WEEI: Unnamed team willing to offer Posey 4th year

[Roy Hobbs]

People keep bringing up Posey's "weight" violation with the Heat. That was absolutely ridiculous. Riley's body fat percentage requirement was a joke. When they suspended Posey and Walker, Posey had 9% body fat and Walker 11% . Even Antoine's wasn't a real big deal. When you bring up these kind of comments you are insinuating that Posey is a slacker and not a hard worker. We have never heard once that he didn't bring it all the time. We don't know what he did in practice, but the man surely is not and has never been fat. Target something realistic if you are going to bring up comments to rationalize not giving him a fourth year...

i agree. TP.

using "weight" as a reason to not give Posey a 4th year is ridiculous.

personally, i don't agree with the salary structure reasoning either, but at least it has some merit.

How is posey's conditioning not a valid concern? Nearly all of Posey's effectiveness as a defender can be attributed to his length and athleticism. If Posey loses a step he's a much less effective defender. He's 31 now, so its not like he had anywhere to go but down. I don't think its a good reason to not sign him, but it should definitely be a factor when considering the entire picture. his coach gave him criteria to be filled, and Posey didn't fill it, thats got to matter somewhere in all this.

Ditto.  How many of us have followed Posey's career closely enough to know him well?  As much as people would love to think he's a super-motivated gym rat, were there any stories like that during the season?  I remember all the stories about Ray Allen, KG, Rondo, etc., but to my knowledge Posey has never been cited as somebody who is constantly working out.  He could be doing those things; we just don't know.

Obviously, he performed this season, but many players perform well in a contract year.  The last time he was on a team coming off of a championship, his coach questioned his conditioning and his failure to meet goals set for him.  Obviously, that Riley was willing to suspend somebody who is seen as a "team leader" suggests that he wasn't happy about something.

We know what Posey did for us for one season.  He filled his role very well, and I would like to see him back.  However, the longer you extend his contract, the more you have to worry about other issues.  Amongst those are the natural aging process, which can presumably be accelerated or decelerated by a player's fitness.  If Posey isn't going to make every possible effort to get himself in tip-top playing condition (something none of us know for certain one way or the other) then at least it's a caution flag.

[ForexPirate]

i am hoping that its the Celts that offered the 4rth year as a compromise for not giving up the full mle - we need some of it for signing house and walker (to a third year) and "our 2009 first round pick"

[winsomme]

People keep bringing up Posey's "weight" violation with the Heat. That was absolutely ridiculous. Riley's body fat percentage requirement was a joke. When they suspended Posey and Walker, Posey had 9% body fat and Walker 11% . Even Antoine's wasn't a real big deal. When you bring up these kind of comments you are insinuating that Posey is a slacker and not a hard worker. We have never heard once that he didn't bring it all the time. We don't know what he did in practice, but the man surely is not and has never been fat. Target something realistic if you are going to bring up comments to rationalize not giving him a fourth year...

i agree. TP.

using "weight" as a reason to not give Posey a 4th year is ridiculous.

personally, i don't agree with the salary structure reasoning either, but at least it has some merit.

How is posey's conditioning not a valid concern? Nearly all of Posey's effectiveness as a defender can be attributed to his length and athleticism. If Posey loses a step he's a much less effective defender. He's 31 now, so its not like he had anywhere to go but down. I don't think its a good reason to not sign him, but it should definitely be a factor when considering the entire picture. his coach gave him criteria to be filled, and Posey didn't fill it, thats got to matter somewhere in all this.

are you seriously worried about Posey's "weight" next season?

like EJP pointed out, that situation in Miami was overblown.

if i are arguing that we should only sign Posey for one season, then i think it is fair to be using post Title "weight" as a criticism.

but if you are in the "three years - yes. four years - no." camp, then i think you are just rationalizing. because if you were genuinely worried about what shape Posey is going to be in next season, then you wouldn't want to sign him for three years.

[winsomme]

People keep bringing up Posey's "weight" violation with the Heat. That was absolutely ridiculous. Riley's body fat percentage requirement was a joke. When they suspended Posey and Walker, Posey had 9% body fat and Walker 11% . Even Antoine's wasn't a real big deal. When you bring up these kind of comments you are insinuating that Posey is a slacker and not a hard worker. We have never heard once that he didn't bring it all the time. We don't know what he did in practice, but the man surely is not and has never been fat. Target something realistic if you are going to bring up comments to rationalize not giving him a fourth year...

i agree. TP.

using "weight" as a reason to not give Posey a 4th year is ridiculous.

personally, i don't agree with the salary structure reasoning either, but at least it has some merit.

