CelticsStrong
Celtics Basketball => Celtics Talk => Topic started by: MattyIce on July 23, 2018, 08:15:33 AM
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Isaiah Thomas reached out to Danny Ainge before ultimately signing with the Nuggets, per Woj: "If the opportunity is there, I would just like to let you know that I'd love to come back."
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/24169163/nba-conversation-isaiah-thomas
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It's obvious that IT's appreciation for Boston never went away. He will always be one of my favorites.
People criticize IT for a lack of "self awareness" but I think he understands far more than what he projects in interviews. Behind the bitter comments is a guy who just wants the opportunity to be paid on the merits of his per-injury contributions.
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I was listening to the discussion on NBA radio and he did talk to Danny for 15-20 minutes about the possibility of coming back. They say that Danny said he would see what they could do after they deal with the Marcus Smart RFA contract. Before they completed the Marcus Smart deal IT signed with Denver which didn't allow Danny the opportunity.
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I have to think Denver will be a better opportunity for IT. Hopefully he can return to even 80% (or more) of what he was and get a decent contract going forward.
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I have to think Denver will be a better opportunity for IT. Hopefully he can return to even 80% (or more) of what he was and get a decent contract going forward.
Completely agree with this. He made no sense on next year's Celtics. We have three point guards on the roster now who have started or played heavy minutes into the conference finals (and in Kyrie's case, into the Finals).
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I have to think Denver will be a better opportunity for IT. Hopefully he can return to even 80% (or more) of what he was and get a decent contract going forward.
Completely agree with this. He made no sense on next year's Celtics. We have three point guards on the roster now who have started or played heavy minutes into the conference finals (and in Kyrie's case, into the Finals).
Same here. It's going to be fun to root for Denver next season. It wouldn't surprise me to see IT and Jokic develop awesome chemistry together. Jokic's offensive versatility is a great fit with a healthy IT.
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I have to think Denver will be a better opportunity for IT. Hopefully he can return to even 80% (or more) of what he was and get a decent contract going forward.
Completely agree with this. He made no sense on next year's Celtics. We have three point guards on the roster now who have started or played heavy minutes into the conference finals (and in Kyrie's case, into the Finals).
And a healthy IT took the Celtics to the ECF as the best player and surrounded by far less talent. I like Terry Rozier, but I feel like we are overrating him. IT would have been a good scoring option off the bench.
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It's obvious that IT's appreciation for Boston never went away. He will always be one of my favorites.
People criticize IT for a lack of "self awareness" but I think he understands far more than what he projects in interviews. Behind the bitter comments is a guy who just wants the opportunity to be paid on the merits of his per-injury contributions.
I can see a player feeling this way, and wanting to be paid/rewarded for past contributions. However, the team needs to give contracts to players based on their current/future contributions on and off the court.
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It's obvious that IT's appreciation for Boston never went away. He will always be one of my favorites.
People criticize IT for a lack of "self awareness" but I think he understands far more than what he projects in interviews. Behind the bitter comments is a guy who just wants the opportunity to be paid on the merits of his per-injury contributions.
I can see a player feeling this way, and wanting to be paid/rewarded for past contributions. However, the team needs to give contracts to players based on their current/future contributions on and off the court.
No doubt and I believe IT understands this after reading his comments from the ESPN article. My main point is that IT's bitterness is largely due to regret over how much money he cost himself by playing injured. He lost a stable situation AND a ton of money.
I only bring these things up because there's a large segment of Celtics fans who have bashed IT for every negative comment, all while ignoring the overwhelming positives that he brought to the franchise. I guess I don't really care about the petty comments because they are rooted in genuine frustration.
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My one hope is that IT is fully healthy.
Because if he is, I have no doubt he will shine.
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You have to imagine that IT is seeing these Kyrie to NY rumors and just salivating at the thought of getting his old spot back, the question is should we be?
If we do lose Kyrie to free agency we're going to need to replace that position, a Brad Stevens offense is built around playmaking from the wings and bigs with a foundation of attacking guard play. Maybe Terry Rozier is the permanent replacement but I'd argue its possible he'll never be the shot maker/creator that IT is.
Would we look elsewhere? Maybe try to steal Lillard? Roll with Terry and put resources into another position. Bring back IT?
