G S retaliates with max offer to Brand

[Who]

Mullin should try to trade Jackson and Harrington for bad players with expirings, young players with upside and draft picks.

My favourite trade idea of the summer was Stephen Jackson and Al Harrington to the Lakers for Lamar Odom.

Odom replaces most of the outgoing talent and is an expiring contract. His rebounding, overall quality and style of play would fit in very nicely in GSW.

Stephen Jackson gives the Lakers their top defensive small forward. Also a fearless competitor and leader who's been there and done that. A good scorer, ballhandler, passer and rebounder. Quality starter. Al Harrington brings a combo forward who plays defense while supplying very good scoring and shooting off the bench.

GSW should hunt for that. It's a good deal for them. Moves their long term contracts out of the way. They should have hunted for that deal anyway with Baron because it would have made them better.

[cordobes]

Mullin should try to trade Jackson and Harrington for bad players with expirings, young players with upside and draft picks.

My favourite trade idea of the summer was Stephen Jackson and Al Harrington to the Lakers for Lamar Odom.

Odom replaces most of the outgoing talent and is an expiring contract. His rebounding, overall quality and style of play would fit in very nicely in GSW.

Stephen Jackson gives the Lakers their top defensive small forward. Also a fearless competitor and leader who's been there and done that. A good scorer, ballhandler, passer and rebounder. Quality starter. Al Harrington brings a combo forward who plays defense while supplying very good scoring and shooting off the bench.

GSW should hunt for that. It's a good deal for them. Moves their long term contracts out of the way. They should have hunted for that deal anyway with Baron because it would have made them better.

If the Lakers were able to throw in Farmar/Ariza plus picks and cash I'd probably do it, but I hope that Mullin can find something more interesting if he wants to trade Harrington and Jackson. I don't know exactly what teams have the kind of assets to built a better package... Cleveland, Portland clearly... although it's hard to imagine a reason for any of them to make an offer. Jackson+Harrington for Odom I don't think is enough. They need a couple of players/picks that they can trade or lock up in a year or two. But it's a good (and scary) idea.

[winsomme]

Mullin should try to trade Jackson and Harrington for bad players with expirings, young players with upside and draft picks.

My favourite trade idea of the summer was Stephen Jackson and Al Harrington to the Lakers for Lamar Odom.

Odom replaces most of the outgoing talent and is an expiring contract. His rebounding, overall quality and style of play would fit in very nicely in GSW.

Stephen Jackson gives the Lakers their top defensive small forward. Also a fearless competitor and leader who's been there and done that. A good scorer, ballhandler, passer and rebounder. Quality starter. Al Harrington brings a combo forward who plays defense while supplying very good scoring and shooting off the bench.

GSW should hunt for that. It's a good deal for them. Moves their long term contracts out of the way. They should have hunted for that deal anyway with Baron because it would have made them better.

either way GSs salary situation is pretty open. i'm just not sure who is going to be out there to spend it on.

i was just talking to a friend of mine about this and wondered if there was any chance things soured in TOR and Bosh looked to play elsewhere....other than him, who are the guys on the horizon coming available that you can build a team around.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Golden State should try to get Arenas, or just offer Corey Maggette a two year deal, even if they over pay him. That should be their best options... Josh Smith is the other one, but he's probably looking for a long term contract, still he should be a good fit in their system.

[johnnyrondo]

Golden State should try to get Arenas, or just offer Corey Maggette a two year deal, even if they over pay him. That should be their best options... Steve Smith is the other one, but he's probably looking for a long term contract, still he should be a good fit in their system.

You must mean josh Smith. He would be a good fit. Steve Smith, I would assume would come pretty cheap.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Golden State should try to get Arenas, or just offer Corey Maggette a two year deal, even if they over pay him. That should be their best options... Steve Smith is the other one, but he's probably looking for a long term contract, still he should be a good fit in their system.

You must mean josh Smith. He would be a good fit. Steve Smith, I would assume would come pretty cheap.

Lol, indeed Josh Smith... a Steve Smith comeback would be awesome though.

[EJPLAYA]

posted this in the other thread but this thread is more fitting...

If Elton Brand does not take this contract with the Warriors he is an absolute fool! Forget his "friendship" with Baron Davis, forget the fact that the Warriors don't have a PG and he would be in a little better talent situation with the Clippers. He is never going to win a championship with either one of those pathetic teams. Leaving 20 million on the table by re-signing with the Clips would be one of the all-time dumbest moves ever. In about 15 years when he has completely burned through this lower contracts money, like most athletes do, he will sure be wishing for that extra 20 million he should have had. You are crazy if you don't take this deal Elton!!!!!

[winsomme]

posted this in the other thread but this thread is more fitting...