How is posey's conditioning not a valid concern? Nearly all of Posey's effectiveness as a defender can be attributed to his length and athleticism. If Posey loses a step he's a much less effective defender. He's 31 now, so its not like he had anywhere to go but down. I don't think its a good reason to not sign him, but it should definitely be a factor when considering the entire picture. his coach gave him criteria to be filled, and Posey didn't fill it, thats got to matter somewhere in all this.

Ditto.  How many of us have followed Posey's career closely enough to know him well?  As much as people would love to think he's a super-motivated gym rat, were there any stories like that during the season?  I remember all the stories about Ray Allen, KG, Rondo, etc., but to my knowledge Posey has never been cited as somebody who is constantly working out.  He could be doing those things; we just don't know.

Obviously, he performed this season, but many players perform well in a contract year.  The last time he was on a team coming off of a championship, his coach questioned his conditioning and his failure to meet goals set for him.  Obviously, that Riley was willing to suspend somebody who is seen as a "team leader" suggests that he wasn't happy about something.

We know what Posey did for us for one season.  He filled his role very well, and I would like to see him back.  However, the longer you extend his contract, the more you have to worry about other issues.  Amongst those are the natural aging process, which can presumably be accelerated or decelerated by a player's fitness.  If Posey isn't going to make every possible effort to get himself in tip-top playing condition (something none of us know for certain one way or the other) then at least it's a caution flag.

again, if this is really your feelings, then why are you okay signing him for three seasons?

[BballTim]

I don't see what the big deal is just give him the 4th  year of the contract, even if he has slowed down by then he will be a 7 mil dollar expiring contract which could easily be traded along with another piece or 2 to bring in a younger solid player in the future.

I agree.  We are built to win in the next 3 years.  Everybody loves Posey.  He was one of the best players on the floor during the playoffs.  If we win 1 more championship during 1 of Posey's 4 year contract, it will be worth it even if he is a corpse for the last year of his contract.

Bruce Bowen is starting to wear down but I don't think the Spurs regret signing him. 

  The only way Posey was one of the best players on the floor was if he was playing with reserves against other reserves. Let's not get carried away.

[Who]

Ditto.  How many of us have followed Posey's career closely enough to know him well?  As much as people would love to think he's a super-motivated gym rat, were there any stories like that during the season?  I remember all the stories about Ray Allen, KG, Rondo, etc., but to my knowledge Posey has never been cited as somebody who is constantly working out.  He could be doing those things; we just don't know.

Early in his career when he was back in Denver there were lots of stories about Posey being a gym rat. There were quite a few his first season in Memphis too when Posey was trying to take that leap into the upper half of starting small forwards. Since then .... haven't heard too much like that.

[CDawg834]

People keep bringing up Posey's "weight" violation with the Heat. That was absolutely ridiculous. Riley's body fat percentage requirement was a joke. When they suspended Posey and Walker, Posey had 9% body fat and Walker 11% . Even Antoine's wasn't a real big deal. When you bring up these kind of comments you are insinuating that Posey is a slacker and not a hard worker. We have never heard once that he didn't bring it all the time. We don't know what he did in practice, but the man surely is not and has never been fat. Target something realistic if you are going to bring up comments to rationalize not giving him a fourth year...

i agree. TP.

using "weight" as a reason to not give Posey a 4th year is ridiculous.

personally, i don't agree with the salary structure reasoning either, but at least it has some merit.

How is posey's conditioning not a valid concern? Nearly all of Posey's effectiveness as a defender can be attributed to his length and athleticism. If Posey loses a step he's a much less effective defender. He's 31 now, so its not like he had anywhere to go but down. I don't think its a good reason to not sign him, but it should definitely be a factor when considering the entire picture. his coach gave him criteria to be filled, and Posey didn't fill it, thats got to matter somewhere in all this.

Obviously, that Riley was willing to suspend somebody who is seen as a "team leader" suggests that he wasn't happy about something.

The same Pat Riley who decided he didn't feel like coaching his team mid-season and went on a scouting mission instead?  

[scitlec]

Ainge has a value limit and he's not going to chase Posey.  It is clear that Ainge wants to be competitive long term.  

Red Sox fans were eventually "trained" to not get attatched to popular aging players.  Celtic fans may have to go through that process now, and learn not to stomp and kick if the team doesn't go all out to re-sign a popular but aging player.

[FLCeltsFan]

I think a good NBA GM very rarely gives a four year deal. And in those cases its to elite players. And unfortunately elite roll player is not the same thing. As good as James is - he's an overall flawed player - and we'd regret a four year deal. And there is nothing that says he is enough to get us a ring or that someone else isn't.

