Allen/Pierce/House

[celticsguy]

Chalk Pauls performance off to a bad night, he's been great all year. Ray Allen on the other hand has been lukewarm all season and last night was about as bad as he can be, really has not been the shooter he was billed to be when we got him. In the beginning his rep for being a great shooter led everyone to write it off as getting settled in, well it's the playoffs he either needs to step up or have his minutes reduced. Eddie House has been solid all year for us and now he's riding the pine? Is Doc watching the same games we are? With Ray Allen and Paul Pierce having hoirrid nighst you would think he would had had SOME time. Maybe we should fire Doc and keep Tom before he gets another head coaching job.

[Bankshot]

Ray probably should play more minutes, but I'd rather see them go to Posey.  Posey can cover Lebron and PP will have much better luck on both ends guarding Wally.

[Roy Hobbs]

Ray Allen on the other hand has been lukewarm all season and last night was about as bad as he can be, really has not been the shooter he was billed to be when we got him. In the beginning his rep for being a great shooter led everyone to write it off as getting settled in, well it's the playoffs he either needs to step up or have his minutes reduced.

See, I'm sorry, but this is just uninformed.

Ray had a great shooting year.

TS%: 58.4% (fourth best in his 12 year career, 1.3 better than career average)
eFG%: 53.7% (fourth best in his career, 1.8 better than career average)
3PT%: 39.8% (fifth best in his career, 0.1 better than career average)
FT%. 90.7% (second best in his career, 1.8 better than career average)

I'm not sure what the problem is.  His points are down, because he takes fewer shot attempts.  His overall field goal percentage was very slightly down (although it was his second best in the last six seasons, and within 0.1 of his career average) because he took a higher percentage of three-pointers this year.

After the all-star break, he shot a phenomenal 48.7% overall, and 44.4% from three.  For a shooting guard who concentrates on outside shots, those numbers are absolutely tremendous.

I'm not sure why people have the perception that Ray had an off year, but they couldn't be further from the truth.  I'm all for getting Eddie House some more playing time, and if that means very slightly cutting Ray's minutes, fine.  However, the idea that Ray hasn't performed over the course of the season is just completely off-base.

[Kuberski33]

While I agree that Ray has been very good and I am a big fan of his, I'm curious whether,  in the past, he has submitted as many clunkers as he has this year.  When a player starts to decline, the consistency is the first thing to usually slip.

My first reaction over all this is he's starting to hit the downside of his career, but not knowing whether this type of thing has happened in the past is the only reason I really can't declare that.

I wouldn't at all be against giving House more minutes and Ray less till he gets it going again.

I'm also guessing that Doc tries to establish Ray early in the next game.

[Roy Hobbs]

While I agree that Ray has been very good and I am a big fan of his, I'm curious whether,  in the past, he has submitted as many clunkers as he has this year.  When a player starts to decline, the consistency is the first thing to usually slip.

My first reaction over all this is he's starting to hit the downside of his career, but not knowing whether this type of thing has happened in the past is the only reason I really can't declare that.

It's fairly consistent with Ray's recent career.  You can check out his game logs over at basketball-reference.com (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/a/allenra02.html).  I defined "clunker" as any game in which Ray shot below 40% (an arbitrary number, I know, and not necessarily representative of a truly terrible game). Roughly 1/3 of Ray's games over each of the past four seasons has fit that criteria, so it's not like he's getting noticeably worse.  In fact, due to the increase in his percentages, if anything playing in the Celts offense has helped his shooting.

[Kuberski33]

You had to figure his # of attempts and his PPG would decline -- simply due to the presence of Pierce and KG -- and Doc obviously doesn't feel there's any issue because he keeps getting tons of minutes.

It could just speak to the disadvantage of relying on jump shooters.  When they fall they're awesome, when they don't it can be a problem if you have few inside options.

The only thing that really caught my attention is he had Wally on him who may be the slowest perimeter player in the NBA.  In that game in Boston just after the trade, if I remember correctly he abused Wally -- and they were looking for him constantly.

I'm wondering whether Cleveland did anything different defensively because it didn't seem like Ray was open much.