I for one hope Kyrie Re-signs for the long term but it's fascinating to consider what our options could be if he holds to NYC.
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My guess is that after finding a weak market IT took a shot on contacting the Cs to see if the Irving for Leonard trade speculation carried any weight.
If the Cs really where willing to trade Irving and Picks for Leonard then an IT reunion could make sense.
Trade Irving and Picks for Leonard
resign smart
Sign IT to 2 year full MLE deal ( second year team option)
Make Brown 6th man
Start
IT
Hayward
Tatum
Leonard
Horford
Bench
Brown
Smar
Rozier
Baynes
Morris
It would have made sense but In the end I prefer our current roster
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You have to imagine that IT is seeing these Kyrie to NY rumors and just salivating at the thought of getting his old spot back, the question is should we be?
If we do lose Kyrie to free agency we're going to need to replace that position, a Brad Stevens offense is built around playmaking from the wings and bigs with a foundation of attacking guard play. Maybe Terry Rozier is the permanent replacement but I'd argue its possible he'll never be the shot maker/creator that IT is.
Would we look elsewhere? Maybe try to steal Lillard? Roll with Terry and put resources into another position. Bring back IT?
I for one hope Kyrie Re-signs for the long term but it's fascinating to consider what our options could be if he holds to NYC.
Rozier is good enough to become a starter for us if Kyrie leaves and will improve as a playmaker as he showed last season. Terry plays much better defense as well. This is IT's Achilles heel and will keep him from achieving that brinks truck contract no matter how much he returns to form. His ceiling is as a second unit game changer that can get hot offensively on occaission.
Would I let him return to the Celtics? Absolutely, but only if he was healthy and the price was right. Definitely would not sacrifice any of our young core for him.
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My guess is that after finding a weak market IT took a shot on contacting the Cs to see if the Irving for Leonard trade speculation carried any weight.
If the Cs really where willing to trade Irving and Picks for Leonard then an IT reunion could make sense.
Trade Irving and Picks for Leonard
resign smart
Sign IT to 2 year full MLE deal ( second year team option)
Make Brown 6th man
Start
IT
Hayward
Tatum
Leonard
Horford
Bench
Brown
Smar
Rozier
Baynes
Morris
It would have made sense but In the end I prefer our current roster
TP
Without KI, the IT liability would be very well covered by this roster. But I guess Brown would be the starting SG, with Tatum and Smart subbing in early
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Reading that whole article Thomas just doesn't get it and he can't stop putting his foot in his mouth.
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Reading that whole article Thomas just doesn't get it and he can't stop putting his foot in his mouth.
It seemed like he gets it now, what was so bad in the article? He probably missed his only opportunity in his career to get that crazy pay check. From 100+ million guaranteed to 2, wouldn't you be upset?
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Reading that whole article Thomas just doesn't get it and he can't stop putting his foot in his mouth.
It seemed like he gets it now, what was so bad in the article? He probably missed his only opportunity in his career to get that crazy pay check. From 100+ million guaranteed to 2, wouldn't you be upset?
IMO, he sounds bitter and not humbled by all of this in the least. Teams are concerned about his hip, but even if his hip got a 100% stamp of approval from every team DR in the league, no one is giving him anything resembling the $150 million contract he obviously still feels entitled to.
Having that attitude in our locker room would have been poisonous. Plus, for all his talents as a scorer, he's one of the worst defenders in the league.
I wish him well and hope his hip is 100%, but I'm not shedding crocodile tears for him. Yes, he missed on his big payday, but he's already made $30 million and will likely make a lot more in the coming years. What would be tear-worthy is if the Celtics or some other team guaranteed this guy $150 million.
I'd also be a bit more sympathetic to him if not for his repeated "brinks truck" comments. Even now, he admits his mind was not on winning and basketball....it was on $$$.
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Reading that whole article Thomas just doesn't get it and he can't stop putting his foot in his mouth.
It seemed like he gets it now, what was so bad in the article? He probably missed his only opportunity in his career to get that crazy pay check. From 100+ million guaranteed to 2, wouldn't you be upset?
IMO, he sounds bitter and not humbled by all of this in the least. Teams are concerned about his hip, but even if his hip got a 100% stamp of approval from every team DR in the league, no one is giving him anything resembling the $150 million contract he obviously still feels entitled to.
