Author Topic: Where are Eddie House & TAllen  (Read 16112 times)

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Re: Where are Eddie House & TAllen
« Reply #30 on: April 24, 2008, 06:40:01 PM »

Offline Jon

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Personally, I'm surprised the rotation is as large as it is right now.  The only reason for that, of course, is that for all Doc says to the media and players, he's taking this round as a warm-up for later rounds.  I really wouldn't be surprised if some of the later playoff games are just the starters, Cassell, Posey, and a big (probably Powe, though Brown might find his way to top him if we end up playing a team with a dominant big man). 

Ultimately, this is the way it should be.  This team has been well rested all year so that the best players can play the most minutes.  In my opinion Posey is better than Allen and Cassell is better than House.  If that's the case, foul trouble aside, Allen and House should be getting ZERO minutes in tight games.   

This isn't T-Ball; everyone doesn't have to play.  These are all grown men getting paid ridiculous money.  I could care less whose feelings get hurt. 

Re: Where are Eddie House & TAllen
« Reply #31 on: April 24, 2008, 08:16:38 PM »

Offline Sweet17

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My only issue is with House and Cassell. I don't think Cassell has beaten House with on-court play. I was a pretty big Cassell fan but so far House actually does some PG stuff better. House is MUCH better at pushing the pace - and a better long range shooter and -shockingly- a better defender to boot.

Cassell is a better passer (when he wants to be) and a better on one one scorer..but their are some serious holes in his game.. OTOH I am not RAVING mad at the decision. Career wise Sam has been a much better player. I hope he finds his game.

Pete

Re: Where are Eddie House & TAllen
« Reply #32 on: April 24, 2008, 09:07:56 PM »

Offline tanner

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interestingly enough, i think sam's been better providing instant offense off the bench than house has been in a long time.

Re: Where are Eddie House & TAllen
« Reply #33 on: April 24, 2008, 09:19:01 PM »

Offline crownsy

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My only issue is with House and Cassell. I don't think Cassell has beaten House with on-court play. I was a pretty big Cassell fan but so far House actually does some PG stuff better. House is MUCH better at pushing the pace - and a better long range shooter and -shockingly- a better defender to boot.

Cassell is a better passer (when he wants to be) and a better on one one scorer..but their are some serious holes in his game.. OTOH I am not RAVING mad at the decision. Career wise Sam has been a much better player. I hope he finds his game.

Pete

his last 2 games have been excellent....he's pushed the lead in his short minutes with good shots...

sam's like a streak at blackjack, you ride him while he's hot and get away from the table when he's cold.

doc just has to be a good gambler.
“I will hurt you for this. A day will come when you think you’re safe and happy and your joy will turn to ashes in your mouth. And you will know the debt is paid.” – Tyrion

Re: Where are Eddie House & TAllen
« Reply #34 on: April 24, 2008, 09:40:40 PM »

Offline Jon

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Has Eddie been better than Cassell?  Maybe in appearance, but the second unit has gotten by a lot this year on hustle plays against poorer second units.  That won't happen in the later round of the playoffs where a) there are better teams, and b) second units really don't exist as starters play most of the minutes.  Flat out, Cassell is a better player, regardless of performance on the C's this year, and Doc needs to try to get him up to speed for the Finals.  House can be easily pressure in a full court press; teams will exploit that in later rounds.  It doesn't matter what he could be doing against the Hawks. 

Re: Where are Eddie House & TAllen
« Reply #35 on: April 25, 2008, 12:47:46 AM »

Offline BASSTHUMPER

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im glad posey and powe gettin they minutes....

i'm still on why pollard sittin there in streets when scal played more minute and scored more points and he not around...

like keith sweat...



"sumthin sumthin.....sumthin sumthin jus aint right"...

Re: Where are Eddie House & TAllen
« Reply #36 on: April 25, 2008, 11:31:44 AM »

Offline EJPLAYA

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Has Eddie been better than Cassell?  Maybe in appearance, but the second unit has gotten by a lot this year on hustle plays against poorer second units.  That won't happen in the later round of the playoffs where a) there are better teams, and b) second units really don't exist as starters play most of the minutes.  Flat out, Cassell is a better player, regardless of performance on the C's this year, and Doc needs to try to get him up to speed for the Finals.  House can be easily pressure in a full court press; teams will exploit that in later rounds.  It doesn't matter what he could be doing against the Hawks. 

