Delonte West to Moscow-- Maybe

[aaron276h]

I can't believe Gibson gets the multi-year deal and West gets Moscow....

Bad choice by Danny Ferry. 

Delonte is a perfect fit with Lebron in the Mike Brown offense (get it to Lebron, get out of the way).

West is a better defender & 3pt shooter than Gibson, imo.  Aren't those the specific areas you want your pg to excel in if you are the Cavs?

dude i love delonte west as a player, but Bubby Gibson is a much  superior three point shooter, but overall Dwest defiantly brings more to the table.

[jdub1660]

Gibson is the better 3point shooter, but West has him beat in every other category. I know Gibson got his contract b/c LeBron loves the kid, and Ferry will do anything at this point to impress Lebron in hopes of keeping him past 2009-10 season. What I don't understand is why wouldn't James show the same love towards West who helped push the Celts series to 7 games. I would have put all my efforts into keeping West before I would have Gibson. Lebron is bound to leave anyways, so look at what's best for the team

[Mr October]

Gibson is the better 3point shooter, but West has him beat in every other category. I know Gibson got his contract b/c LeBron loves the kid, and Ferry will do anything at this point to impress Lebron in hopes of keeping him past 2009-10 season. What I don't understand is why wouldn't James show the same love towards West who helped push the Celts series to 7 games. I would have put all my efforts into keeping West before I would have Gibson. Lebron is bound to leave anyways, so look at what's best for the team

Right. West was the second best player on the Cavs in that series with Boston. I don't get it either. He's worth at least a Gibson contract to CLE...

[jackson_34]

Don't go Delonte! The NBA needs a funnyman! boy, this European interest is definitely gathering steam, I can't imagine what next season/ 2010 will bring!

Completely Off-Topic, but concerning currency overseas;

Has anyone seen that Zimbabwe has had to introduce a 100 Billion Dollar note? The Inflation over there is so ridiculous, the note is only worth about two loaves of bread.   

[Sweet17]

Delonte West isn't that good. He should jump at the chance to make that kind of money. He doesn't deserve anything like that stateside - where he couldn't beat out Earl Watson or Luke Ridnour. Had he been healthy Gibson would have beat him out as well. he is a better athlete and has a better stroke.

[Scribbles]

Delonte West isn't that good. He should jump at the chance to make that kind of money. He doesn't deserve anything like that stateside - where he couldn't beat out Earl Watson or Luke Ridnour. Had he been healthy Gibson would have beat him out as well. he is a better athlete and has a better stroke.

Umm I have to disagree, West is every bit as good as Gibson.  He killed the Celtics in their playoff series vs the Cavs and was really the only guy that was doing good things on the court other than LeBron.  If he leaves that leaves the Cavs with a hole that will need to be filled. 

[Bankshot]

Delonte West isn't that good. He should jump at the chance to make that kind of money. He doesn't deserve anything like that stateside - where he couldn't beat out Earl Watson or Luke Ridnour. Had he been healthy Gibson would have beat him out as well. he is a better athlete and has a better stroke.

Umm I have to disagree, West is every bit as good as Gibson. He killed the Celtics in their playoff series vs the Cavs and was really the only guy that was doing good things on the court other than LeBron.  If he leaves that leaves the Cavs with a hole that will need to be filled. 

Delonte West did no such thing.  Also, as I recall, the Celtics won that series.

[Evantime34]

The Celtics should do him a favor and sign him with the rest of their MLE. The Cavs would match because they want to spite the Celtics. So we would essentially be forcing the Cavs to sign him.

[cordobes]

I'm also curious as to whether some of these Euro signings will be worth it for the clubs involved.  Is a player like Carlos Delfino or Delonte West good enough to totally dominate the league they're playing in?  While they bring an appreciably better chance of their teams winning a title, or in selling tickets?

I have no idea what the answers to those questions are.  It will be interesting to see; I think if some of these role players don't pay immediate dividends, you could see this trend dry up fairly quickly.

Good questions to bring up, Roy. Just my opinion on the answers:

No, not even close. For starters, not even the best players in Europe can dominate a league. The rules and the style the game is played don't allow the kind of individual dominance one can see in the NBA: few ISO, few one-on-one plays, few high-usage rates. Even the way the minutes are alocated per player is different. Even guys like Sabonis, Kukoc, Bodiroga, Papaloukas, Parker, Siskauskas were more super-role players than the alpha type kind of player that usually dominates in the NBA. And guys like Delfino or Nachbar were never top players in Europe.

No. CSKA will easily destroy them once again in the domestic league. And clubs like Dynamo or Chimsky (a pun with Chelsea - Khimki, because of the way they behave in the market, overpaying everyone thanks to the money of their russian owners) don't even play in the Euroleague, but in a secondary competition, ULEB Cup).

No, european basketball is not so star-driven as the NBA. Supporters will buy tickets if the team is winning and playing well, disregarding who is in the roster. But for a club like Khimki, that don't even have a fanbase, this is not applicable: I had a chance of attending one of their games 2 years ago and there were about 1.500 fans in the stands. These guys are not making business, not even running non-profitable organizations like most European ball clubs are.