Having that attitude in our locker room would have been poisonous. Plus, for all his talents as a scorer, he's one of the worst defenders in the league.
I wish him well and hope his hip is 100%, but I'm not shedding crocodile tears for him. Yes, he missed on his big payday, but he's already made $30 million and will likely make a lot more in the coming years. What would be tear-worthy is if the Celtics or some other team guaranteed this guy $150 million.
I'd also be a bit more sympathetic to him if not for his repeated "brinks truck" comments. Even now, he admits his mind was not on winning and basketball....it was on $$$.
This sounds like he is moving forward but still frustrated he missed on the money. Is that terrible?
"Nothing that I did in the past can be used to get [a new contract]. Everybody else can, but me? I can't. That's been my story. It's never been, 'Oh, let's pay him off what he's done.' That's just what it is. That's the reality. I can't control that. But I can control taking advantage of an opportunity and showing that I can still play at a high level."
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Reading that whole article Thomas just doesn't get it and he can't stop putting his foot in his mouth.
It seemed like he gets it now, what was so bad in the article? He probably missed his only opportunity in his career to get that crazy pay check. From 100+ million guaranteed to 2, wouldn't you be upset?
IMO, he sounds bitter and not humbled by all of this in the least. Teams are concerned about his hip, but even if his hip got a 100% stamp of approval from every team DR in the league, no one is giving him anything resembling the $150 million contract he obviously still feels entitled to.
Having that attitude in our locker room would have been poisonous. Plus, for all his talents as a scorer, he's one of the worst defenders in the league.
I wish him well and hope his hip is 100%, but I'm not shedding crocodile tears for him. Yes, he missed on his big payday, but he's already made $30 million and will likely make a lot more in the coming years. What would be tear-worthy is if the Celtics or some other team guaranteed this guy $150 million.
I'd also be a bit more sympathetic to him if not for his repeated "brinks truck" comments. Even now, he admits his mind was not on winning and basketball....it was on $$$.
This sounds like he is moving forward but still frustrated he missed on the money. Is that terrible?
"Nothing that I did in the past can be used to get [a new contract]. Everybody else can, but me? I can't. That's been my story. It's never been, 'Oh, let's pay him off what he's done.' That's just what it is. That's the reality. I can't control that. But I can control taking advantage of an opportunity and showing that I can still play at a high level."
No one will get paid for what they did in the past unless there is a reasonable expectation that he can do it again in the future. He as to prove he can do it like he said by playing at a high level going forward.
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It's obvious that IT's appreciation for Boston never went away. He will always be one of my favorites.
People criticize IT for a lack of "self awareness" but I think he understands far more than what he projects in interviews. Behind the bitter comments is a guy who just wants the opportunity to be paid on the merits of his per-injury contributions.
I can see a player feeling this way, and wanting to be paid/rewarded for past contributions. However, the team needs to give contracts to players based on their current/future contributions on and off the court.
.............. ... My main point is that IT's bitterness is largely due to regret over how much money he cost himself by playing injured. He lost a stable situation AND a ton of money.
I only bring these things up because there's a large segment of Celtics fans who have bashed IT for every negative comment, all while ignoring the overwhelming positives that he brought to the franchise. I guess I don't really care about the petty comments because they are rooted in genuine frustration.
TP!
IT put us back on the map as a relevant team and as an attraction for free agents. One could argue that without IT, Horford doesn’t come here.
IT gave up his body literally and figuratively for our franchise. He gave his huge heart (never mind his hip, those teeth that he lost and played through and playing for the team through chis sister’s death) to the franchise, his teammates, us fans and the City of Boston.
IT will always be one of my top 5 favorite Celtics of all time in my 58 years of following this team. The guy gets a pass from me on any bitterness that he might have. He’s earned it.
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Reading that whole article Thomas just doesn't get it and he can't stop putting his foot in his mouth.
It seemed like he gets it now, what was so bad in the article? He probably missed his only opportunity in his career to get that crazy pay check. From 100+ million guaranteed to 2, wouldn't you be upset?
"You can always play the what-if game, but man, I've been F'd over so many times. But, of course, I think about it. I'm human,"
So he is blaming everyone else and says he has been F'd over so many times. that doesn't sound like someone that gets it. That doesn't sound like someone that has learned or grown from his past. That sounds like someone that is incredibly bitter about what has happened to him.
