Author Topic: Is Danny Ainge the best GM in the NBA (or sports for that matter)?  (Read 8616 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Re: Is Danny Ainge the best GM in the NBA (or sports for that matter)?
« Reply #45 on: July 08, 2008, 02:28:51 AM »

Offline nickagneta

  • Paul Pierce
  • ***************************
  • Posts: 27190
  • Tommy Points: 2043
Uh-oh!!

I see a return of one last offseason's most heated thread topics!!

Danny Ainge got lucky vs Danny Ainge is a genius who planned this the whole way through.



I was not trying to start that debate. 


I was trying to say that all good GMs have a combination of luck and skill because of this comment

Quote
I kinda just think the SA guy was smart not to bring back David Robinson when he was healthy, lucky to get Duncan, and lucky Tony Parker slipped to where he did in the draft.  Other than that i guess he's pretty good.

Quote
Basically, he drafted two all-stars (Parker and Manu) that every other team passed over.

He has found the best teammates to surround his best player (that the team lucked into)

being a good GM is as much about luck as it is about skills.


Ainge was lucky that two 30+ stars on bad teams came available at the perfect time for the Celtics (when they had a top draft pick, a young stud in Jefferson and two short term large money contracts)  Ainge did a good job gathering those pieces, but had luck in terms of the other teams.



So I am in no way diminishing what Ainge did this past season.  As I said on the 2nd post
Quote
He was the best GM in the NBA last year. 


So I am in no way trying to restart such a discussion. 


 :)
Oh I wasn't saying you were, all I was saying is that I could see it going that way.

I happen to think you're 100% correct and that the luck/talent argument is very much a what came first the chicken or the egg argument.

You need to have luck to put yourself into a position to use your talent and you have to have talent to recognize that luck and take advantage of it.

Danny was and continues to be both. He had the talent to draft young talent and then the talent to know who would be best suited to teach and coach and develop that talent and hire them.

He was lucky because so many teams passed on that talent and because the man he wanted to coach and develop the talent was available.

He was talented enough to recognize the dynamic that bringing in a KG and RA would be like. He was talented enough to get the deals done and he was lucky in that circumstances at both those teams made superstars of the caliber available.

But I digress.

What I was trying to say is that the convo seemed to be going in the same general direction as those threads last summer and I could see it going that way again.

Danny had some luck and he has a abundance of skill and saying that he had luck in no way diminishes what Danny did last year. I personally can't see how any of the work put in in this franchise last year wasn't anything but sterling. From Danny to Doc to the assistant coaches to the trainers to the players, everyone was outstanding. Everyone. And the team was kinda lucky as well. Little to no injuries. No major season ending injuries. The availability of Brown and Cassell. Etc. etc.

Sorry wd, next time I will try to be clearer. Besides if you did bring back that argument, that's not really a bad thing. They were actually very entertaining threads last offseason and I enjoyed them tremendously

Re: Is Danny Ainge the best GM in the NBA (or sports for that matter)?
« Reply #46 on: July 08, 2008, 03:03:46 AM »

Offline TripleOT

  • Chat Moderator
  • Don Chaney
  • *
  • Posts: 1993
  • Tommy Points: 213
Before former Celtics Kevin Prickard (bet you didn't know that -- 11 games in 91-92)is crowned as the best GM in the NBA, shouldn't his team post at least one winning record?

The Spurs front office is the best.  Ainge and Co. are climbing into that lofty area.  If the Cs can win a few more titles in the KG era, he would be their equal, but until then, Buford/Pop are the best.

 

Re: Is Danny Ainge the best GM in the NBA (or sports for that matter)?
« Reply #47 on: February 03, 2013, 09:41:14 PM »

Offline OttawaCeltic

  • Jared Sullinger
  • Posts: 332
  • Tommy Points: 19
He sucks now...
Jameer an elite PG?Please, ask that to his garbage highlights.



PAUL PIERCE, NO!

Re: Is Danny Ainge the best GM in the NBA (or sports for that matter)?
« Reply #48 on: February 03, 2013, 09:44:24 PM »

Offline BudweiserCeltic

  • Frank Ramsey
  • ************
  • Posts: 12383
  • Tommy Points: 1197
He sucks now...

So he constructs a team that is flourishing even though two of their biggest contributors this season are out for the season, and he sucks?

Yeah, try again.

Re: Is Danny Ainge the best GM in the NBA (or sports for that matter)?
« Reply #49 on: February 03, 2013, 09:48:13 PM »

Offline OttawaCeltic

  • Jared Sullinger
  • Posts: 332
  • Tommy Points: 19
He sucks now...

So he constructs a team that is flourishing even though two of their biggest contributors this season are out for the season, and he sucks?

Yeah, try again.