I see. Even though he hasn't produced well in the majority of his games, and the numbers don't back your statement up this year, Sam is better. Sam WAS better. There isn't one thing you can point to that Sam does better than House since he has been there. There are numerous things House does better. If you choose to remember the old Sam vs. focusing on what he currently brings then there isn't much to talk about.

As far as pressuring the ball, House hasn't had a problem with their second unit pg pressure for over a half a season. He now pushes the ball up the floor instead of getting trapped with it. Problem solved.

I am really not sure how people overlook all the negative things Sam does and just focus on that once upon a time he used to be a complete pg. Other than a couple games this year he has a net negative effect on the team. Sure he does a few things here and there well, but they don't offset the other. House has negatives too, but he has so many more positives that he is currently the better player of the two. Plain fact is that the big thing everyone says is Sams strength, his offense, is a bigger strength of House's.



Re: Where are Eddie House & TAllen
« Reply #37 on: April 25, 2008, 11:44:04 AM »

Offline DannyZ

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Lets give Doc credit.  He had to shorten up the playoff rotation.  Eddie and Tony don't deserve the minutes as much as Posey and Sam.  Tony Allen is a walking turnover and Eddie just isn't as good as Sam overall.

Re: Where are Eddie House & TAllen
« Reply #38 on: April 25, 2008, 12:19:44 PM »

Offline wdleehi

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They are both what they are suppose to be in the playoffs.  Situational SGs. 



They will get most their minutes within the last 30 seconds of the first three quarters. 


If the Celtics have the ball after a deadball situation with less then 24 seconds, House will come in to provide and an extra outside shooter to open up the floor for one last shot.

If the Cltics are on defense with 30 second left, Allen comes in to play defense. 


Neither will see major minutes unless there is:

1) a blow out
2) foul trouble
3) injury



Starters will play more minutes.  Key bench players (in order, Posey, Cassell, Powe, Brown, House, Allen, Davis) will play the rest of the minutes.

Re: Where are Eddie House & TAllen
« Reply #39 on: April 25, 2008, 12:22:02 PM »

Offline crownsy

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Has Eddie been better than Cassell?  Maybe in appearance, but the second unit has gotten by a lot this year on hustle plays against poorer second units.  That won't happen in the later round of the playoffs where a) there are better teams, and b) second units really don't exist as starters play most of the minutes.  Flat out, Cassell is a better player, regardless of performance on the C's this year, and Doc needs to try to get him up to speed for the Finals.  House can be easily pressure in a full court press; teams will exploit that in later rounds.  It doesn't matter what he could be doing against the Hawks. 

I see. Even though he hasn't produced well in the majority of his games, and the numbers don't back your statement up this year, Sam is better. Sam WAS better. There isn't one thing you can point to that Sam does better than House since he has been there. There are numerous things House does better. If you choose to remember the old Sam vs. focusing on what he currently brings then there isn't much to talk about.

As far as pressuring the ball, House hasn't had a problem with their second unit pg pressure for over a half a season. He now pushes the ball up the floor instead of getting trapped with it. Problem solved.

I am really not sure how people overlook all the negative things Sam does and just focus on that once upon a time he used to be a complete pg. Other than a couple games this year he has a net negative effect on the team. Sure he does a few things here and there well, but they don't offset the other. House has negatives too, but he has so many more positives that he is currently the better player of the two. Plain fact is that the big thing everyone says is Sams strength, his offense, is a bigger strength of House's.




can we all agree not to beat this horse in a third thread?