There's an excellent article on this issue by DraftExpress' Luis Fernandez that I strongly reccomend:

http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Thoughts-on-the-Euro-Fever-2971/

Exactly my thoughts, with two minor disagreements:
- The greek powerhouses are generating revenue to pay for these contracts, mostly due to a recent huge TV rights and sponsorship deal. Last year Panathinaikos had a positive operating income. Oly may lose some money, and the ownership covers it, but it's not fair to put them in the same class of the Russian clubs. Greek clubs have big and fanatic fanbases.

- He forgets to mention the clubs from his own country and their responsibilty in this high-salaries trend. Barcelona has recently signed Navarro for €15 million/5 years and David Andersen (ouch, another player the Hawks could very well use, his draft rights belong to them) for a €2 million annual salary. Real Madrid has half-a-dozen of players making this kind of money. Tau's Splitter is making more money than almost every NBA player his age. A little of homerism from his part in these two points.

[Roy Hobbs]

TP, cordrobes.  Well-reasoned and insightful answers are always appreciated.

[cordobes]

Two other things:

Delonte won't dominate in the Russian League. I bet that if he signs with Dynamo, he's not winning the title nor All-1st team honours.

Basketball players pay taxes in Europe. Well, maybe they don't pay a lot of taxes in Russia, I don't know. But they certainly pay income taxes (and the indirect ones), and with highers rates than in the US, in Greece, Spain, etc. The thing is that sports salaries in Europe are generally quoted after taxes. For example, Childress signed a $35 million contract, but he'll only receive $20 million. This is because of the soccer, the clubs compete for the same players and there are different tax structures between the countries, so traditionally the press uses net salaries when announcing the deals.

Well, there's a third one:
- This trend will end when these guys get tired of spending money in pro basketball (or when russian natural resources are finished). I hope it comes fast and that other clubs don't follow the insanity, or else the European basketball, who has been giving slow but safe steps in recent years, may suffer.

[Bankshot]

The Celtics should do him a favor and sign him with the rest of their MLE. The Cavs would match because they want to spite the Celtics. So we would essentially be forcing the Cavs to sign him.

Why should the Celtics do Delonte and the Cavs a favor?  Delonte going to Europe weakens the Cavs (unless they trade for someone better after West leaves), which is to the Celtics advantage.

[asterix]

I'm also curious as to whether some of these Euro signings will be worth it for the clubs involved.  Is a player like Carlos Delfino or Delonte West good enough to totally dominate the league they're playing in?  While they bring an appreciably better chance of their teams winning a title, or in selling tickets?

I have no idea what the answers to those questions are.  It will be interesting to see; I think if some of these role players don't pay immediate dividends, you could see this trend dry up fairly quickly.

as a guy who watches euroleague every season from the court side, I think I can provide some insight. There are two different cases here:
1. A european player who has hung around the NBA and come back due to lack of playing time (Boki, Delfino): These are very good players on a european level - but not incredible. they will be starters on a good team and...that's about it. It's also imporant to note that Neither himki Moscow, nor Dynamo are in the euroleague - they play the russian league and one of the other european leagues - which less important.
2. guys like Childress and maybe D-West could tear up everything, BUT - every NBA player goes through an adjustment phase - European basketball is based a lot more on team work (a bit like our beloved C's) than on individual skills. Zome defense in europe has been played for decades and may prove to be a very frustrating experience for NBA players. So bottom line: If they can adjust - they will be a major factor.

[Ersatz]

Cavs are insane for signing Gibson to that kind of deal and letting West go. I like both of them, but West brings so much more to the table. Whatever, I guess, they are going to be worse, which is good for the Celtics.

By the way, reading about Euroball here, and from the little I've seen of it, makes it sound like dreadful basketball. Like colleges hoops, which are tedious and boring. When I start to sympathize with people who complain about NBA star treatment and the lack of teamness in the NBA, I remember international ball and college basketball. If those are the alternatives, then no thanks. I'll take "selfishness" and star treatment any day.

[EDWARDO]

I wonder to what extent these guys look beyond the money, and say "you know, living in Moscow is really something I don't look forward to".

Obviously, some players would love living abroad, but it's certainly not for everyone.

Well, I personally loved living abroad-- and from all reports Moscow is an interesting place these days. It also helps when you make 2-3 times more money than you would otherwise and pay no taxes.

A. Moscow is a hellish place to live for expats. Its an interesting town, yes, but for a guy like Delonte who probably is used to having his pals around and not really going to be interested in learning Russian and getting into the local culture, I don't think its going to be a great fit. Its cold has hell and much further north than the continental US... very, very dark winters. This ain't Athens.

B. Delonte will learn a lot about how "racist" the US is compared to other places. The black soccer players who go to Russia have some awful stories about what they do through and how they are ostracized by the Russians. Not good. http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4161/is_20071014/ai_n21049103

C. Why does everyone think you don't pay taxes overseas!??! If only that were true. Your first $82,000 are tax free and after that you are tax equalized. For instance, here in HK I pay 16% taxes to HK. When I do my US taxes, I get to deduct the taxes I pay to HK, but pay the balance to the US. If I my US taxes come to 35%, I end up paying 16% to HK and 19% to the US, so the tax benefits are extremely limited. In fact, the US is the only country that does this - I work with Indians, English, French, Russians, Aussies, Kiwis, Koreans, Italians, Canadians, etc, etc... I pay 35%... they all pay just the 16% to HK. There is NO REAL TAX BENEFIT FOR THESE GUYS.