Same thing with this whole sequence
"If I didn't play in the playoffs, I'd be OK," Thomas says. "I'd be getting paid. I'd be who I am -- who I was. But you couldn't tell me in that moment in time -- with everything I was going through -- that, OK, I should just sit out. I don't think Boston went about it the right way as well. But at the same time, it was hard for me to sit out. I just lost my sister, one of the closest people in my life. Basketball was the only thing that was going to help me out. I played until I literally couldn't play anymore. And that was not a good business decision if I was looking in the long term, but I was looking in the 'right now.' That's just what it was. They probably would've traded me anyway. But I would've been in position to show my worth, and last year I was never in position to show my worth."
He just sounds bitter and apparently hasn't learned that his mouth is his biggest problem.
Here he seems to be in a fantasy land not based in reality.
"I understand it, but I don't accept it," Thomas says. "So many other people get injured and get chance after chance again. They get the big break. They get the big money -- no matter if they're injured. There's a lot of people out there who've gotten serious injuries and gotten paid still. In my circumstance, it was bad timing. You've never seen a little guy like me get paid big dollars. Never seen it in the NBA. People know that I've earned and deserved the max contract, and that's the only reason why I didn't get paid what I deserved. Because I got injured. I get that. The biggest thing for me was to get to the best opportunity for me this summer and show that I'm healthy."
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If he hadn't hurt his hip---he would have gotten a $20Million a year deal, just not from Boston.
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It's obvious that IT's appreciation for Boston never went away. He will always be one of my favorites.
People criticize IT for a lack of "self awareness" but I think he understands far more than what he projects in interviews. Behind the bitter comments is a guy who just wants the opportunity to be paid on the merits of his per-injury contributions.
I can see a player feeling this way, and wanting to be paid/rewarded for past contributions. However, the team needs to give contracts to players based on their current/future contributions on and off the court.
.............. ... My main point is that IT's bitterness is largely due to regret over how much money he cost himself by playing injured. He lost a stable situation AND a ton of money.
I only bring these things up because there's a large segment of Celtics fans who have bashed IT for every negative comment, all while ignoring the overwhelming positives that he brought to the franchise. I guess I don't really care about the petty comments because they are rooted in genuine frustration.
TP!
IT put us back on the map as a relevant team and as an attraction for free agents. One could argue that without IT, Horford doesn’t come here.
IT gave up his body literally and figuratively for our franchise. He gave his huge heart (never mind his hip, those teeth that he lost and played through and playing for the team through chis sister’s death) to the franchise, his teammates, us fans and the City of Boston.
IT will always be one of my top 5 favorite Celtics of all time in my 58 years of following this team. The guy gets a pass from me on any bitterness that he might have. He’s earned it.
Paul Pierce, Kevin Garnett, Doc Rivers, Danny Ainge, Ray Allen, Rajon Rondo, Banner 17, and Brad Stevens put us back on the map.
There is some serious overrating of Isaiah Thomas' very brief tenure here. He didn't create nor resurrect the Boston Celtics. Brad Stevens made us a destination for free agents. The love that Paul Pierce and Kevin Garnett had for the franchise made us a destination for free agents. Lets get a bit real here.
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I am sure (at least I hope) that IT will be able to gain perspective over time. I don't discount the pain of possibly missing out on $80 Million (give or take), however, there should ultimately be some solace in the fact that he's 29 and has a net worth of between 12 and 24 Million (depending on the source). And, of course, he still stands to make many more millions over the next 5 years if he stays healthy.
IT came to Boston and did what a professional basketball player making $6M a year should do -- work his ass off.
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I can't believe fans are criticizing IT for wanting to get paid. He brought tens of millions of dollars of value to this franchise, and he made a huge sacrifice for the team by playing through injury in the playoffs. Then he got traded. "It's a business," we said then. But when he wants the Brinks truck? Then he's putting money ahead of the team.
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Reading that whole article Thomas just doesn't get it and he can't stop putting his foot in his mouth.
It seemed like he gets it now, what was so bad in the article? He probably missed his only opportunity in his career to get that crazy pay check. From 100+ million guaranteed to 2, wouldn't you be upset?
