Author Topic: Ron Artest continues to be an embarassment  (Read 13750 times)

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Re: Ron Artest continues to be an embarassment
« Reply #15 on: July 31, 2008, 01:02:59 PM »

Offline Hoops

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Quote
The potential Ron Artest to the Houston Rockets trade may have gotten off on the wrong foot over comments made by Artest's potential teammate, Yao Ming, about Artest's stormy past.
...
"Hopefully, he's not fighting anymore and going after a guy in the stands," Yao said, according to the Chronicle.

When asked about those comments, Artest said Yao had bought into "all the propaganda" about him, according to The Sacramento Bee.

"I understand what Yao said, but I'm still ghetto," Artest said, according to the report. "That's not going to change. I'm never going to change my culture. Yao has played with a lot of black players, but I don't think he's ever played with a black player that really represents his culture as much as I represent my culture. Once Yao Ming gets to know me, he'll understand what I'm about.

"If you go back to the brawl, that's a culture issue right there," Artest added, according to the report. "Somebody was disrespecting me, so he's got to understand where I'm coming from. People that know me know that Ron Artest never changed."

Link.

What an embarrassment.  There are millions of African-Americans who would be offended to hear Ron Artest try to speak for them and what their "culture" is.  To label fighting / brawling as a cultural norm of black people is, to me, offensive.  Ron Artest is a thug, as demonstrated by the brawl, the allegations of animal abuse / malnourishment, and the domestic violence directed towards his girlfriend.  Those are Ron Artest issues, not "black" issues.

I'm sure the Rockets are glad to hear that Artest has no regrets.

And yes, this probably touches on some political issues, but since it's sports related, I have no problem discussing this.  Just please tread lightly, and avoid rhetoric at all costs.
I think what Artest said was really clumsy, but I don't think he was intending to suggest that all black players are "ghetto." I know, I know, it kind of sounds that way. I honestly think, though, that he was simply trying to say that HIS personal culture/upbringing was ghetto (it just so happens that he's black and he called that out). Blacks don't have exclusive rights to "ghetto" culture as far as I know. People from any race can be "ghetto" - whatever that means.

You have to feel sorry for anyone, regardless of race, that grew up in a situation where defending your turf and/or having zero tolerance for another's "disrepect" of you is a way of life. But as I understand it, that is reality for a lot of people in inner cities. I don't know that Artest is even proud of his "ghetto" culture/upbringing. I think he's proud on some level of who he has become - given his upbringing - and part of that is acknowledging the good and bad experiences that got him to where he is today. It's clear that he's aware of his cultural (again, it doesn't necessarily have anything to do with race) upbringing, and on some level, I think he's constantly fighting the battle against the negative aspects of it. Breaking out of a box like that - that's heavy stuff, man. I think it's hard to judge a guy like that.

Re: Ron Artest continues to be an embarassment
« Reply #16 on: July 31, 2008, 01:03:35 PM »

Offline Morris Blue

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I completely agree Roy.  My jaw was on my desk when I read this quote this morning.  To think that he would make such a sweeping generalization about a "culture," which is really not even a culture because of how heterogeneous and diverse this country is, is sickening.  

I will not defend Artest, but, too his credit, he was responding to Yao saying this:
Quote

    "For some reason, I like (Artest)," Yao said. "Because in the games we play against him, I hate him.

    "When I text messaged with Luis (Scola), we talked about team chemistry. That's only what worries us.

    "We worry about the new attitude to the team. We are adding talent to the team and we need that, but building team chemistry is important. This is not bad. I don't mean he is not welcome to Houston. But a new player always needs some time.

    "Also, he was the biggest part of a team in Sacramento. He was a star player. We need more chemistry and more communication.

    "There's worry. Obviously, yes. We will think about it, of course. Hopefully, he's not fighting anymore and going after a guy in the stands.

    "I haven't talked to Ron yet, so it's hard to say. I have to find a way to talk to him and see what we can do as a basketball team. He has a history. But we know he is a physical player. He is a good player. He really can help us. And Ron is on a contract year, too.

    "I think Ron Artest is a good player if coach (Rick) Adelman can control the team well."

(Earlier yesterday, Artest said "I'm going to be like a kid in a candy store [when i get to Houston]" and "[I'm going to be] dancing with the stars."  He also praised Rick Adelman for being "the best coach" according to him.)