Okay I'll try again...

The conclusion of the Perk trade was one of the most questionnable trades in the decade. Trading a key piece to another championship, not to mention having two other injury prone centers, in the middle of chasing one last ring for the big 3?

Also letting go of Ray A for dealing with Rondo? Also for drafting horribly pre-Bradley? Also for not firing overrated coach Doc "the all talk" Rivers?

Too much on my mind bro...
Jameer an elite PG?Please, ask that to his garbage highlights.



PAUL PIERCE, NO!

Re: Is Danny Ainge the best GM in the NBA (or sports for that matter)?
« Reply #50 on: February 03, 2013, 09:52:33 PM »

Offline CelticConcourse

  • Paul Silas
  • ******
  • Posts: 6175
  • Tommy Points: 382
  • Jeff Green
Best in sports? Not by a long shot.
Jeff Green - Top 5 SF

[Kevin Garnett]
"I've always said J. Green is going to be one of the best players to ever play this game"

Re: Is Danny Ainge the best GM in the NBA (or sports for that matter)?
« Reply #51 on: February 03, 2013, 09:53:30 PM »

Offline crimson_stallion

  • Don Chaney
  • *
  • Posts: 1664
  • Tommy Points: 231
I'd say he is certainly up there, and the Spurs GM has got to be up there as well - San Antonio always manage to pull of incredibly moves that dramatically help their team.


Re: Is Danny Ainge the best GM in the NBA (or sports for that matter)?
« Reply #52 on: February 03, 2013, 09:53:55 PM »

Offline BudweiserCeltic

  • Frank Ramsey
  • ************
  • Posts: 12383
  • Tommy Points: 1197
He sucks now...

So he constructs a team that is flourishing even though two of their biggest contributors this season are out for the season, and he sucks?

Yeah, try again.

Okay I'll try again...

The conclusion of the Perk trade was one of the most questionnable trades in the decade. Trading a key piece to another championship, not to mention having two other injury prone centers, in the middle of chasing one last ring for the big 3?

Also letting go of Ray A for dealing with Rondo? Also for drafting horribly pre-Bradley? Also for not firing overrated coach Doc "the all talk" Rivers?

Too much on my mind bro...

Questionable, but not wrong. It was a good trade.

What's wrong with letting Ray Allen go exactly? Ray Allen left, so what? Sorry if I don't concern myself too much about how Danny drafted with picks at the very end of the draft.

Why would he fire Doc Rivers? Overrated he may be, but he's still on of our best recruiting assets to get talented player to come and play for the Celtics. For good or worse, he's not incompetent.

Re: Is Danny Ainge the best GM in the NBA (or sports for that matter)?
« Reply #53 on: February 03, 2013, 09:57:25 PM »

Offline hpantazo

  • Danny Ainge
  • **********
  • Posts: 10979
  • Tommy Points: 934
He sucks now...

So he constructs a team that is flourishing even though two of their biggest contributors this season are out for the season, and he sucks?

Yeah, try again.

Okay I'll try again...

The conclusion of the Perk trade was one of the most questionnable trades in the decade. Trading a key piece to another championship, not to mention having two other injury prone centers, in the middle of chasing one last ring for the big 3?

Also letting go of Ray A for dealing with Rondo? Also for drafting horribly pre-Bradley? Also for not firing overrated coach Doc "the all talk" Rivers?

Too much on my mind bro...

I disagree.

Perk was going to get, and he did get, overpaid, and we got Green and Melo for him. Solid deal imo. Perk was a shell of his former self for over a year after his return from knee surgery, he wasn't going to bring us banner 18.

Ray left because he didn't want to admit that he's washed up. So far, Danny and Doc were completely correct on that one. Ray sucked last year, and he sucks on the heat so far. He can't dribble, throws the ball away, and is a defensive liability. All he can do is hit open jumpers and free throws.

Drafting poorly before Bradley? Are you kidding me? He drafted Rondo, Big Al, etc. Ainge is consistently one of the best at drafting.

If you want to criticize him on anything, it should be for not re-signing Tony Allen. That was his most costly move imo. We missed TA for two years, may have cost us a banner.

Re: Is Danny Ainge the best GM in the NBA (or sports for that matter)?
« Reply #54 on: February 03, 2013, 09:59:12 PM »

Offline OttawaCeltic

  • Jared Sullinger
  • Posts: 332
  • Tommy Points: 19
He sucks now...

So he constructs a team that is flourishing even though two of their biggest contributors this season are out for the season, and he sucks?

Yeah, try again.

Okay I'll try again...

The conclusion of the Perk trade was one of the most questionnable trades in the decade. Trading a key piece to another championship, not to mention having two other injury prone centers, in the middle of chasing one last ring for the big 3?