"You can always play the what-if game, but man, I've been F'd over so many times. But, of course, I think about it. I'm human,"
So he is blaming everyone else and says he has been F'd over so many times. that doesn't sound like someone that gets it. That doesn't sound like someone that has learned or grown from his past. That sounds like someone that is incredibly bitter about what has happened to him.
Same thing with this whole sequence
"If I didn't play in the playoffs, I'd be OK," Thomas says. "I'd be getting paid. I'd be who I am -- who I was. But you couldn't tell me in that moment in time -- with everything I was going through -- that, OK, I should just sit out. I don't think Boston went about it the right way as well. But at the same time, it was hard for me to sit out. I just lost my sister, one of the closest people in my life. Basketball was the only thing that was going to help me out. I played until I literally couldn't play anymore. And that was not a good business decision if I was looking in the long term, but I was looking in the 'right now.' That's just what it was. They probably would've traded me anyway. But I would've been in position to show my worth, and last year I was never in position to show my worth."
He just sounds bitter and apparently hasn't learned that his mouth is his biggest problem.
Here he seems to be in a fantasy land not based in reality.
"I understand it, but I don't accept it," Thomas says. "So many other people get injured and get chance after chance again. They get the big break. They get the big money -- no matter if they're injured. There's a lot of people out there who've gotten serious injuries and gotten paid still. In my circumstance, it was bad timing. You've never seen a little guy like me get paid big dollars. Never seen it in the NBA. People know that I've earned and deserved the max contract, and that's the only reason why I didn't get paid what I deserved. Because I got injured. I get that. The biggest thing for me was to get to the best opportunity for me this summer and show that I'm healthy."
I am pretty sure everyone, including you, realizes his hip is his biggest problem.
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I don't think it's just the money. He was the leader of a team that went to the conference finals. He believes, rightly or wrongly, that he has the talent to lead a team to a championship. He probably realizes that he will likely never get another chance to play that role. That's got to be a bitter pill to swallow. The Celts didn't do anything wrong, but I can understand why he's bitter that he not only lost out on the big paycheck but also the chance to be the leader on a championship contending team.
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Reading that whole article Thomas just doesn't get it and he can't stop putting his foot in his mouth.
It seemed like he gets it now, what was so bad in the article? He probably missed his only opportunity in his career to get that crazy pay check. From 100+ million guaranteed to 2, wouldn't you be upset?
IMO, he sounds bitter and not humbled by all of this in the least. Teams are concerned about his hip, but even if his hip got a 100% stamp of approval from every team DR in the league, no one is giving him anything resembling the $150 million contract he obviously still feels entitled to.
Having that attitude in our locker room would have been poisonous. Plus, for all his talents as a scorer, he's one of the worst defenders in the league.
I wish him well and hope his hip is 100%, but I'm not shedding crocodile tears for him. Yes, he missed on his big payday, but he's already made $30 million and will likely make a lot more in the coming years. What would be tear-worthy is if the Celtics or some other team guaranteed this guy $150 million.
I'd also be a bit more sympathetic to him if not for his repeated "brinks truck" comments. Even now, he admits his mind was not on winning and basketball....it was on $$$.
This sounds like he is moving forward but still frustrated he missed on the money. Is that terrible?
"Nothing that I did in the past can be used to get [a new contract]. Everybody else can, but me? I can't. That's been my story. It's never been, 'Oh, let's pay him off what he's done.' That's just what it is. That's the reality. I can't control that. But I can control taking advantage of an opportunity and showing that I can still play at a high level."
The thing is he’s so wrong about that. Is DeMarcus Cousins getting paid off what he’s done in the past while he’s also coming off an injury? I like IT but that’s some sanctimonious bullhockey right there.
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Reading that whole article Thomas just doesn't get it and he can't stop putting his foot in his mouth.
It seemed like he gets it now, what was so bad in the article? He probably missed his only opportunity in his career to get that crazy pay check. From 100+ million guaranteed to 2, wouldn't you be upset?
IMO, he sounds bitter and not humbled by all of this in the least. Teams are concerned about his hip, but even if his hip got a 100% stamp of approval from every team DR in the league, no one is giving him anything resembling the $150 million contract he obviously still feels entitled to.
Having that attitude in our locker room would have been poisonous. Plus, for all his talents as a scorer, he's one of the worst defenders in the league.
