining faster than AI.  Billups couldn't guard the quick points.
I can't believe Denver didn't try to get one of Detroit's good young players.  Denver is a mess and their future doesn't look very bright.


How? 

Detroit is a defensive team known for sharing.


AI is selfish player that doesn't play good defense.


Billups was a leader on a team that has been to the conference finals 5 straight years (is my number correct?)

AI has been a leader of a team losing in the 1st round every year recently.

6. Personally, I think this makes Denver better. A) it gives them a solid defender, lord knows they needed one. B) It moves JR Smith to the starting 2 spot and gives them an upgrade at the 1. McDyess is still a solid player and can serve a role for them off the bench. It also gives Denver leadership where it didn't have it before. I like it. If nothing else, George Karl will be happy.

Re: Breaking News: Allen Iverson for Chauncey Billups deal to go down
« Reply #40 on: November 03, 2008, 01:09:55 PM »

Offline wdleehi

  • In The Rafters
  • James Naismith
  • *********************************
  • Posts: 34023
  • Tommy Points: 1607
  • Basketball is Newtonian Physics
wide load- I meant that iverson fits better with the pistons than he did on Denver.  The Carmelo/AI pairing was horrible.


I think Billups is a better fit with the Pistons then AI. 

Re: Breaking News: Allen Iverson for Chauncey Billups deal to go down
« Reply #41 on: November 03, 2008, 01:10:52 PM »

Offline guava_wrench

  • Satch Sanders
  • *********
  • Posts: 9931
  • Tommy Points: 777
Chauncey is reaching the point where his value is going down but his contract is going up. It makes sense to trade him while he still has value if they do not want to be stuck with his contract.

I do not agree that AI is a coach killer or selfish. AI no longer complains about practices. He has clearly matured. He is also a scorer. Scorers shoot a lot. I do not see this selfishness. AI has always been driven to win, not to show off. The question is whether he can fit into a Detroit system that will also take advantage of Rip's scoring style.

I don't get the fixation crownsy has with who is the 6th man. It really doesn't matter much. It is hard to argue that stuckey has shown enough to put players like Rip or AI on the bench.

Re: Breaking News: Allen Iverson for Chauncey Billups deal to go down
« Reply #42 on: November 03, 2008, 01:11:05 PM »

Offline moiso

  • Tiny Archibald
  • *******
  • Posts: 7640
  • Tommy Points: 441
Denver traded for 2 fading veterans.  Billups is supposed to guard Tony Parker and Chris Paul, etc?  I think they could have done better than those two.  Even if they took Billups and someone like Amir Johnson, that would have been better for them in the long term.

Re: Breaking News: Allen Iverson for Chauncey Billups deal to go down
« Reply #43 on: November 03, 2008, 01:13:57 PM »

Offline moiso

  • Tiny Archibald
  • *******
  • Posts: 7640
  • Tommy Points: 441
I'm just glad that the C's didn't trade for AI a couple years ago. 

Re: Breaking News: Allen Iverson for Chauncey Billups deal to go down
« Reply #44 on: November 03, 2008, 01:15:24 PM »

Offline houlana

  • Al Horford
  • Posts: 412
  • Tommy Points: 21
i understand that AI doesnt play D guys, but detroit has always been a great defensive team. they never had the guy the can create ofense for himself. i just think that what ever he lacks on D, he will make up for it and more by scoring.