Delonte West battling depression

[LarBrd33]

Nick -  Once again, thanks.  I appreciate the comments/information/suggestions.  I know this thread was supposed to be about Delonte, but I'm really glad about the direction it has taken.  This stuff with my friend has really been bothering me.  I remember when his girlfriend desperately texted me that he was having some kind of breakdown and she didn't know what to do.  I actually left work early so I could go see how severe it was.   Four hours later we were bowling and celebrating a mutual friend's birthday.  He seemed to be in good spirits.   A day later... he was having another episode.  He tells me that he took medication a while ago and that a lot of the meds were still in experimental stages.  His hope is that some progression has happened since.  Part of the reason he's moving is so that he can be with his family, see about medication and try to get a handle on the situation.  I'm supporting him in every way I can. 

KungPow -  Everyone is kinda giving you crap right now, but I sorta get what you're trying to say.  We obviously don't know what Delonte's situation is.  In theory, a bipolar disorder probably isn't going to prevent someone from playing basketball.  My friend hosts and organizes a standup comedy show every Thursday night at a club.  Despite his recent depression, he was still able to muster up the ability to perform his comedy act.  He's severely depressed and cancelled all the shows he wasn't obligated to do, but that Thursday show was his "baby" and he couldn't abandon it.  He started the thing from scratch.  People depended on him.  So I watched as he went up there and made a room full of people laugh acting like this zanny, happy, funloving character.  Nobody in the audience knew what he was going through.  Nobody realized that later that night he'd be drinking himself stupid for no logical reason.  The definition of "sad clown", I guess.  But he's been "sucking it up" for a while now.  Avoiding medication obviously isn't an option for him anymore... so he handed the Thursday show off to someone else, booked a ticket back home and is going to try and get some help.  ----  It's possible that Delonte's situation is similar.   He had a serious episode and needed to get it straightened out immediately.  Better that he does it in preseason and not when the games count.  He's back with the team now and fulfilling his obligation.   There is a lot more information posted in the recent ESPN article:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3649328

"I felt a feeling of anger and I just wanted to throw it all away and quit the team," he said.

The 25-year-old candidly discussed his condition following practice on Friday. West said he had been troubled by his behavior toward a high school referee during a scrimmage at the Cavs' training facility on Oct. 3. West took out his frustrations on the official, and said the incident was a warning signal for him to seek treatment to combat an illness that has troubled him for years.

"I needed help," he said.

West is taking medication and has been attending therapy sessions.

"In a sense, you feel like a weaker man because you have to raise your hand and ask for help," West said. "But I found out over the last week that it made me a stronger person. I came back focused, and with the help of some medicine and talking with people on a regular basis, I'm back in good spirits.

"I'm back here 100 percent."

West said his mood problems date to his childhood. He has always been able to find peace in the gym, but he has struggled with relationships away from the floor.

West said his mood swings seem to be most erratic when his life seems to be in order.

"When everything is on the upside, I'm feeling the worst," said West, who thanked his teammates, including LeBron James, for their support while he was away.

"This is the epitome of a family organization," he said. "I want to go to war for these people. I would die for them, I really mean that."

Cavaliers coach Mike Brown wasn't surprised to hear that West was open about discussing his condition.

"He's a good guy," Brown said. "He's a trustworthy guy and forthright."

West said he's not concerned about any outside perception about his condition and he's not worried about what others think about him.

"Only God is my judge," he said. "All that matters is how I feel about myself."

Those quotes really sound so much like what my friend is going through.  It's interesting that they are both going through it at the exact same time.   He even mentions that his mood seems to be lowest when things are going the best ... which is so much like my friend.  In the 3 years I've known this guy, this was by far the best situation he had been in.  Great girlfriend, great apartment, great job, great comedy gig, great friends, etc.  He was even recently approached by an agent who wants to represent him.  All things considered, it should have been the happiest he's been in years, but clearly his condition isn't allowing it. 

Good luck to everyone dealing with this.

