Dream Trade Proposal: Ray + Young Chips For Carmelo /Hunter/Filler

[soap07]

Soap, they weren't favored because they had inferior talent.  They weren't favored because their top 3 offensive players have zero character and infinite selfishness between them. 

On this note, what team did the Nuggets face that they were more talented than?

[soap07]

also, it doesnt impress me that you qouted a figure he donated to charity while blatantly ignoring my question about his DWI and the fact that your only defense of it for him so far is "but other people do it to" a horrid reason to defened someone for getting behind the wheel fo a car drunk.

Let me address this: It's not so much that it's a minor incident - the issue here is how much is "off-the-court" habits would affect his on-the-court play. The reason I bring up Posey is because he was fine on the court in spite of his DUI. I think it speaks more to Carmelo's character that he gives to others so much.

And the "alleged" drug problem, can you prove that he has a drug problem before using it against him? He was caught with less than one OUNCE of marijuana which wasn't even proved to be his.


Here is what we KNOW about Carmelo:
1. He got a DWI last year.
2. He threw a punch during a brawl against the Knicks.

Wow, please let's not have this guy on our team.

[Finkelskyhook]

also, it doesnt impress me that you qouted a figure he donated to charity while blatantly ignoring my question about his DWI and the fact that your only defense of it for him so far is "but other people do it to" a horrid reason to defened someone for getting behind the wheel fo a car drunk.

Let me address this: It's not so much that it's a minor incident - the issue here is how much is "off-the-court" habits would affect his on-the-court play. The reason I bring up Posey is because he was fine on the court in spite of his DUI. I think it speaks more to Carmelo's character that he gives to others so much.

And the "alleged" drug problem, can you prove that he has a drug problem before using it against him? He was caught with less than one OUNCE of marijuana which wasn't even proved to be his.


Here is what we KNOW about Carmelo:
1. He got a DWI last year.
2. He threw a punch during a brawl against the Knicks.

Wow, please let's not have this guy on our team.

I couldn't agree more with your last sentiment, soap.

This is a pretty good comparison. Especially considering that in Rider's 9 year career, he made the playoffs 3 times and in Carmelo's 5 year career, he's been in the playoffs 5 times. Rider with his 17 PPG career average really is an appropriate comparison for Carmelo. Wow, stretch much?

Actually it isn't a stretch at all.  Both have an inability to stay out of trouble.  Both are immense talents who are never going to sniff a championship.  Rider's last few years of his career brought his scoring average down.   Unless Anthony develops a work ethic, a team mentality, suddenly acts like a grownup, ([dang]ed near impossible with Smith, Iverson, and Martin as teammates) nd suddenly discovers that there is a defensive end of a basketball court, he'll be a much wealthier version of Rider.  But he will parallel Rider's NBA legacy. 

I predict he'll do none of those things.  Because Denver or some other team will continue to throw multi-millions at him.  No need to improve.

[johnnyrondo]

Just off the top of my head, I remember Bird fighting Kareem and Dr. J, I remember Parish decking Laimbeer, I remember McHale clotheslining Rambis, and I remember Ainge getting into it with Tree Rollins. The fact that Carmelo got into a fight is not a big deal imo. Fwiw, Carmelo was praised a great deal by USA basketball for his effort with them. This trade would NEVER happen, so don't worry about it. If Denver was going to trade a superstar who is just entering his prime, they wouldn't be taking back a 33 yr old. I don't think they'd even make the trade if Ray was the same age.

Carmelo is a young franchise player. Ray has almost always been more of a good second or third option (Bucks and C's). For a while he was the first option on the Sonics, but that team wasn't too good. And for the record, people criticize Carmelo for not making it to the 2nd round of the playoffs, but didn't it take Pierce and KG a while to even make the playoffs? I'm not even a Carmelo fan, but people are seriously underrating him with regards to this trade.