I wish him well and hope his hip is 100%, but I'm not shedding crocodile tears for him. Yes, he missed on his big payday, but he's already made $30 million and will likely make a lot more in the coming years. What would be tear-worthy is if the Celtics or some other team guaranteed this guy $150 million.
I'd also be a bit more sympathetic to him if not for his repeated "brinks truck" comments. Even now, he admits his mind was not on winning and basketball....it was on $$$.
This sounds like he is moving forward but still frustrated he missed on the money. Is that terrible?
"Nothing that I did in the past can be used to get [a new contract]. Everybody else can, but me? I can't. That's been my story. It's never been, 'Oh, let's pay him off what he's done.' That's just what it is. That's the reality. I can't control that. But I can control taking advantage of an opportunity and showing that I can still play at a high level."
The thing is he’s so wrong about that. Is DeMarcus Cousins getting paid off what he’s done in the past while he’s also coming off an injury? I like IT but that’s some sanctimonious bullhockey right there.
Cousins is making 4.5 million this year and nobody knows if he will ever be the same player. He is actually currently injured and won't play till at least January. So getting 4.5 million for playing maybe a third of the season. That's definitely pay for past production. Fairly confused by this example
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people have very different opinions and thats fine
all that aside, if IT ever does come back here in a year or whenever, it would be a totally fun and awesome story. Would make great TV. :)
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If Irving opts out, I'd be fine rolling it back with an IT/Rozier tandem at the 1 - assuming IT is back to something close to his old self by then.
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Reading that whole article Thomas just doesn't get it and he can't stop putting his foot in his mouth.
It seemed like he gets it now, what was so bad in the article? He probably missed his only opportunity in his career to get that crazy pay check. From 100+ million guaranteed to 2, wouldn't you be upset?
IMO, he sounds bitter and not humbled by all of this in the least. Teams are concerned about his hip, but even if his hip got a 100% stamp of approval from every team DR in the league, no one is giving him anything resembling the $150 million contract he obviously still feels entitled to.
Having that attitude in our locker room would have been poisonous. Plus, for all his talents as a scorer, he's one of the worst defenders in the league.
I wish him well and hope his hip is 100%, but I'm not shedding crocodile tears for him. Yes, he missed on his big payday, but he's already made $30 million and will likely make a lot more in the coming years. What would be tear-worthy is if the Celtics or some other team guaranteed this guy $150 million.
I'd also be a bit more sympathetic to him if not for his repeated "brinks truck" comments. Even now, he admits his mind was not on winning and basketball....it was on $$$.
This sounds like he is moving forward but still frustrated he missed on the money. Is that terrible?
"Nothing that I did in the past can be used to get [a new contract]. Everybody else can, but me? I can't. That's been my story. It's never been, 'Oh, let's pay him off what he's done.' That's just what it is. That's the reality. I can't control that. But I can control taking advantage of an opportunity and showing that I can still play at a high level."
The thing is he’s so wrong about that. Is DeMarcus Cousins getting paid off what he’s done in the past while he’s also coming off an injury? I like IT but that’s some sanctimonious bullhockey right there.
Cousins is making 4.5 million this year and nobody knows if he will ever be the same player. He is actually currently injured and won't play till at least January. So getting 4.5 million for playing maybe a third of the season. That's definitely pay for past production. Fairly confused by this example
. You think $4.5MM vs $2.2MM is getting “paid” for past production? I’m fairly confused by that.
Thomas is also currently injured. And Cousins starting to play come January is not 1/3 of the season by any stretch. That’s more like 2/3rds. It’s also speculation. While he shouldn’t rush it he was hoping to be ready by training camp. He probably should wait until the AS break.
Similarly Thomas’ surgery does not have a good track record for full recovery. That was debated ad nauseum on this board last year. So it’s not like he’ll be 100% in November. His situation is far more similar to Cousins than you’re willing to admit.
And again the $2.3MM difference in salaries is negligible when compared to what both of these guys could have been making if they didn’t get injured ($20-$28MM per year). Cousins is in exactly the same boat as Thomas.
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My one hope is that IT is fully healthy.
Because if he is, I have no doubt he will shine.
I hope so too
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Reading that whole article Thomas just doesn't get it and he can't stop putting his foot in his mouth.