And Brickjames - That comment was insensitive and ignorant, but I'm not going to lie... it made me laugh.  And then I felt guilty.  But way to break up the kumbaya.  I guess someone had to say it.       

[BrickJames]

just doin' what i do...

[celticmaestro]

Definitely a surprise, he's dealt with it well so far. I hope he sorts himself out and doesn't do a Deisler (for those who don't know, Sebastian Deisler was a hugely talented German footballer who retired due to his depression).

[kamakawiwaole]

in regards to kung pao chicken's comments or whatever...i think the bottom line is...

you aren't delonte. you don't know what he is going through...you have no idea how he feels, no matter how much you've personally experienced yourself or have learnt through your university studies. 

one of the biggest problems in our world is that too often, we as individuals think we can understand one another, when in essence we don't at all.  i know from experience, whether through myself, friends or family, I simply can't experience one thing the same as another.

we all face challenges... whether physical or mental, but the biggest challenge is to break free from arrogance & ignorance and understand I am me & you are you.  I'll never experience what you do, and you'll never experience what I do.  those differences are what is most beautiful, tragic & important.  it is the awareness of that which should be embraced, especially in your case.

[bucknersrevenge]

Not that I think this is anywhere near the sole reason but I don't think Delonte has been right since we trade him. I think he REALLY wanted to be here an watching us win it all last year without him really hurt and he said as much in a recent interview.

[gar]

Unfortunately, many people are taking general truths from my post out of context. I never diagnosed Delonte in my post, nor was that ever my intention. The point of my original post was that it is important for Cleveland to know the severity of Delonte's illness. It is important for Cleveland to know from a business perspective. I agree 100% that if Delonte has taken a leave of absence from a game that he loves, I assume his depression has escalated to a very debilitating point.

In regards to my comment of  "in my opinion he could be on the court right now if he truly wanted to." The meaning was that depression is not going severely attack a hosts body to prevent normal physiological functioning. I wrote that sentence in sequential order after I talked about depression myths. One of the myths being that some people believe a person who is depressed is a complete tortured soul. Depression does not attack a body harshly enough to prevent someone from playing basketball. To illustrate an example, Late stage cancer, and late stage AIDS are progressive diseases that would prevent someone from playing basketball if left untreated. Depression would never prevent someone from physically playing basketball. However, it is fair to assume that Delonte is dealing with a profound case of depression. His case is bad enough that a mental barrier is preventing him from doing something he loves. What is not preventing him is his lungs, heart, brain, ect. That is what was meant by that comment. I certainly did not intend to make a diagnosis on whether he was mentally with it to play basketball. That is why it is so important for Cleveland to know the intricacies of Delonte's situation. And, I am sure that Cleveland is well informed on his status. But, my whole point was that depression is not going to severely eat away at Delonte physically. Philosophically speaking, depression could never stop anyone from playing basketball.

I do not want to give the impression that there are no physiological or physical side effects of depression. Because there are certainly many ailments that accompany depression. But none of these effects are debilitating enough to physically prevent someone from playing basketball. Unless the depression helps accelerate another problem. A simple example would be anxiety contributing to high blood pressure and heart disease. But that is much too complicated to get into here. And depression is never solely to blame in cases like the one from above.

Again KPC, I have to disagree. Depression has everything to do with energy levels, with decision making ability, with concentration, with confidence all of which are very much apart of any game. The Mind/Body split you seem to be advocating is not a main stream scientific thinking. The two are interconnected in ways we are only beginning to understand. As for the individual motivation issue. If depression was not such an deceptive internal condition people would deal with it before it got to the point where they needed help; but it is clear that many people fall into it unexpectedly and need a great deal of help before they get to the point where they can take real responsibility for their moods. Ultimately that is the goal. But it is not an easily attainable goal for many and the temptations for falling back into the bad mental and behavioral patterns that led to the problem in the first place mean that, for many, they are not able to function at anywhere close to their normal level with out substantial intervention of some kind.

