No Worries From Ainge (Herald Article)

[bucknersrevenge]

Ainge drawing a line in the sand at 3 years is completely reasonable, and if Posey walks away over not having a 4th or 5th guaranteed year, I cannot blame the Celtics at all.  He is a crucial cog for this team, especially defensively, but just like I do not blame him for seeking his true value, the Celtics are completely justified in not wanting to have an albatross contract on their hands, and a 5 year deal with Posey would most likely be an albatross.

I agree completely.  It would be great to have Posey back, but only if the price is right.  I don't want the Cs to be paying a 36 year old James Posey $8M to sit on the bench in 2012.....  There are other players still available who, while not replacing what Posey does, could be had cheaper: M. Barnes, M. Evans, B. Wells, D. Brown, E. Najera....

People are making too much of a 4 or 5 year deal.  Why do people think Posey can't be productive at 35 or 36?  Have you ever heard of Bruce Bowen, Kurt Thomas, PJ Brown, Sam Cassell, Robert Horry.... and I can go on!  Posey is not relied upon to play 30+ mpg and score 20+ ppg. He can still be productive at 35 or 36 years of age.

Agreed.  Besides, if his skills decline significantly at the end of his deal, he is always a very nice trade asset - GM's looking to clear space love $8M expiring deals.

This quote by Ainge at the end really concerns me

The Celtics are trying to find takers. They have some veteran minimum offers out there and they are still hoping Posey will come in on their terms. Other than that, it’s a waiting game.

“We’re ready to pull the trigger on some things, but I don’t anticipate anything happening,” Ainge said. “If somebody calls and says they’ll play for what we’re offering, we’ll sign them right away. But I don’t anticipate that.”

Hopefully he is referring to the vet minimum offers out there and not Posey. 

Ainge seems to be playing hardball with Posey with zero leverage .  If he doesn't sign Posey that would be a huge loss considering what is left out there.  I'd be highly upset if Ainge compromised the teams chances of repeating by trying to be a hardass.   Posey is worth 4 years at the full MLE and Danny needs to give it to him so he can move on and try to complete the roster.

Let's not forget that until last season, Danny hasn't been all that good with trades and free agents, which scares me right now.

if we give posey the full mle how exactly do we fill out the roster. and what do we fill it out with?? i gotta believe thats dannys stance on the subject and danny does have leverage in the fact that he absolutely does NOT have to sign posey at all to field a good team next year. im sorry i dont see a team led by the big 3 falling apart simply because james posey doesnt come back.

[Hoops]

Ainge seems to be playing hardball with Posey with zero leverage .  If he doesn't sign Posey that would be a huge loss considering what is left out there.  I'd be highly upset if Ainge compromised the teams chances of repeating by trying to be a hardass.   Posey is worth 4 years at the full MLE and Danny needs to give it to him so he can move on and try to complete the roster.

Let's not forget that until last season, Danny hasn't been all that good with trades and free agents, which scares me right now.

Ainge's primary obligation is not to Posey, it's to the team. Sure, Posey has been valuable and deserves a nice offer, but Danny can't offer so much that it hurts the rest of the team.

Just like people questioned Ainge in the past because they lacked his long term vision, people are questioning him now, again, because they lack his long term vision. Ainge is proving to be a shrewd business man. And at the end of the day, this is a business.

[Truth Hurts]

How is signing Posey going to hurt the team? Do you think they can get something better for the MLE? I certainly don't. Posey has already proven that he is a perfect fit. Get it done, Danny.

[Chris]

Ainge seems to be playing hardball with Posey with zero leverage .  If he doesn't sign Posey that would be a huge loss considering what is left out there.  I'd be highly upset if Ainge compromised the teams chances of repeating by trying to be a hardass.   Posey is worth 4 years at the full MLE and Danny needs to give it to him so he can move on and try to complete the roster.

Let's not forget that until last season, Danny hasn't been all that good with trades and free agents, which scares me right now.

Ainge's primary obligation is not to Posey, it's to the team. Sure, Posey has been valuable and deserves a nice offer, but Danny can't offer so much that it hurts the rest of the team.

Just like people questioned Ainge in the past because they lacked his long term vision, people are questioning him now, again, because they lack his long term vision. Ainge is proving to be a shrewd business man. And at the end of the day, this is a business.

I agree with this.  Although I should say that I don't fault anyone for not having "long-term vision" as a fan.  Fans care about the team winning, and thats it.  While that is also (most) GM's main goal, they also have to take a lot more into consideration....namely, money.  Danny has to be looking down the line how these guys will be effecting the overall pay structure of the team, and how that effects their ability to compete, and reload.  If he does not think that Posey will be worth the money in 3-4 years, then he knows that it would be smart not to make the move.  For a fan, they can say "it is worth it, if they end up winning another championship", but a GM needs to have both the short term and long term plans in mind.

[Chris]

How is signing Posey going to hurt the team? Do you think they can get something better for the MLE? I certainly don't. Posey has already proven that he is a perfect fit. Get it done, Danny.

If they feel that he will break down before the end of the contract (I don't think they have a problem with offering the MLE, I think its the length of the contract that is the issue), then you are giving up cap space in 3-4 years, that could be used to help reload the team as Pierce and Allen start coming off the books, just to have a guy who might be a shell of his former self.

