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Celtics Weakness?
« on: June 01, 2008, 11:22:14 PM »

Offline Discoflux

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Can someone direct me to the thread about Celtics weaknesses for the Finals series?

The way I see it (based on a very low sample of 5 games in the playoffs) the Celtics
#1 and weakness is Consistency. 

What I mean by that is that they seem to operate in spurts.  They go hot and cold.  They have glaring breakdowns at key moments in the game. 

They have been able to advance because they do get back on track and salvage the Win. 

Against the Lakers I think a lot of those inconsistent breakdowns are going to be more difficult to overcome to protect the W. 

Does anyone agree/disagree who has more experience watching your team?

Re: Celtics Weakness?
« Reply #1 on: June 01, 2008, 11:27:57 PM »

Offline Redz

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Consistency has been an issue in the post season, though I truly believe the Ce;tics exorcised a lot of those demons in Game 6 vs. Detroit.
Yup

Re: Celtics Weakness?
« Reply #2 on: June 01, 2008, 11:30:18 PM »

Offline Edgar

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Consistency has been an issue in the post season, though I truly believe the Ce;tics exorcised a lot of those demons in Game 6 vs. Detroit.
I will say games 3 and 6
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Re: Celtics Weakness?
« Reply #3 on: June 01, 2008, 11:33:21 PM »

Offline bleedingreen

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The only weakness I see that we have is consistency and Lebron James. We seem pretty solid now though.

Re: Celtics Weakness?
« Reply #4 on: June 01, 2008, 11:34:28 PM »

Offline chibi

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I think one weakness is your point guard play.  Rondo doesn't seem very effective when the ball isn't in his hands.  As a consequence, players like Allen and Pierce have to move away from strengths like shooting and create opportunities for other teammates or take contested shots.  

Sometimes Rondo can be superb, but he has not been consistent.    

Re: Celtics Weakness?
« Reply #5 on: June 01, 2008, 11:36:45 PM »

Offline Who

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They forget how to play offensively.

Lousy execution. Lack of player/ball movement. Lack of touches/shots for Ray Allen. Lack of touches in the post for KG, often go away from KG when he has it going. Point guard play is inconsistent.

That's their biggest flaw and it's all about them. It's not something the opposition can really force. There has been no particular type of defense that brings it on. In the playoffs it happened a lot against Atlanta and Cleveland and they're two monumentally different defenses. Happened some against Detroit but less so. It's all about the men in green.

Re: Celtics Weakness?
« Reply #6 on: June 01, 2008, 11:37:27 PM »

Offline mpfitz34

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We rely too heavily on jump shots.

Re: Celtics Weakness?
« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2008, 11:39:22 PM »

Offline Edgar

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I think one weakness is your point guard play.  Rondo doesn't seem very effective when the ball isn't in his hands.  As a consequence, players like Allen and Pierce have to move away from strengths like shooting and create opportunities for other teammates or take shots contested shots.  

Sometimes Rondo can be superb, but he has not been consistent.    
Good point
u will see we all love rr here I am sure u already realize thate
but u have a valid point here

Other is the capacity to attack constantly, if this team is able to attack on constant basis thneyre almost unbeatable
its jsut that sometimes even with big men from the other team on foul trouble they seem to forget how to attack, rondo No. 1 in the list
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Re: Celtics Weakness?
« Reply #8 on: June 01, 2008, 11:48:07 PM »

Offline jay_jay54

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They forget how to play offensively.

Lousy execution. Lack of player/ball movement. Lack of touches/shots for Ray Allen. Lack of touches in the post for KG, often go away from KG when he has it going. Point guard play is inconsistent.

That's their biggest flaw and it's all about them. It's not something the opposition can really force. There has been no particular type of defense that brings it on. In the playoffs it happened a lot against Atlanta and Cleveland and they're two monumentally different defenses. Happened some against Detroit but less so. It's all about the men in green.
I agree with you here 100%,there are periods in games,where the team can't seem to find any offense,or forgot how to execute what they do know,on offense.Almost like the Spurs,who went through those lows on offense at certains periods of the game.Hope this isnt something,that we experience aganist the Lakers.TP for bringing this point up,its been on my mind for awhile,but didnt think anyone else noticed. 