Like I said before, I can't defend Artest, he's a headcase. But if all you do after you get traded to a team is say all the right things and talk about how you're excited to contend for a championship with other high-calibur players on the team, and then one of the team mates comes back at you like that?  "Hopefully he's not fighting anymore and going after the guy in the stands" is a low blow....He obviously hasn't been going after anyone in the stands anytime recently, and though the guy is a headcase, even he is not dumb enough to do something like that.  He's very aware of his bad-boy image and his actions over the past few years have proven that he is trying to rectify it.  Unfortunately for Artest, in the age of ESPN.com, blogs, and Sportscenter, sometimes "words speak louder than actions."  And everyone's going to remember what he said this time.  

Re: Ron Artest continues to be an embarassment
« Reply #17 on: July 31, 2008, 01:08:01 PM »

Offline slamdunk

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Artest is rapidly approaching the Tyson Zone, if he hasn't already. The trade hasn't even become offical yet and he is already starting problems there.

Re: Ron Artest continues to be an embarassment
« Reply #18 on: July 31, 2008, 01:10:04 PM »

Offline Celtic_E

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Ron Artest is the biggest embarassment in the NBA.

I don't even know if he makes the top 5

-The thugster has a much longer criminal record than Artest and is an equally accomplished racist brain-dead rap "artist"

-Anthony promotes the non reporting of violent crimes and is a much more accomplished driver than Artest.

-Kidd seems to have a real affectionate streak with women and a tendency to not give his best effort.

-Tank Carter bragged about tanking to force a trade.  At least Artest gives maximum effort no matter what uniform he's wearing.

-Tracy O'Grady bragged about tanking to force a trade.  At least Artest gives maximum effort no matter who's uniform he's wearing.

-Jermaine O'Neal plays when he feels like it and embarasses himself and the NBA every time he spouts his racist opinions on the NBA.

-Artest is about half as much an embarassment as the NBA's fraudulent officiating has become.

-Zach Randolph is the Pacman Jones of the NBA.

-Isiah Thomas, anyone?

I guess Artest makes the top 10

You bring up some valid points there but I think it all boils down as to how you look at it. Whenever someone redefines what his "culture" is all about, in Ron's case beating up people as a way to stand up to them, that to me is taking embarassing to a whole new level.

All of the players you've mentioned are embarassing in their own ways but I think Artest just rewrote the book on embarassment when he opened his mouth and made that stupid statement.

Re: Ron Artest continues to be an embarassment
« Reply #19 on: July 31, 2008, 01:23:39 PM »

Offline crownsy

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I completely agree Roy.  My jaw was on my desk when I read this quote this morning.  To think that he would make such a sweeping generalization about a "culture," which is really not even a culture because of how heterogeneous and diverse this country is, is sickening.  

I will not defend Artest, but, too his credit, he was responding to Yao saying this:
Quote

    "For some reason, I like (Artest)," Yao said. "Because in the games we play against him, I hate him.

    "When I text messaged with Luis (Scola), we talked about team chemistry. That's only what worries us.

    "We worry about the new attitude to the team. We are adding talent to the team and we need that, but building team chemistry is important. This is not bad. I don't mean he is not welcome to Houston. But a new player always needs some time.

    "Also, he was the biggest part of a team in Sacramento. He was a star player. We need more chemistry and more communication.

    "There's worry. Obviously, yes. We will think about it, of course. Hopefully, he's not fighting anymore and going after a guy in the stands.

    "I haven't talked to Ron yet, so it's hard to say. I have to find a way to talk to him and see what we can do as a basketball team. He has a history. But we know he is a physical player. He is a good player. He really can help us. And Ron is on a contract year, too.

    "I think Ron Artest is a good player if coach (Rick) Adelman can control the team well."

(Earlier yesterday, Artest said "I'm going to be like a kid in a candy store [when i get to Houston]" and "[I'm going to be] dancing with the stars."  He also praised Rick Adelman for being "the best coach" according to him.)

Like I said before, I can't defend Artest, he's a headcase. But if all you do after you get traded to a team is say all the right things and talk about how you're excited to contend for a championship with other high-calibur players on the team, and then one of the team mates comes back at you like that?  "Hopefully he's not fighting anymore and going after the guy in the stands" is a low blow....He obviously hasn't been going after anyone in the stands anytime recently, and though the guy is a headcase, even he is not dumb enough to do something like that.  He's very aware of his bad-boy image and his actions over the past few years have proven that he is trying to rectify it.  Unfortunately for Artest, in the age of ESPN.com, blogs, and Sportscenter, sometimes "words speak louder than actions."  And everyone's going to remember what he said this time.  

i don't really think thats yao "calling him out" thats a legit concern. the guy hasen't had problems with players or something he assualted a fan in the worst black eye to the league in 20 years, broke up what people forget was a pretty good team, and has shown ZERO remorse about the whole incident, and been a chemistry problem on a second team.

i'd kind of want assuarnces he has grown up a bit as well.
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Re: Ron Artest continues to be an embarassment
« Reply #20 on: July 31, 2008, 01:31:08 PM »

Offline guava_wrench

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Ron Artest is the biggest embarassment in the NBA.