I wish I could explain Scal's 5 year deal.  We still have him for 2 more years... Danny must have been under the influence of something when he signed that one. 

[timepiece33]

I hear people throwing out generalizations, but I have to ask whether any of these points change our willingness to go 4 years.

1. We have a limited window because of our stars ages
2. We have no real mid level contracts to trade for anything
3. The FA options out there means a massive downgrade for our bench within our limited window (no matter how many people try to sell the merits of Kwame Brown).

There is a creative way around this.  A 3 year contract with a 4th option year. He gets half his final year contract if we don't exercise the option.   

Scalabrine's deal was just stupid.  The length only made it worse. 

[CDawg834]

I think a good NBA GM very rarely gives a four year deal. And in those cases its to elite players. And unfortunately elite roll player is not the same thing. As good as James is - he's an overall flawed player - and we'd regret a four year deal. And there is nothing that says he is enough to get us a ring or that someone else isn't.

I wish I could explain Scal's 5 year deal.  We still have him for 2 more years... Danny must have been under the influence of something when he signed that one. 

Ainge was temporarily blinded by Scal's pale skin and thought the contract read "1 year deal"

[Jon]

Ainge has to ask himself how necessary Posey is to repeating next year.  If he deems that the Celtics need him to have a reasonable shot at #18, he must sign him regardless of the length of the contract.  The window is closing on this team to win more titles. 

Forget the future.  Remember, only 1 team in 30 wins it every year.  In every era there are tons of teams that build winners but can never get over the proverbial hump (think the Hawks and Bucks in the '80s, the Suns, Knicks, Heat, Blazers, and Jazz in the '90s, and in more recent years the Kings and likely the Mavs and Suns).  To risk not winning a title over the next couple years so we are better able to rebuild in 4-5 years is not playing the odds very smartly.  Even if Ainge does rebuild and does it well, it's far more likely the team becomes the late '90s Jazz than the late '90s Bulls (actually, it's more likely the C's become a mediocre team like the late '90s Blazers).  That's no knock on Danny, just reality. 

We really need to keep that Carpe Diem mentality and get everything we can out of this team. 

[Roy Hobbs]

Ainge has a value limit and he's not going to chase Posey.  It is clear that Ainge wants to be competitive long term.  

Red Sox fans were eventually "trained" to not get attatched to popular aging players.  Celtic fans may have to go through that process now, and learn not to stomp and kick if the team doesn't go all out to re-sign a popular but aging player.

Yep.  If Danny was uncomfortable with an aging Larry Bird and Kevin McHale on the Celtics roster in the late 80s, it's doubtful that he wants a 36 year old James Posey making $7 million on his team in four years.

[sk7326]

Ainge has to ask himself how necessary Posey is to repeating next year.  If he deems that the Celtics need him to have a reasonable shot at #18, he must sign him regardless of the length of the contract.  The window is closing on this team to win more titles. 

Forget the future.  Remember, only 1 team in 30 wins it every year.  In every era there are tons of teams that build winners but can never get over the proverbial hump (think the Hawks and Bucks in the '80s, the Suns, Knicks, Heat, Blazers, and Jazz in the '90s, and in more recent years the Kings and likely the Mavs and Suns).  To risk not winning a title over the next couple years so we are better able to rebuild in 4-5 years is not playing the odds very smartly.  Even if Ainge does rebuild and does it well, it's far more likely the team becomes the late '90s Jazz than the late '90s Bulls (actually, it's more likely the C's become a mediocre team like the late '90s Blazers).  That's no knock on Danny, just reality. 

We really need to keep that Carpe Diem mentality and get everything we can out of this team. 

Late 90s blazers let their good players get old.  That's the point of having roster flexibility, so that doesn't happen.  And besides if Posey cannot be happy with 4 years ... anyway, no contract should be beyond KGs.  The window of opportunity is defined for this team (3 years) before serious organizational decisions must take place.  Not wanting to turn into the 00s Knicks is a fair minded thing to guard against.

I think this gets solved though.

[butterbeanlove]

The WEEI report seems to be reading something into Bulpett's story that isn't there.

"The Celtics [team stats] are still very much interested in retaining the top reserve, but they may need to be concerned about another club offering the contract Posey is requesting, said to be at least four years at the mid-level exception.

According to his representative, Mark Bartelstein, the Celts will probably not have a chance to match the right offer."

I read that to mean not that another team HAS offered Posey four years, but if somebody does, we will not have a chance to match it. Just posturing by Bartelstein.