Re: Celtics Weakness?
« Reply #9 on: June 01, 2008, 11:56:44 PM »

Offline Roy Hobbs

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1) Consistency, particularly from Rondo and Perk.  Really, the whole team outside of KG has struggled a bit with this.

2)  Too many jump shots / lack of a post game.  Someone -- Pierce? -- needs to consistently attack the hoop.  When that happens, we win.

3) Focus on the road.  It looks like we've conquered this one, finally

4) Lack of production from our bench, outside of Posey and occasionally P.J. Brown.  Cassell has been horrible, Baby is inconsistent, and Powe and House don't get playing time.

5) Coaching.  It's at the bottom of the list, but Doc's performance in a handful of games this postseason has been abysmal.  He's improving, though, and has coached very well in most of our recent games.

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Re: Celtics Weakness?
« Reply #10 on: June 02, 2008, 12:18:44 AM »

Offline Celtic

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#1 Weakness, they want to win too much.

#2 Weakness, they execute too well.

They may have a few, but you don't make it to the Finals, being to flawed of a team. Some of the weaknesses the C's have shown are stronger than those same strengths of other teams. Their road woes were well documented, however, probably a little too much, they were the best road team in the League for a reason, now that they just won two in Detroit, I think they are more dangerous than ever.

If I were to honestly pick a weakness, I would have to say at times they become to dependent on jump shots, and besides Pierce, refuse to attack the basket. When they C's play their usual excellent defense, and drive the lane, getting fouls, they are very tough to beat.

Re: Celtics Weakness?
« Reply #11 on: June 02, 2008, 01:28:18 AM »

Offline Bahku

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Just mainly reiterating what Roy already nailed down, but consistency is definitely the C's biggest weakness, and I think it's mainly from the lack of history/playing time with each other. The more games we play, obviously, the better it gets, but we're still a ways from being consistent, at least on a consistent basis, that is. (Sorry) This team is so up-and-down, (or hot-and-cold), and can be playing huge on both ends for ten minutes, then have these complete lapses and totally let down ... it's extremely frustrating to watch.

The next biggest weakness I see is shot selection, or I should say play selection, to be more accurate. This team seems to have a propensity to be a bit lazy, and not continue to attack the basket, even when it's proving to be successful, (which is most of the time). Everybody loves to hit the "Big Shot" and is plagued by the temptation to do so, but we fall back on it far too often, and choose to take a three, even when there's a clear lane to the basket ... it's truly baffling at times.

Following on the list for me would be foul-shooting. This drives me completely nuts, and there's really no good excuse for it. Free-throws are Basketball 101, and for the best team in the NBA to miss so many foul-shots, especially in the playoffs, when every point is crucial, is just absurd to me. Honestly, if I were Doc, I'd spend way more time and energy getting these guys to tighten up from the stripe. Maybe he does already, but it sure as heck isn't enough. These guys should be a bit embarassed about it, and take it upon themselves to do much better. They could have had a much easier time this season, if they'd just hit more of their free-throws.

Fourth in line, I feel, is foul trouble. There have been many games this year, including the post-season, where two or three of the starters, (usually KG, Perk, or Rondo), have been sitting on the bench with two fouls by the middle of the first period. This is really unacceptable, and while the poor officiating has had much to do with it, we should be taking that into consideration, and minimizing the damage as much as possible. There have been so many games where we came out and got off to a great start, then KG and Perk got two quick fouls, and the wind was totally gone from our sails. It kills the momentum, and changes the face of the game.

Keeping it to five, I'd have to say lastly also, that it's the coaching. I think the Detroit series was a step in the right decision ... Doc made some great adjustments and called some very smart offensive plays, especially halftime changes. But unfortunately, there were still times when it was painfully obvious that the wrong players were on the floor, and the match-ups weren't right. Eddie House especially, should be the first one off the bench for Rage, not Sam, and Leon should be used far more than he has been. I also think that the "two-big" or "three-big" line-up should be used more for the subs, especially with LA, and that Sam should be used more as a two-guard, and play with Rondo, not in place of him.
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Re: Celtics Weakness?
« Reply #12 on: June 02, 2008, 02:14:44 AM »

Offline Cooldude5t5

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Sam Cassell playing

Re: Celtics Weakness?
« Reply #13 on: June 02, 2008, 02:31:08 AM »

Offline BudweiserCeltic

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Quote
Keeping it to five, I'd have to say lastly also, that it's the coaching. I think the Detroit series was a step in the right decision ... Doc made some great adjustments and called some very smart offensive plays, especially halftime changes. But unfortunately, there were still times when it was painfully obvious that the wrong players were on the floor, and the match-ups weren't right. Eddie House especially, should be the first one off the bench for Rage, not Sam, and Leon should be used far more than he has been. I also think that the "two-big" or "three-big" line-up should be used more for the subs, especially with LA, and that Sam should be used more as a two-guard, and play with Rondo, not in place of him.