[Finkelskyhook]

Just off the top of my head, I remember Bird fighting Kareem and Dr. J, I remember Parish decking Laimbeer, I remember McHale clotheslining Rambis, and I remember Ainge getting into it with Tree Rollins. The fact that Carmelo got into a fight is not a big deal imo. Fwiw, Carmelo was praised a great deal by USA basketball for his effort with them. This trade would NEVER happen, so don't worry about it. If Denver was going to trade a superstar who is just entering his prime, they wouldn't be taking back a 33 yr old. I don't think they'd even make the trade if Ray was the same age.

Carmelo is a young franchise player. Ray has almost always been more of a good second or third option (Bucks and C's). For a while he was the first option on the Sonics, but that team wasn't too good. And for the record, people criticize Carmelo for not making it to the 2nd round of the playoffs, but didn't it take Pierce and KG a while to even make the playoffs? I'm not even a Carmelo fan, but people are seriously underrating him with regards to this trade.

I think the problem, Johnny, is that Anthony's "punch" was a pansy-laden sucker punch after which he ran for his life.

To put Carmelo Anthony in the same post as Bird, Erving, Parish, Lambeer, McHale, Rambis, or Ainge is ludicrous.  They are all champions.  Anthony will never even carpetbag his way there.

Anthony compares more to a Shareef Abdur-Rahim talent-wise.  Another immense offensive talent who acted like the defensive end of the court had some kind of maloderous existence.  Except Abdur-Rahim had no character issues.  Anthony is a walking character issue.  Players like Anthony will make big bucks and never amount to anything more than a great draw.  They're too selfish.

Pierce and Garnett were both solid defenders at one time or another in their careers.  Garnett his whole career.  Pierce his career pre-Rivers and for Thibodeau.  Anthony's defensive fundamentals, not to mention his effort, has never been more than a joke.  Johnny, he doesn't bother to try.  He was trying during the olympics.  But he's never had to defend at any level and it showed.

As we found out with Pierce defensively during Rivers' first three seasons, when the best player doesn't try, neither does the rest of the team. 

Hopefully you're right that we'll never see Anthony in green.

[soap07]

I think the problem, Johnny, is that Anthony's "punch" was a pansy-laden sucker punch after which he ran for his life.

No, he backed away because he realized what he had done and didn't want to escalate it more.


To put Carmelo Anthony in the same post as Bird, Erving, Parish, Lambeer, McHale, Rambis, or Ainge is ludicrous.  They are all champions.  Anthony will never even carpetbag his way there.

This coming from the same person who put Carmelo Anthony in the same sentence as JR Rider and Shareef Abdur Raheem.

Anthony compares more to a Shareef Abdur-Rahim talent-wise.  Another immense offensive talent who acted like the defensive end of the court had some kind of maloderous existence.  Except Abdur-Rahim had no character issues.  Anthony is a walking character issue.  Players like Anthony will make big bucks and never amount to anything more than a great draw.  They're too selfish.

I've asked you this direct question and you haven't answered: What evidence do you have of Carmelo's selfishneses? You are aware that Carmelo in his short career has already had more playoff appearances than Abdur Rahim? Are you choosing to be facetious?

Anthony is a walking character issue.

All these baseless claims. What are you talking about?

[guava_wrench]

I still remember his quote during this past playoffs after getting eliminated and saying how offense always beats defense.

The guy, deep down, is not really interested in defense.

[johnnyrondo]

You are aware that Carmelo in his short career has already had more playoff appearances than Abdur Rahim?

EVERYONE makes the playoffs more than Abdur-Rahim. He held the record for this. 

[crownsy]

If you don't think drunk driving is a minor offense, then don't down play it like people are idiots to mention it as a serious character flaw. to me, getting drunk and driving a car is reckless endangerment, and a huge issue.

and again, i could care less that james posey did it, your assumption that I didn't think his DWI was a big deal is false.

and yes, im sorry getting caught with less than a ounce of weed when your 22 years old is pretty good evidence its not your first time around the merry go round with that particular substance.

if you think its not a big deal, thats another issue, and one i have my own beliefs on we can't discuss on the blog, but lets not act like suddenly at the age of 22 melo decided "hey you know what would be fun! smoking pot! WOOOOO lets do it!"

if you want to argue weed's not a drug problem, alright, i can see that has some merit, but don't try to sell me on the fariy tale that melo randomly decided to try pot for the first time and got caught, it's ludicrous.