[GroverTheClover]

Keep in mind, Ray only took 4 shots. He looked very tentative with the ball, but at the same time, no one looked for him to get his shot going anyways. Doc should incorporate some curls for Ray like he did for Ricky Davis a few times to get Ray going.

[nickagneta]

Ray had a bad statistical game last night and hasn't played very good defense this whole postseason, butlast night's game of no scoring isn't entirely his fault. Ray had only 4 shots. 4. Sure he missed all four but how often this year have we seen him start slow and then heat it up. Maybe 15 to 20 times. He was never given the chance to heat it up.

Rondo looked for his own shot and fed KG relentlessly. Pierce just out and out was never evn looking in Ray's direct. I think I saw at least 4 occasions that Pierce unsuccessfully went to the basket while not passing to a wide open Ray Allen.

And I don't care how bad a shooting night Ray is having, and last night's really wasn't bad because of the lack of shots he was allowed to take, I would rather have Ray Allen in a playoff game 100 times out of 100 over Eddie House.

Eddie is not the shooter, passer, or take it to the whole guy that Ray is and his defense isn't any better. I, personally if I was coaching the Celtics, would never have Eddie House in the game for Ray Allen unless it's because Ray got hurt.

I just don't see where Eddie brings anything to the table better than even a cold Ray Allen does.

And the point is pretty much moot since it's [dang] obvious that Doc hasdecided Eddie isn't in his guard rotation of Sam, Rondo, and Ray. Sure Tony got a wiff of playing time but he is also not in the rotation.

And I think that's smart. You've decided on your three guys and I think it's smart to let them know that if they're having a bit of a tough time that the coach still has the confidence in them to work it out.

I think Doc is 100% right in that. That might not be a popular view of things but I think it's sound strategy for these playoffs.

[jay_jay54]

Keep in mind, Ray only took 4 shots. He looked very tentative with the ball, but at the same time, no one looked for him to get his shot going anyways. Doc should incorporate some curls for Ray like he did for Ricky Davis a few times to get Ray going.

I think you hit it on  the nail with "but at the same time,no one looked for him to get his shot going anyways",he was basically a nonfactor in the offense last night.I think the media made way to much out of Ray having such a poor shooting night.I notice if a guy misses his first shot,the announcers automatically start a campaign that he going to have a bad night.I don't see it that way.Four shots in a game,doesn't determine whether a player is having a lousy shooting night.If he had shot 10 or more shots,and missed 9 out of 10,then i would worry.

[KevinIsSars]

Ray Allen on the other hand has been lukewarm all season and last night was about as bad as he can be, really has not been the shooter he was billed to be when we got him. In the beginning his rep for being a great shooter led everyone to write it off as getting settled in, well it's the playoffs he either needs to step up or have his minutes reduced.

See, I'm sorry, but this is just uninformed.

Ray had a great shooting year.

TS%: 58.4% (fourth best in his 12 year career, 1.3 better than career average)
eFG%: 53.7% (fourth best in his career, 1.8 better than career average)
3PT%: 39.8% (fifth best in his career, 0.1 better than career average)
FT%. 90.7% (second best in his career, 1.8 better than career average)

I'm not sure what the problem is.  His points are down, because he takes fewer shot attempts.  His overall field goal percentage was very slightly down (although it was his second best in the last six seasons, and within 0.1 of his career average) because he took a higher percentage of three-pointers this year.

After the all-star break, he shot a phenomenal 48.7% overall, and 44.4% from three.  For a shooting guard who concentrates on outside shots, those numbers are absolutely tremendous.

I'm not sure why people have the perception that Ray had an off year, but they couldn't be further from the truth.  I'm all for getting Eddie House some more playing time, and if that means very slightly cutting Ray's minutes, fine.  However, the idea that Ray hasn't performed over the course of the season is just completely off-base.

To me, I expected Ray to have a better offensive year then he did. Yes, the percentages are close to those he's posted during his carrer, but he's on a team where he's no longer the focus of the defense (of course your percentages aren't gonna be as high when you're getting doubled every possession). If you think about it, probably half of his shots were wide open looks this year. For some reason, it seems like he's been missing a lot of open shots this year. That being said, I would still rather have him on the floor rather then Eddie.