I'll start, no more who's better  posts from me, ill stick to rotations :)
« Last Edit: April 25, 2008, 01:41:29 PM by crownsy »
“I will hurt you for this. A day will come when you think you’re safe and happy and your joy will turn to ashes in your mouth. And you will know the debt is paid.” – Tyrion

Re: Where are Eddie House & TAllen
« Reply #40 on: April 25, 2008, 12:33:04 PM »

Offline FatoineLover

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I think this thread will come alive again in the second round when Delonte easily drives left and dunks on Cassell for the 10th consecutive time and Casell answers with ill advised bricks on the other end of the court ending with a technical foul. Eddie earned these minutes and I think giving them to Casell goes against what Doc has been preaching all season. Casell makes Paul act more childish too. I just don't like him, that boy aint right. 
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Re: Where are Eddie House & TAllen
« Reply #41 on: April 25, 2008, 01:40:23 PM »

Offline crownsy

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well, i would hope that in the second round, if it is the cavs, that doc would use house to start.

I really think (and hope) that doc decides that 8 minutes of backup point time by risk/reward. right now, cassell is alot of reward and little risk, because ATL PG's are all jump shooters. so, it minmizes sam's weakness, stopping penetration, while playing up to his strengths, the ability to create his own shot as the starters rest.

In the clev series, i hope and think doc will recognize that delonte is more of a drive then kick guy, and thus use house more, since eddie can keep people in front of him. You lose some of the offense of the second team, not because eddie is a bad shooter, far from it, but he can't really get his own shot, he needs to spot up or get a screen. but, CLE is less athletic, which should make that alot easier, we can pin thier guys on screens easier than the athletic G's of atlanta.
“I will hurt you for this. A day will come when you think you’re safe and happy and your joy will turn to ashes in your mouth. And you will know the debt is paid.” – Tyrion

Re: Where are Eddie House & TAllen
« Reply #42 on: April 25, 2008, 03:05:24 PM »

Offline EJPLAYA

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well, i would hope that in the second round, if it is the cavs, that doc would use house to start.

I really think (and hope) that doc decides that 8 minutes of backup point time by risk/reward. right now, cassell is alot of reward and little risk, because ATL PG's are all jump shooters. so, it minmizes sam's weakness, stopping penetration, while playing up to his strengths, the ability to create his own shot as the starters rest.

In the clev series, i hope and think doc will recognize that delonte is more of a drive then kick guy, and thus use house more, since eddie can keep people in front of him. You lose some of the offense of the second team, not because eddie is a bad shooter, far from it, but he can't really get his own shot, he needs to spot up or get a screen. but, CLE is less athletic, which should make that alot easier, we can pin thier guys on screens easier than the athletic G's of atlanta.
You said you weren't going to comment on it again! Kidding of course...

If the guys on the floor out there with House can't set a screen for the guy then they should be parking their tails on the bench. BBD is the only one on the second unit that can't come and set a screen without fouling. Coming across half court and launching the ball before the defender would dream of you shooting it does not mean you created your own shot. It means you are a ball hog. House could do the same thing that Sam does. Just with a better shooting percentage.

As far as the topic goes, if we want to stay active posting on here then there aren't really a whole lot of things to discuss. Two blowouts. No idea who the next round will be against. Big three playing great. This is the only thing that people disagree on and have enough fire about to keep talking. I'd rather post and beat the dead horse if it truly is going to have an effect on later rounds. Much more interesting than talking about KG's new baby...

Re: Where are Eddie House & TAllen
« Reply #43 on: April 25, 2008, 03:09:08 PM »

Offline crownsy

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hehe true, i stuck to matchups though, for some reason that thread got me riled up to ridiculous degrees, and if there's any hard feelings i apologize  :)

but yea, I trust doc to stay on top of the matchups, and i'm right on board with you that i'd like to see more eddie over same vs both the wiz and cavs.

one lineup i wouldn't mind is the rondo sam lineup, that lineup gives us an intersting look. i wouldn't want to see it for long stretchs, but to get ray out for the final 2 minutes or so of a quarter, that wouldn't be a bad change up.
“I will hurt you for this. A day will come when you think you’re safe and happy and your joy will turn to ashes in your mouth. And you will know the debt is paid.” – Tyrion

Re: Where are Eddie House & TAllen
« Reply #44 on: April 25, 2008, 04:02:29 PM »

Offline CT34

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Eddie House and Tony Allen was spotted today on a fish boat on the Boston Harbor.  So I guess they have already Gone Fishing as the rest of the team plays in the 2008 Play-offs.