If Elton Brand does not take this contract with the Warriors he is an absolute fool! Forget his "friendship" with Baron Davis, forget the fact that the Warriors don't have a PG and he would be in a little better talent situation with the Clippers. He is never going to win a championship with either one of those pathetic teams. Leaving 20 million on the table by re-signing with the Clips would be one of the all-time dumbest moves ever. In about 15 years when he has completely burned through this lower contracts money, like most athletes do, he will sure be wishing for that extra 20 million he should have had. You are crazy if you don't take this deal Elton!!!!!

well the extension that KG signed here was a lot more reasonable than anybody thought it would be.

and the Clipps would IMO be significantly better team with Brand than GS with Brand....GS can't quite figure out what they are doing (rebuilding or going for the playoffs). i actually think they should have not traded Richardson. i liked that core of Baron, JRich, Jacks,Biendrins with Monta off the bench....but i think they have been moving towards rebuilding mode the last couple of years...

that said, if they were willing to trade some of their chips and sign Brand, they could get back in the hunt, but if was Brand, i would want to know the answer to that question before signing with them because their roster is pretty confusing right now..

and Baron, Gordon, Thornton, Brand and Kaman is definitely a playoff squad.

[cordobes]

posted this in the other thread but this thread is more fitting...

If Elton Brand does not take this contract with the Warriors he is an absolute fool! Forget his "friendship" with Baron Davis, forget the fact that the Warriors don't have a PG and he would be in a little better talent situation with the Clippers. He is never going to win a championship with either one of those pathetic teams. Leaving 20 million on the table by re-signing with the Clips would be one of the all-time dumbest moves ever. In about 15 years when he has completely burned through this lower contracts money, like most athletes do, he will sure be wishing for that extra 20 million he should have had. You are crazy if you don't take this deal Elton!!!!!

Little better talent situation? Clippers are not crap anymore. They won't be contending for more than a playoff spot next year, but if Gordon pans out, Thornton continues to develop and if they spend their exceptions wisely next season and use their expirings to get some more help, they are definitely contenders as long as their core is healthy.

And Brand isn't signing a low contract with the Clippers and not turning down $20M. The max the Warriors can offer him is $90M/5years. Clippers will probably sign for $90M/6years. It's not really a $20M difference, it's a "how much money will Brand make in his 1st year after he's 34 years old?" difference. Adjusting to inflation, we may very well be talking about the MLE here. Or the LLE. Would you leave LA, your home, your movie businesses and a more talented team to end your career with $178M instead of $175m?

Anyway, it's not Brand's decision. Warriors can only sign him if the Clippers renounce to his Bird rights and they're not going to do that. And I don't think Mullin is very serious about this. If Brand signs for them, that would jeopardize his ability to retain Biedrins and Ellis. What do you think it's more important? He doesn't really trying to sign Brand, just getting a S&T for Davis. But it's improbable. This offer is more about epater le bourgeouis than anything else.

[winsomme]

posted this in the other thread but this thread is more fitting...

If Elton Brand does not take this contract with the Warriors he is an absolute fool! Forget his "friendship" with Baron Davis, forget the fact that the Warriors don't have a PG and he would be in a little better talent situation with the Clippers. He is never going to win a championship with either one of those pathetic teams. Leaving 20 million on the table by re-signing with the Clips would be one of the all-time dumbest moves ever. In about 15 years when he has completely burned through this lower contracts money, like most athletes do, he will sure be wishing for that extra 20 million he should have had. You are crazy if you don't take this deal Elton!!!!!

Little better talent situation? Clippers are not crap anymore. They won't be contending for more than a playoff spot next year, but if Gordon pans out, Thornton continues to develop and if they spend their exceptions wisely next season and use their expirings to get some more help, they are definitely contenders as long as their core is healthy.

And Brand isn't signing a low contract with the Clippers and not turning down $20M. The max the Warriors can offer him is $90M/5years. Clippers will probably sign for $90M/6years. It's not really a $20M difference, it's a "how much money will Brand make in his 1st year after he's 34 years old?" difference. Adjusting to inflation, we may very well be talking about the MLE here. Or the LLE. Would you leave LA, your home, your movie businesses and a more talented team to end your career with $178M instead of $175m?

Anyway, it's not Brand's decision. Warriors can only sign him if the Clippers renounce to his Bird rights and they're not going to do that. And I don't think Mullin is very serious about this. If Brand signs for them, that would jeopardize his ability to retain Biedrins and Ellis. What do you think it's more important? He doesn't really trying to sign Brand, just getting a S&T for Davis. But it's improbable. This offer is more about epater le bourgeouis than anything else.

can explain why the Warriors can only sign Brand if the Clipps renounce his Bird rights? he's not a UFA?

plus, don't forget the Sixers...

[cordobes]

posted this in the other thread but this thread is more fitting...

If Elton Brand does not take this contract with the Warriors he is an absolute fool! Forget his "friendship" with Baron Davis, forget the fact that the Warriors don't have a PG and he would be in a little better talent situation with the Clippers. He is never going to win a championship with either one of those pathetic teams. Leaving 20 million on the table by re-signing with the Clips would be one of the all-time dumbest moves ever. In about 15 years when he has completely burned through this lower contracts money, like most athletes do, he will sure be wishing for that extra 20 million he should have had. You are crazy if you don't take this deal Elton!!!!!

Little better talent situation? Clippers are not crap anymore. They won't be contending for more than a playoff spot next year, but if Gordon pans out, Thornton continues to develop and if they spend their exceptions wisely next season and use their expirings to get some more help, they are definitely contenders as long as their core is healthy.