[bbc3341]

I don't normally disclose this, but I mean I'm known on here as bbc3341 so what the heck... I am bi-polar and have been on medication and in counseling for over 10 years. I've been on 8 different medications and finally have one that works. During this time I've held jobs and been in and out of colleges. When on medication that only somewhat works, I function fine, though I have mood swings. On this current medication I have no highs and the lows are nothing... However, when I wasn't on medication, the lows were such that I wasn't able to keep jobs, stay in school, etc. I got a lot of "just do it you lazy slug" and things like that, and I even believed it, that I was a loser - then I got on the medication. Because I'm not a genius, I went of the meds "just to see" and it was a wake up call. It's real. I don't know what Delonte's situation is like, but if his lows were anything like mine, I get how it might affect his game...

[Bankshot]

Not that I think this is anywhere near the sole reason but I don't think Delonte has been right since we trade him. I think he REALLY wanted to be here an watching us win it all last year without him really hurt and he said as much in a recent interview.

I agree, except it started when he lost his starting job to Telfair and then Rondo.  I have said plenty of times that he didn't appear to be a team player and pouted, especially when Rondo got the bulk of playing time.  People said I was saying it because I didn't like him, but that was not true (true that I wasn't a fan, but I did really think he wasn't happy about no longer starting).

EDIT:  And then he once again after starting for Cleveland and doing an ok job, lost his starting job, when Cleveland made their most recent trade.

I do wish him well though and hope he gets better.

[cdif911]

what a fascinating topic...

first off BBC and Nick - kudos for disclosure, I grew up in a household where my mother was bi-polar, it rarely kicked in, but when it did, it was tough...

I actually coach a kid who was diagnosed, and as an athlete he is struggling mightily with control issues - I have taught kids w/ it as well, and there are definitely triggers, but it is something that it seems like as the kids learn more about themselves and seek therapy/medication they do improve - same was the case with my mother - my great grandmother actually had what I'm sure was bi-polar disorder, but it was before they really knew alot so she was in Danvers State... sad stuff

on the Delonte topic, hoopshype had a descent read on mental problems w/ prof. athletes - http://blogs.hoopshype.com/blogs/smith/2008/10/19/coming-out-a-hard-thing-to-do/ worth the read if you have the time

[TradeProposalDude]

Honestly, I wish the best of luck for Delonte in his road for recovery.

I don't know Delonte any more than the average person on here, so I will refrain from looking for reasons as to why he may have acquired this mood disorder.

Although I do find it curious - does anybody think that his somewhat hilarious yet strange way of talking and conversational style have anything to do with his mood? Again, he's a great guy either way. Just curious.

[angryguy77]

KPC
What your facing is not smart remarks but just a case of PC overreaction. You cant go against the grain on this and express a differing opinion because thats make you"judgmental" and "insensitive". I don't understand what he has to say to make his point more clear. Depression will not hold your body down. You may not want to get out of bed, there is no denying that, but if you force yourself to get up, your body will respond. That is what he was trying to say in the body of his text. But you all had to jump the guy for stating an opinion that makes sense in a lot of ways. Im not going to say how bad he is, but I agree that if I were the Cavs I would be pretty peeved and wonder why now. As a professional, he has to take some responsability and get the help he needs and not wait until the last minute. 

If a drug addicts and alcoholics can preform on the court or field physicaly (Micheal Irvin), then so can a guy thats sick from depression.

[nickagneta]

KPC
What your facing is not smart remarks but just a case of PC overreaction. You cant go against the grain on this and express a differing opinion because thats make you"judgmental" and "insensitive". I don't understand what he has to say to make his point more clear. Depression will not hold your body down. You may not want to get out of bed, there is no denying that, but if you force yourself to get up, your body will respond. That is what he was trying to say in the body of his text. But you all had to jump the guy for stating an opinion that makes sense in a lot of ways. Im not going to say how bad he is, but I agree that if I were the Cavs I would be pretty peeved and wonder why now. As a professional, he has to take some responsability and get the help he needs and not wait until the last minute. 

If a drug addicts and alcoholics can preform on the court or field physicaly (Micheal Irvin), then so can a guy thats sick from depression.