[cordobes]

Carmelo Anthony is indeed a bad defensive player, no question. Still, I think he gets more heat than he deserves to because Denver gets an undeserved bad reputation of being a bad defensive team, that they are not.

OTOH, although I don't like a bit his offensive game (too kobesque and based on 1vs1 moves), he's a really impressive scorer. However, and despite of considering him an elite offensive player, his off-the-court distractions and the fact that he frequently looks uncommitted in terms of hustling and defense, arise serious questions about how much of his undeniable talent will translate into wins.

But I think it would be worth the risk, in abstract. There's an unsurmountable problem when it comes to this particular trade, though: we already have Pierce to play his position. Ray Allen+Pierce>Pierce+Carmelo and it's not even that close. And Denver would never do this, anyway.


soap07,

Watch a few Nuggets games and count how many times Carmelo is the last guy to arrive back to the defensive end. It's despairing. If that's not laziness, what is it?

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Btw, when has Ray Allen started to be seen as a onedimensional player who can't defend? Of course that he doesn't attack the rim so often as he used to and he's not the elite defender he was with the Bucks (but he's still good, much, much better than Anthony), but he's still an elite shooter who can do a lot of things when his shots aren't falling and provide above average defense.

[RebusRankin]

On the character front, let's not forget Melo appearing in a Don't snitch, gang video.

[wdleehi]

I am just going to skip through all of this and just say no to the knucklehead. 

[soap07]

if you want to argue weed's not a drug problem, alright, i can see that has some merit, but don't try to sell me on the fariy tale that melo randomly decided to try pot for the first time and got caught, it's ludicrous.

You're right, it is ludicrous. Know your facts.

DENVER -- Carmelo Anthony was cited for marijuana possession while boarding the team plane last week, though the Denver Nuggets star says the bag was left in his backpack by a friend.

Anthony, 20, was issued a summons last Friday at Denver International Airport while the Nuggets were waiting to board a flight to Milwaukee for a preseason game. Anthony's attorney, Daniel Recht, said he wasn't aware the marijuana was there and that it was left there by an out-of-town friend who borrowed the backpack last week.

"The friend obviously uses marijuana and left a small amount in the backpack when he returned it to Carmelo," Recht said Thursday. "Carmelo had no idea there was any marijuana in the backpack."

Anthony was charged with possessing less than 1 ounce of marijuana, a petty offense with a maximum $100 fine and no jail time. He was in Los Angeles for a preseason game against the Clippers and not immediately available for comment.

Recht said he has met with a city attorney and requested the citation be dismissed. He also said the friend acknowledged the marijuana was his and would come forward to accept responsibility as early as Thursday.

Recht also said he received a letter from Nuggets general manager Kiki Vandeweghe verifying Anthony passed four random drug tests last season and another just two weeks ago. The letter also said tests from U.S. Olympic Committee at the Athens Games this summer came back negative.

[soap07]

Watch a few Nuggets games and count how many times Carmelo is the last guy to arrive back to the defensive end. It's despairing. If that's not laziness, what is it?

Save me some time and post that stat..."Last Man Back On The Defensive End".

[soap07]

If you don't think drunk driving is a minor offense, then don't down play it like people are idiots to mention it as a serious character flaw. to me, getting drunk and driving a car is reckless endangerment, and a huge issue.

and again, i could care less that james posey did it, your assumption that I didn't think his DWI was a big deal is false.

You miss the point and misconstrue my words. I assume that if you think that a DUI is a big deal for Melo, you think it's a big deal for Posey. Therefore, you must believe, as you do with Melo, that Posey's off the court character flaw is so hanus that he shouldn't have been on the team last year.