Also letting go of Ray A for dealing with Rondo? Also for drafting horribly pre-Bradley? Also for not firing overrated coach Doc "the all talk" Rivers?

Too much on my mind bro...

Questionable, but not wrong. It was a good trade.

What's wrong with letting Ray Allen go exactly? Ray Allen left, so what? Sorry if I don't concern myself too much about how Danny drafted with picks at the very end of the draft.

Why would he fire Doc Rivers? Overrated he may be, but he's still on of our best recruiting assets to get talented player to come and play for the Celtics. For good or worse, he's not incompetent.

Yeah, I know I luv Jeff Green's game so much right now, but I'd rather have that shot for a championship at that moment. Ray Allen was highly influenced by Rondo's stubbornness to leave Beantown. Yeah, you dont concern yourself for the draft picks since your that guy who wanted JR Giddens for crying out loud ::)

Also, there are plenty of other unhired coaches that other players could love to join them on a team.
Jameer an elite PG?Please, ask that to his garbage highlights.



PAUL PIERCE, NO!

Re: Is Danny Ainge the best GM in the NBA (or sports for that matter)?
« Reply #55 on: February 03, 2013, 10:03:28 PM »

Offline BudweiserCeltic

  • Frank Ramsey
  • ************
  • Posts: 12383
  • Tommy Points: 1197
He sucks now...

So he constructs a team that is flourishing even though two of their biggest contributors this season are out for the season, and he sucks?

Yeah, try again.

Okay I'll try again...

The conclusion of the Perk trade was one of the most questionnable trades in the decade. Trading a key piece to another championship, not to mention having two other injury prone centers, in the middle of chasing one last ring for the big 3?

Also letting go of Ray A for dealing with Rondo? Also for drafting horribly pre-Bradley? Also for not firing overrated coach Doc "the all talk" Rivers?

Too much on my mind bro...

Questionable, but not wrong. It was a good trade.

What's wrong with letting Ray Allen go exactly? Ray Allen left, so what? Sorry if I don't concern myself too much about how Danny drafted with picks at the very end of the draft.

Why would he fire Doc Rivers? Overrated he may be, but he's still on of our best recruiting assets to get talented player to come and play for the Celtics. For good or worse, he's not incompetent.

Yeah, I know I luv Jeff Green's game so much right now, but I'd rather have that shot for a championship at that moment. Ray Allen was highly influenced by Rondo's stubbornness to leave Beantown. Yeah, you dont concern yourself for the draft picks since your that guy who wanted JR Giddens for crying out loud ::)

Also, there are plenty of other unhired coaches that other players could love to join them on a team.

Huh? I don't care one way or another. We drafted Giddens, was curious as to why he was signed, liked the prospects of what he could bring defensively and with his rebounding. I don't recall EVER pushing for Ainge to draft Giddens. So he was a bust, it happens... you're getting a bit ridiculous with your arguments.

You might have forgotten though that when we traded for Jeff Green we didn't have a back-up SF, that's the reason the trade was made essentially. Perk was also hobbling, he was traded for a healthy Center and a SF. BTW, Perk sucked badly that year in the playoffs.

Re: Is Danny Ainge the best GM in the NBA (or sports for that matter)?
« Reply #56 on: February 03, 2013, 10:04:18 PM »

Offline hpantazo

  • Danny Ainge
  • **********
  • Posts: 10979
  • Tommy Points: 934
He sucks now...

So he constructs a team that is flourishing even though two of their biggest contributors this season are out for the season, and he sucks?

Yeah, try again.

Okay I'll try again...

The conclusion of the Perk trade was one of the most questionnable trades in the decade. Trading a key piece to another championship, not to mention having two other injury prone centers, in the middle of chasing one last ring for the big 3?

Also letting go of Ray A for dealing with Rondo? Also for drafting horribly pre-Bradley? Also for not firing overrated coach Doc "the all talk" Rivers?

Too much on my mind bro...

Questionable, but not wrong. It was a good trade.

What's wrong with letting Ray Allen go exactly? Ray Allen left, so what? Sorry if I don't concern myself too much about how Danny drafted with picks at the very end of the draft.

Why would he fire Doc Rivers? Overrated he may be, but he's still on of our best recruiting assets to get talented player to come and play for the Celtics. For good or worse, he's not incompetent.

Yeah, I know I luv Jeff Green's game so much right now, but I'd rather have that shot for a championship at that moment. Ray Allen was highly influenced by Rondo's stubbornness to leave Beantown. Yeah, you dont concern yourself for the draft picks since your that guy who wanted JR Giddens for crying out loud ::)

Also, there are plenty of other unhired coaches that other players could love to join them on a team.

Ray left because he knew that the only way to hide his degraded skills was to shoot open jumpers off double teams that Lebron and Wade get in Miami. He was just too proud to say it.