I know I heard rumblings that Posey has had health issues in the past, and may be a risk going forward.  I trust that the team knows more about this than us, and if they do have questions about it, then that is a legit reason not to give him a long extension.

[sk7326]

How is signing Posey going to hurt the team? Do you think they can get something better for the MLE? I certainly don't. Posey has already proven that he is a perfect fit. Get it done, Danny.

That is not the argument, it is the length of the deal.  At Posey's age (32) and skillset (athletic defense, as opposed to the punch in mouth dirty Bruce Bowen/Raja Bell kind), a long deal is a concern.  

[P2]

I'd rather have Barnes/Ross/Evans for up to $3.5M than Posey for the full MLE of $5.5M. We could save up to $10M in four years, and their production wouldn't necessarily drop off, while Posey's is dropping off right now. And right now, Posey is only slightly better in terms of contribution to a championship team than those three guys.

[MBunge]

a long deal is a concern.  

I'd classify a long deal as 5 or 6 years, though.  4 years for Posey seems acceptable.  Barring injury, he should still be reasonably effective for another season or two and he's an expiring deal in year 4, so that's really only 1 season he could be a burden.  That's the sort of thing you have to be willing to do to compete for a title.

Mike

[Truth Hurts]

How quickly everyone forgets...

Posey is 31, not 32. Posey does not have declining skills. Did you people even watch the playoffs? He was HUGE for us. He is the perfect fit as a 6th man on this team.

There are so many teams who have so much dead money on their cap, that have no chance of winning a title. Are you really willing to sacrifice our best chance of winning championships over the next three years because you are afraid to have $7-8 million of dead money on our 2012 salary cap? That is ludicrous. We can sign Posey, and contend for years, or lose him to CLE or LAL and watch them win the title. Posey was a difference maker for us in the post-season. In the words of JVG- "Posey commits a foul after every whistle."  His toughness, defense, attitude, floor spacing and clutch shooting were incredibly important to us. We had freaking Vin Baker on our cap for years without even having the player, or any chance to win.

Me, I'd sign him, and worry about 2012 later.

[Chris]

I'd rather have Barnes/Ross/Evans for up to $3.5M than Posey for the full MLE of $5.5M. We could save up to $10M in four years, and their production wouldn't necessarily drop off, while Posey's is dropping off right now. And right now, Posey is only slightly better in terms of contribution to a championship team than those three guys.

I am not ready to go this far.  I think if we can get Posey for 2-3 years at the MLE, he is still significantly more valuable to this team than those guys, because of the chemistry and leadership he brings.  But if he is holding out for more than 3 years...well, all of those guys would be nice replacements.

[Truth Hurts]

You would really like to have that pu-pu platter of horsecrap rather than Posey for a 4yr deal?

None of those guys give you what Posey does. You give him the four year deal and worry about his declining skills later. Sometimes you have to overpay a bit. When you're contending for a championship every year, it makes it a little easier to accept.

And there's always the chance that he plays well in 2012, at 35 yrs old, playing 20 minutes a game.

[bucknersrevenge]

How is signing Posey going to hurt the team? Do you think they can get something better for the MLE? I certainly don't. Posey has already proven that he is a perfect fit. Get it done, Danny.

its not about finding one better player than posey for the mle. its about using it to fill several roster spots by spreading it out amongst several players.

[bucknersrevenge]

How quickly everyone forgets...

Posey is 31, not 32. Posey does not have declining skills. Did you people even watch the playoffs? He was HUGE for us. He is the perfect fit as a 6th man on this team.

There are so many teams who have so much dead money on their cap, that have no chance of winning a title. Are you really willing to sacrifice our best chance of winning championships over the next three years because you are afraid to have $7-8 million of dead money on our 2012 salary cap? That is ludicrous. We can sign Posey, and contend for years, or lose him to CLE or LAL and watch them win the title. Posey was a difference maker for us in the post-season. In the words of JVG- "Posey commits a foul after every whistle."  His toughness, defense, attitude, floor spacing and clutch shooting were incredibly important to us. We had freaking Vin Baker on our cap for years without even having the player, or any chance to win.

Me, I'd sign him, and worry about 2012 later.

so now a 6th man that averages 7ppg decides who wins a title next year simply by picking a team? well hell lets just sign him now and raise our 18th banner.

[Truth Hurts]

so now a 6th man that averages 7ppg decides who wins a title next year simply by picking a team? well hell lets just sign him now and raise our 18th banner.

I didn't realize that ppg was the only way to evaluate a player. Maybe we should get rid of Rondo, too? He only scores 10 ppg and he plays more minutes.

Posey is the kind of player that every title team has. He can defend three positions, he is an agitator, he opens up the floor with his shooting and allows the primary scorers room to operate. Posey is EXACTLY what CLE and LAL need. He would make a difference for them, and losing him would set us back.

But hey, thank heavens we won't have that $7 million on our 2011-2012 cap! That would be crippling! I'm sure someone else will step up and give us what Posey did. Maybe we can bring back Ron Mercer?

[BballTim]

We can sign Posey, and contend for years, or lose him to CLE or LAL and watch them win the title.

  Just so there's no confusion, Posey wears number 41, not number 5 or 34.