I don't even know if he makes the top 5

-The thugster has a much longer criminal record than Artest and is an equally accomplished racist brain-dead rap "artist"

-Anthony promotes the non reporting of violent crimes and is a much more accomplished driver than Artest.

-Kidd seems to have a real affectionate streak with women and a tendency to not give his best effort.

-Tank Carter bragged about tanking to force a trade.  At least Artest gives maximum effort no matter what uniform he's wearing.

-Tracy O'Grady bragged about tanking to force a trade.  At least Artest gives maximum effort no matter who's uniform he's wearing.

-Jermaine O'Neal plays when he feels like it and embarasses himself and the NBA every time he spouts his racist opinions on the NBA.

-Artest is about half as much an embarassment as the NBA's fraudulent officiating has become.

-Zach Randolph is the Pacman Jones of the NBA.

-Isiah Thomas, anyone?

I guess Artest makes the top 10

I'd say only 2 on your list can trump Artest: Donoughy & Isiah

Re: Ron Artest continues to be an embarassment
« Reply #21 on: July 31, 2008, 01:39:13 PM »

Offline I am... a brain doctor

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Quote
The potential Ron Artest to the Houston Rockets trade may have gotten off on the wrong foot over comments made by Artest's potential teammate, Yao Ming, about Artest's stormy past.
...
"Hopefully, he's not fighting anymore and going after a guy in the stands," Yao said, according to the Chronicle.

When asked about those comments, Artest said Yao had bought into "all the propaganda" about him, according to The Sacramento Bee.

"I understand what Yao said, but I'm still ghetto," Artest said, according to the report. "That's not going to change. I'm never going to change my culture. Yao has played with a lot of black players, but I don't think he's ever played with a black player that really represents his culture as much as I represent my culture. Once Yao Ming gets to know me, he'll understand what I'm about.

"If you go back to the brawl, that's a culture issue right there," Artest added, according to the report. "Somebody was disrespecting me, so he's got to understand where I'm coming from. People that know me know that Ron Artest never changed."

Link.

What an embarrassment.  There are millions of African-Americans who would be offended to hear Ron Artest try to speak for them and what their "culture" is.  To label fighting / brawling as a cultural norm of black people is, to me, offensive.  Ron Artest is a thug, as demonstrated by the brawl, the allegations of animal abuse / malnourishment, and the domestic violence directed towards his girlfriend.  Those are Ron Artest issues, not "black" issues.

I'm sure the Rockets are glad to hear that Artest has no regrets.

And yes, this probably touches on some political issues, but since it's sports related, I have no problem discussing this.  Just please tread lightly, and avoid rhetoric at all costs.
I think what Artest said was really clumsy, but I don't think he was intending to suggest that all black players are "ghetto." I know, I know, it kind of sounds that way. I honestly think, though, that he was simply trying to say that HIS personal culture/upbringing was ghetto (it just so happens that he's black and he called that out). Blacks don't have exclusive rights to "ghetto" culture as far as I know. People from any race can be "ghetto" - whatever that means.

You have to feel sorry for anyone, regardless of race, that grew up in a situation where defending your turf and/or having zero tolerance for another's "disrepect" of you is a way of life. But as I understand it, that is reality for a lot of people in inner cities. I don't know that Artest is even proud of his "ghetto" culture/upbringing. I think he's proud on some level of who he has become - given his upbringing - and part of that is acknowledging the good and bad experiences that got him to where he is today. It's clear that he's aware of his cultural (again, it doesn't necessarily have anything to do with race) upbringing, and on some level, I think he's constantly fighting the battle against the negative aspects of it. Breaking out of a box like that - that's heavy stuff, man. I think it's hard to judge a guy like that.

This was my take on his comments as well. I think he was discussing his upbringing (culture) more than race per se, but couldn't articulate his thoughts very well.