And Brand isn't signing a low contract with the Clippers and not turning down $20M. The max the Warriors can offer him is $90M/5years. Clippers will probably sign for $90M/6years. It's not really a $20M difference, it's a "how much money will Brand make in his 1st year after he's 34 years old?" difference. Adjusting to inflation, we may very well be talking about the MLE here. Or the LLE. Would you leave LA, your home, your movie businesses and a more talented team to end your career with $178M instead of $175m?

Anyway, it's not Brand's decision. Warriors can only sign him if the Clippers renounce to his Bird rights and they're not going to do that. And I don't think Mullin is very serious about this. If Brand signs for them, that would jeopardize his ability to retain Biedrins and Ellis. What do you think it's more important? He doesn't really trying to sign Brand, just getting a S&T for Davis. But it's improbable. This offer is more about epater le bourgeouis than anything else.

can explain why the Warriors can only sign Brand if the Clipps renounce his Bird rights? he's not a UFA?

plus, don't forget the Sixers...

Yeah, of course he's an UFA, terrible and misleading phrasing of mine. What I meant to say was that the Clips can give him a better deal than the Warriors, unless they renounce to his rights, something they won't do. The Sixers can only offer him the same max contract, 5yrs/$90M (assuming they have enough room under the cap)... TP for keeping me honest.

[johnnyrondo]

posted this in the other thread but this thread is more fitting...

If Elton Brand does not take this contract with the Warriors he is an absolute fool! Forget his "friendship" with Baron Davis, forget the fact that the Warriors don't have a PG and he would be in a little better talent situation with the Clippers. He is never going to win a championship with either one of those pathetic teams. Leaving 20 million on the table by re-signing with the Clips would be one of the all-time dumbest moves ever. In about 15 years when he has completely burned through this lower contracts money, like most athletes do, he will sure be wishing for that extra 20 million he should have had. You are crazy if you don't take this deal Elton!!!!!

You're making a lot of assumptions based on NBA player stereotypes EJPLAYA. Brand seems like an intelligent guy and I don't think he will have burned through his money in 15 years. Also the only reason that that offer is available from GS is due to the prearranged deal with Baron. Otherwise Baron doesn't opt out. So yes, Brand could pull a Boozer to make a little more by playing somewhere he doesn't like as much. But he's not going to do that, b/c a) he's made a lot of money already and will get a good contract from the Clippers. b) he likes living in L.A. and c) he made an agreement with Baron and he has better character than that. Elton brand can buy whatever he wants in life whether he takes the L.A. offer or the GS offer. He'll be on the Clippers next year and that's the right choice.

The poor Jazz fans will get Boozered next year when he talks all this year about resigning, uses the Jazz to pump up his contract value, but then signs with the Heat. Boozer's a snake.

[vjcsmoke]

Well the thing is that since Brand has opted out, he has a lot of leverage in this situation.
He might want to go back to the Clippers, but he's going to listen to all the offers, then he's going to go back to LA and say, listen this is what I've been offered, can you at least match it? 
If the Clippers match, they get a very nice core of Brand + Baron DAvis. 
If they don't, Brand might be wearing a new uniform next year.

[johnnyrondo]

Well the thing is that since Brand has opted out, he has a lot of leverage in this situation.
He might want to go back to the Clippers, but he's going to listen to all the offers, then he's going to go back to LA and say, listen this is what I've been offered, can you at least match it? 
If the Clippers match, they get a very nice core of Brand + Baron DAvis. 
If they don't, Brand might be wearing a new uniform next year.

But somehow there not allowed to match. They lost their Bird Rights when they signed Baron Davis. What Brand can do is say "hey I'm willing to take less to stay here, but move a contract or two so that I can make a little more." The problem then is that if they move players they become less competitive.

[Roy Hobbs]

Well the thing is that since Brand has opted out, he has a lot of leverage in this situation.
He might want to go back to the Clippers, but he's going to listen to all the offers, then he's going to go back to LA and say, listen this is what I've been offered, can you at least match it? 
If the Clippers match, they get a very nice core of Brand + Baron DAvis. 
If they don't, Brand might be wearing a new uniform next year.

But somehow there not allowed to match. They lost their Bird Rights when they signed Baron Davis. What Brand can do is say "hey I'm willing to take less to stay here, but move a contract or two so that I can make a little more." The problem then is that if they move players they become less competitive.

That's not 100% accurate.  The Clippers haven't lost their Bird rights.

The problem is, they can't sign Davis until they clear up enough cap room to do so.  Both Corey Maggette and Elton Brand have a "cap hold" on their contracts, that is actually for a greater amount than their previous contracts.  This eats up their cap space.

There are three ways to release a cap hold:  1) if the player signs with a new team, 2) if you renounce the player, or 3) if you sign him.

The Clippers are renouncing Maggette, and are hoping to sign Brand.  When they do so, they'll sign him for a lesser salary than his cap hold.  This, in turn, will free up cap space, so they can sign Davis.

The Clippers still would have Bird rights, meaning they'd be able to sign Brand for as much as they wanted (up to the max salary).  However, if they did so, they wouldn't be able to sign Davis.