 

[GroverTheClover]

Ray Allen on the other hand has been lukewarm all season and last night was about as bad as he can be, really has not been the shooter he was billed to be when we got him. In the beginning his rep for being a great shooter led everyone to write it off as getting settled in, well it's the playoffs he either needs to step up or have his minutes reduced.

See, I'm sorry, but this is just uninformed.

Ray had a great shooting year.

TS%: 58.4% (fourth best in his 12 year career, 1.3 better than career average)
eFG%: 53.7% (fourth best in his career, 1.8 better than career average)
3PT%: 39.8% (fifth best in his career, 0.1 better than career average)
FT%. 90.7% (second best in his career, 1.8 better than career average)

I'm not sure what the problem is.  His points are down, because he takes fewer shot attempts.  His overall field goal percentage was very slightly down (although it was his second best in the last six seasons, and within 0.1 of his career average) because he took a higher percentage of three-pointers this year.

After the all-star break, he shot a phenomenal 48.7% overall, and 44.4% from three.  For a shooting guard who concentrates on outside shots, those numbers are absolutely tremendous.

I'm not sure why people have the perception that Ray had an off year, but they couldn't be further from the truth.  I'm all for getting Eddie House some more playing time, and if that means very slightly cutting Ray's minutes, fine.  However, the idea that Ray hasn't performed over the course of the season is just completely off-base.

To me, I expected Ray to have a better offensive year then he did. Yes, the percentages are close to those he's posted during his carrer, but he's on a team where he's no longer the focus of the defense (of course your percentages aren't gonna be as high when you're getting doubled every possession). If you think about it, probably half of his shots were wide open looks this year. For some reason, it seems like he's been missing a lot of open shots this year. That being said, I would still rather have him on the floor rather then Eddie.

 

Yes, he's missed quite a few open shots, but he's never been known as a spot up shooter. Ray is most effective shooting off the dribble. He's used to creating his own shots by coming off screens or dribbling until he can pull up. He's been thrown into a spot up shooter role which he has never been accustomed to. His percentages have shown that he is just as effective as he was before with fewer shots. Let's not forget, that he had to make the biggest adjustment out of the three stars with the ball no longer being in his hands the majority of the time.

[clover]

Rondo shot 5 for 8 last night (and 5 for 6 from the line) in a hair under 30 minutes.  You don't want him shooting less if Cleveland's going to give him that shot.  His starting out 4 for 5 in the 1st quarter, or whatever it was, was exactly what we need him to do to make Cleveland defend honestly.  Indeed he then hardly shot at all in the 2nd half.

Sure, they can and probably will work to include RA in the offense more tomorrow, but the plan was to run a lot of the offense into KG--and for KG not to pass up good shots.  Pierce assertively got--and didn't get--his, while Perk was really only a factor when nothing else was working in the third.

[BudweiserCeltic]

21 turnovers and 68 shot attempts... there wasn't enough to spread around.  Cut down the turnovers, move the ball, and all will be fine.

[oldschoolceltic00]

Ray struggled last night for sure but he needs to have more then four shot attempts. I think Ray is forgotten alot in the offense at times and they need to run some plays for him to get him in the flow. We have seen all year that was he has a couple shots go down and is in the flow he can carry us for a stretch.

[Oldschoolkid]

So what about these two, they helped you win all season, now you omit them...? Tony Allen is probably the Celtics best slasher, he always is good for a layup! Watching the celtics find it impossible to do anything except the one pass then an outside shot crap, put TA in...he will show you you can create a layup. And what is this one pass crap, we looked like cleveland there & they looked like us for a while!!! Now Eddie House, a greeat shooter and his defense is as good as Ray Allen's, now don't get me wrong, i love Ray Allen, but when his game is slumping put in Eddie, he can score, he can shoot, and he can defend. Towards the end of the season he came on as a very dependable defender. Doc, don't tighten up, these guys got you there. Use them all. You will not go far just without them, they are your change-up players!!! Oh, and Leon, heads up under the hoop, look at where the defense is. One more thing, PJ Brown on Ilgauskas, you don't put KG on him, you already lose Paul P on D, it is impossible to be effective on both ends of the floor. Give PJ a real job out there, he CAN do it you know!!!