My issue with him is that plenty of people, and people in the NBA, have come from similar backgrounds and are not as vehement about "keeping it real." I think both intellectual and innate temperament factors can moderate how well someone acculturates, and those with better cognitive abilities (higher cortical functioning) can find a way to co-exist and prosper in different cultural settings. If you are concrete in your thinking, you get stuck doing only what you know and cannot evolve. He clearly demonstrates that he cannot abstract very well and is rather concrete by his first statement that Yao has bought into some propaganda that is not true about him (presumably that he is volatile, and thug-like). Then, he follows that up with saying he is indeed thug-like because of his culture. Well, what is it Ron? Are you thug-like? If so, then Yao was right and he understands you regardless of how you got that way.

Re: Ron Artest continues to be an embarassment
« Reply #22 on: July 31, 2008, 01:45:53 PM »

Offline cordobes

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Well, he's right. I don't think Artest's goal was to associate all the black people with "ghetto culture", Roy, although his terrible phrasing didn't help. I think Artest was trying to say something in the lines of "Yeah, Yao played with black guys, some of them act ghetto, but you know what? They aren't ghetto, or at least they aren't as ghetto as I am".

And of course there is a "ghetto culture", shared by many black sportsmen, musicians, etc.

Re: Ron Artest continues to be an embarassment
« Reply #23 on: July 31, 2008, 01:48:26 PM »

Offline cordobes

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Ron Artest is the biggest embarassment in the NBA.

I don't even know if he makes the top 5

-The thugster has a much longer criminal record than Artest and is an equally accomplished racist brain-dead rap "artist"

-Anthony promotes the non reporting of violent crimes and is a much more accomplished driver than Artest.

-Kidd seems to have a real affectionate streak with women and a tendency to not give his best effort.

-Tank Carter bragged about tanking to force a trade.  At least Artest gives maximum effort no matter what uniform he's wearing.

-Tracy O'Grady bragged about tanking to force a trade.  At least Artest gives maximum effort no matter who's uniform he's wearing.

-Jermaine O'Neal plays when he feels like it and embarasses himself and the NBA every time he spouts his racist opinions on the NBA.

-Artest is about half as much an embarassment as the NBA's fraudulent officiating has become.

-Zach Randolph is the Pacman Jones of the NBA.

-Isiah Thomas, anyone?

I guess Artest makes the top 10

As it was chanted in the Garden....

WHERE'S KOBE?

Re: Ron Artest continues to be an embarassment
« Reply #24 on: July 31, 2008, 01:56:05 PM »

Offline Schupac

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Ron Ron, I don't care where you're from.

Where you are right now is a million dollar mansion. 

Take pride in where you are from, but adapt to where you are.

Re: Ron Artest continues to be an embarassment
« Reply #25 on: July 31, 2008, 02:00:18 PM »

Offline Roy Hobbs

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Well, he's right. I don't think Artest's goal was to associate all the black people with "ghetto culture", Roy, although his terrible phrasing didn't help. I think Artest was trying to say something in the lines of "Yeah, Yao played with black guys, some of them act ghetto, but you know what? They aren't ghetto, or at least they aren't as ghetto as I am".

And of course there is a "ghetto culture", shared by many black sportsmen, musicians, etc.

If that was his intent, I still have issues with the "I'm ghetto and proud of it" mentality.  Guys who assault others, don't feed their pets, and beat their girlfriends don't have the right to blame it on "culture".  Those things are criminal acts, not a heritage to be celebrated and lauded.

All the negativity in this town sucks. It sucks, and it stinks, and it sucks. - Rick Pitino

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Re: Ron Artest continues to be an embarassment
« Reply #26 on: July 31, 2008, 02:16:08 PM »

Offline houlana

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Ron Ron, I don't care where you're from.

Where you are right now is a million dollar mansion. 

Take pride in where you are from, but adapt to where you are.

wow, couldn't have put it any better. manny NBA players didn't have a comfortable life growing up. but they have to adapt to the culture they are in, they are no longer living in the ghetto, but are payed millions.

Leon didn't have a good life growing up, so did many NBA players, but they handle themselves with respect.



Re: Ron Artest continues to be an embarassment
« Reply #27 on: July 31, 2008, 02:18:49 PM »

Offline GreenPride

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i'm just glad he didn't end up here in boston!

Re: Ron Artest continues to be an embarassment
« Reply #28 on: July 31, 2008, 02:56:34 PM »

Offline zerophase

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artest is an okay person as long as he never talks.

Become Legendary.

Re: Ron Artest continues to be an embarassment
« Reply #29 on: July 31, 2008, 02:59:54 PM »

Offline Mean Gerald Green

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artest is an okay person as long as he never talks.

Maybe he should wire his jaw shut for the season.