You are right. People with depression can perform. But when a depression occurs it is nearly impossible for a person to perform at normal capacities or at all. I am sure their are athletes with diabetes. They stay regimented, take their insulin and everything is okay. But the can have severe problems occur because of the diabetes that could render them incapable of playing.

Drug addiction and alcoholism is much the same way. If a drug addict is using eventually it will effect their performance and render them incapable of doing their job. They can't do it while under the influence but even while using or drinking only at times where they are sober during games, it will eventually effect them.

Depression is a disease like any other. The problem is that it might be one of the least understood diseases there are. Hence, an individual's severity and history should be known before jumping to conclusions. I think that's what people were trying to point out to KPC.

[cdif911]

KPC
What your facing is not smart remarks but just a case of PC overreaction. You cant go against the grain on this and express a differing opinion because thats make you"judgmental" and "insensitive". I don't understand what he has to say to make his point more clear. Depression will not hold your body down. You may not want to get out of bed, there is no denying that, but if you force yourself to get up, your body will respond. That is what he was trying to say in the body of his text. But you all had to jump the guy for stating an opinion that makes sense in a lot of ways. Im not going to say how bad he is, but I agree that if I were the Cavs I would be pretty peeved and wonder why now. As a professional, he has to take some responsability and get the help he needs and not wait until the last minute. 

If a drug addicts and alcoholics can preform on the court or field physicaly (Micheal Irvin), then so can a guy thats sick from depression.

I don't think its a matter of being PC, and if you think someone with an alcohol dependency can perform, I ask you to look at one Vin Baker - how'd that work out for him?  - I can understand the frustration the Cavs must feel that all of a sudden (or so we're led to believe) this condition pops out, but that does happen sometimes, something behavioral may cause something neurobiological to unlock, and once its out, it becomes very difficult to control - I've seen it with more than one student.  Its not that we're trying to be PC, its that when someone says something ignorant, it should be called out - its like if someone argued that Drapetomania existed, when we now know scientifically that it was made up, its not that we're being PC, its just that we're better informed

[cavman]

kinda late to the discussion, and only read the last page.

Depression is not merely an "emotional" disorder.  It is a mood disorder with physiological causes.  Some people have a genetic predisposition to depression under stress.

Bipolar Disorder is also a mood disorder with physiological causes.

No 2 depressed people are the same, nor aree 2 bipolar people.  They differ in terms of severity and duration.  A mildly depressed person could play basketball, though it would affect his performance.  A severely depressed person probably would not.

All you need is one manic episode to be diagnosed as bipolar.  I've seen people who struggle more with depression and others who struggle more with the mania.  The mania often leads to self-destructive, risky behavior.  Such people can often self-medicate (ei: drink too much, since alcohol is a depressant).  Those who struggle with mania are more likely to resist treatment because the mania feels so good.  Their relationships issues stem from unreliability.  Those struggling with depression often struggle relationally, for different reasons.

Whatever Delonte has, at times it does affect his ability to play.  I'm glad he got help, and continues in that process to talking thru his stress and taking the meds needed to get his brain chemistry balanced.  Both are important.

[angryguy77]

what did he say that was ignorant? I believe that he explained himself pretty good except that his words are being taken out of context. Now I know that this is a serious illness that can affect people in many ways. But I also think that depression can be used as a scapgoat and doesn't make people face the problems in their lives. Meds are being handed out like candy these days by "informed people" and people are not being forced to deal with life. My mother in law mother was given pill after pill for depression and not one of them helped. She was a zombie and ultimatly took her own life. Instead, these perscriptions and therapy did nothing but perpetuate her problems, many of which were self created. Now if she had to face life head on and was forced to provide for herself and be accountable for her actions, she might be alive today. But I can say the road these doctors put her on didn't work.

Now I don't know what the deal is with DW. I'm not going to judge him. I wish him well and hope he's able to get his life back together.
But one thing is clear, every diagnosis made and theory as to why deprssion happens may not entirly be correct.
So when a guy has a differing opinion, lets not crucify him and jump on the "I'm more caring train" but realize that theories are not proven and there are different sides to every issue.