Perk was useless the year we traded him. He was not bringing any team a championship that year. He's not much better now after he fully recovered either, and he gets paid too much for what he is.

And again, Ainge is one of the best at drafting in the NBA.

Doc Rivers, for all his issues with game strategies, is one of the most influential pieces when it comes to us getting players to come here.

Re: Is Danny Ainge the best GM in the NBA (or sports for that matter)?
« Reply #57 on: February 03, 2013, 10:06:28 PM »

Offline hpantazo

  • Danny Ainge
  • **********
  • Posts: 10979
  • Tommy Points: 934
He sucks now...

So he constructs a team that is flourishing even though two of their biggest contributors this season are out for the season, and he sucks?

Yeah, try again.

Okay I'll try again...

The conclusion of the Perk trade was one of the most questionnable trades in the decade. Trading a key piece to another championship, not to mention having two other injury prone centers, in the middle of chasing one last ring for the big 3?

Also letting go of Ray A for dealing with Rondo? Also for drafting horribly pre-Bradley? Also for not firing overrated coach Doc "the all talk" Rivers?

Too much on my mind bro...

Questionable, but not wrong. It was a good trade.

What's wrong with letting Ray Allen go exactly? Ray Allen left, so what? Sorry if I don't concern myself too much about how Danny drafted with picks at the very end of the draft.

Why would he fire Doc Rivers? Overrated he may be, but he's still on of our best recruiting assets to get talented player to come and play for the Celtics. For good or worse, he's not incompetent.

Yeah, I know I luv Jeff Green's game so much right now, but I'd rather have that shot for a championship at that moment. Ray Allen was highly influenced by Rondo's stubbornness to leave Beantown. Yeah, you dont concern yourself for the draft picks since your that guy who wanted JR Giddens for crying out loud ::)

Also, there are plenty of other unhired coaches that other players could love to join them on a team.

Huh? I don't care one way or another. We drafted Giddens, was curious as to why he was signed, liked the prospects of what he could bring defensively and with his rebounding. I don't recall EVER pushing for Ainge to draft Giddens. So he was a bust, it happens... you're getting a bit ridiculous with your arguments.

You might have forgotten though that when we traded for Jeff Green we didn't have a back-up SF, that's the reason the trade was made essentially. Perk was also hobbling, he was traded for a healthy Center and a SF. BTW, Perk sucked badly that year in the playoffs.

Yep, not only did he suck badly, he sucked badly on defense, which is where we would have needed him the most. Amazing how people act as if we traded away Mutombo in his prime or something.

Re: Is Danny Ainge the best GM in the NBA (or sports for that matter)?
« Reply #58 on: February 03, 2013, 10:08:14 PM »

Offline Roy H.

  • Forums Manager
  • Dave Cowens
  • ***********************
  • Posts: 23822
  • Tommy Points: -29119
  • 33,333 posts and counting . . .
Why are we bumping threads from over four years ago again?  Is it just to try to pick fights?


D. Cousins / F. Ezeli / P. Antic
D. West / R. Anderson / C. Copeland
L. Deng / V. Carter / D. Rudez
A. Iguodala / M. Ginobil / B. Gordon
K. Irving / S. Livingston / S. Blake

Once a CrotoNat, always a CrotoNat.  CelticsBlog Draft Champions, 2009 & 2012

Re: Is Danny Ainge the best GM in the NBA (or sports for that matter)?
« Reply #59 on: February 03, 2013, 10:13:06 PM »

Offline danglertx

  • Rajon Rondo
  • Posts: 812
  • Tommy Points: 72
Ainge was lucky that two 30+ stars on bad teams came available at the perfect time for the Celtics (when they had a top draft pick, a young stud in Jefferson and two short term large money contracts)  Ainge did a good job gathering those pieces, but had luck in terms of the other teams. 

  Did you really think it was so surprising that KG was on the market? He had like 1 year left on his contract and Minny was going nowhere.

Not surprising, but lucky.


The T-Wolves could have pulled the plug the year before or year after.

The thing that everyone forgets in the KG deal is that the Celtics were the only team Minny would trade KG too.  KG wouldn't sign an extension with any team that was losing and any team that KG would sign an extension to go to would have no shot of being a lottery team. So a number one draft pick was essentially meaningless from those teams.

What the Wolves needed was a draft pick that would be a sure fire lottery pick and only the Celtics could offer that because they had the Wolves #1 pick.  If the Wolves trade Garnett, they are definitely in the lottery. 

Add to that Al Jefferson who was and has been a very good player and the Wolves did alright in that deal.

 

Hello! Guest

Welcome to the CelticsBlog Forums.

Welcome to CelticsBlog