You're a bit off here. Eddie House shouldn't have played in the Pistons' series. Doc gave him a try early on and it was painfully obvious that he wouldn't do much good in there. Heavy dosage of Rondo is what we'll see from now on, and if any of the backups is playing more minutes it's simply because Rondo for some reason or another is not getting it done, even so Doc will play him a lot.  Sam was quite decent against Detroit, aside losing the ball to Hunter. He did a some good without scoring, something that has been quite rare. His ball movement has improved quite a bit since he began the year with us. He still gets a bit carried away now and then, but he's doing it even less... especially since Pierce called him out and told him to "run the play".

There's no reason for this guy to be playing SG, no reason. He either plays PG or sits down. The SG spot should be played by either Ray, Pierce, or Posey... no need to add Cassell to the mix.

With that said, I'd like to see some House against the Lakers to see how he responds, but I still feel that Cassell deserves a shot before him and see if he can rise to the occassion. I like his midrange game, and it has been buggling my mind how he has been missing the shots he has been missing.

Won't even comment on Powe, I'm tired of the subject. Heck, weren't you the one calling for Baby the other day while Powe was in the game?
« Last Edit: June 02, 2008, 02:41:24 AM by BudweiserCeltic »

Re: Celtics Weakness?
« Reply #14 on: June 02, 2008, 02:44:08 AM »

Offline Bahku

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Quote
Keeping it to five, I'd have to say lastly also, that it's the coaching. I think the Detroit series was a step in the right decision ... Doc made some great adjustments and called some very smart offensive plays, especially halftime changes. But unfortunately, there were still times when it was painfully obvious that the wrong players were on the floor, and the match-ups weren't right. Eddie House especially, should be the first one off the bench for Rage, not Sam, and Leon should be used far more than he has been. I also think that the "two-big" or "three-big" line-up should be used more for the subs, especially with LA, and that Sam should be used more as a two-guard, and play with Rondo, not in place of him.

You're a bit off here. Eddie House shouldn't have played in the Pistons' series. Doc gave him a try early on and it was painfully obvious that he wouldn't do much good in there. Heavy dosage of Rondo is what we'll see from now on, and if any of the backups is playing more minutes it's simply because Rondo for some reason or another is not getting it done, even so Doc will play him a lot.  Sam was quite decent against Detroit, aside losing the ball to Hunter. He did a ton of good without scoring, something that has been quite rare. His ball movement has improved quite a bit since he began the year with us. He still gets a bit carried away now and then, but he's doing it even less... especially since Pierce called him out and told him to "run the play".

There's no reason for this guy to be playing SG, no reason. He either plays PG or sits down. The SG spot should be played by either Ray, Pierce, or Posey... no need to add Cassell to the mix.

With that said, I'd like to see some House against the Lakers to see how he responds, but I still feel that Cassell deserves a shot before him and see if he can rise to the occassion. I like his midrange game, and it has been buggling my mind how he has been missing the shots he has been missing.

Won't even comment on Powe, I'm tired of the subject. Heck, weren't you the one calling for Baby the other day while Powe was in the game?

Totally disagree ... Sam was next to useless in the Detroit series, and he should either be used at 2-guard, (where he looked the most effective this season), or used for "garbage" time. He completely destroys the tempo and energy when he comes into the game, and the only time he's remotely effective is when his shot is going down, which is about 1 in 5 games, at the most.

Sam was a horrible move, and every game proves it more. I honestly hope he CAN contribute against the Lakers, but I seriously doubt it. This team is successful when it runs, and Eddie is far more adaptive to the up-tempo game, and much more of a three-point threat, which loosens up the interior for KG and Pierce. Sam has nothing but an inconsistent shot, and a running mouth.
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