It seemed like he gets it now, what was so bad in the article? He probably missed his only opportunity in his career to get that crazy pay check. From 100+ million guaranteed to 2, wouldn't you be upset?
IMO, he sounds bitter and not humbled by all of this in the least. Teams are concerned about his hip, but even if his hip got a 100% stamp of approval from every team DR in the league, no one is giving him anything resembling the $150 million contract he obviously still feels entitled to.
Having that attitude in our locker room would have been poisonous. Plus, for all his talents as a scorer, he's one of the worst defenders in the league.
I wish him well and hope his hip is 100%, but I'm not shedding crocodile tears for him. Yes, he missed on his big payday, but he's already made $30 million and will likely make a lot more in the coming years. What would be tear-worthy is if the Celtics or some other team guaranteed this guy $150 million.
I'd also be a bit more sympathetic to him if not for his repeated "brinks truck" comments. Even now, he admits his mind was not on winning and basketball....it was on $$$.
This sounds like he is moving forward but still frustrated he missed on the money. Is that terrible?
"Nothing that I did in the past can be used to get [a new contract]. Everybody else can, but me? I can't. That's been my story. It's never been, 'Oh, let's pay him off what he's done.' That's just what it is. That's the reality. I can't control that. But I can control taking advantage of an opportunity and showing that I can still play at a high level."
The thing is he’s so wrong about that. Is DeMarcus Cousins getting paid off what he’s done in the past while he’s also coming off an injury? I like IT but that’s some sanctimonious bullhockey right there.
Cousins is making 4.5 million this year and nobody knows if he will ever be the same player. He is actually currently injured and won't play till at least January. So getting 4.5 million for playing maybe a third of the season. That's definitely pay for past production. Fairly confused by this example
. You think $4.5MM vs $2.2MM is getting “paid” for past production? I’m fairly confused by that.
Thomas is also currently injured. And Cousins starting to play come January is not 1/3 of the season by any stretch. That’s more like 2/3rds. It’s also speculation. While he shouldn’t rush it he was hoping to be ready by training camp. He probably should wait until the AS break.
Similarly Thomas’ surgery does not have a good track record for full recovery. That was debated ad nauseum on this board last year. So it’s not like he’ll be 100% in November. His situation is far more similar to Cousins than you’re willing to admit.
And again the $2.3MM difference in salaries is negligible when compared to what both of these guys could have been making if they didn’t get injured ($20-$28MM per year). Cousins is in exactly the same boat as Thomas.
From what I understand thomas is not currently injured, at least to the point that he will miss the opener. Maybe there has been a more favorable update since I last looked into it, but had read cousins would miss at least 35-40 games and then likely be on a minutes restriction after that because this injury is unprecedented for a player his size. Of the two cousins definitely got paid more based on past production and a belief he could buck the odds because of it
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IT is his own worst enemy. Had he taken the role of sixth man off the bench, he woulda been here.
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Reading that whole article Thomas just doesn't get it and he can't stop putting his foot in his mouth.
It seemed like he gets it now, what was so bad in the article? He probably missed his only opportunity in his career to get that crazy pay check. From 100+ million guaranteed to 2, wouldn't you be upset?
"You can always play the what-if game, but man, I've been F'd over so many times. But, of course, I think about it. I'm human,"
So he is blaming everyone else and says he has been F'd over so many times. that doesn't sound like someone that gets it. That doesn't sound like someone that has learned or grown from his past. That sounds like someone that is incredibly bitter about what has happened to him.
Same thing with this whole sequence
"If I didn't play in the playoffs, I'd be OK," Thomas says. "I'd be getting paid. I'd be who I am -- who I was. But you couldn't tell me in that moment in time -- with everything I was going through -- that, OK, I should just sit out. I don't think Boston went about it the right way as well. But at the same time, it was hard for me to sit out. I just lost my sister, one of the closest people in my life. Basketball was the only thing that was going to help me out. I played until I literally couldn't play anymore. And that was not a good business decision if I was looking in the long term, but I was looking in the 'right now.' That's just what it was. They probably would've traded me anyway. But I would've been in position to show my worth, and last year I was never in position to show my worth."
He just sounds bitter and apparently hasn't learned that his mouth is his biggest problem.
Here he seems to be in a fantasy land not based in reality.
"I understand it, but I don't accept it," Thomas says. "So many other people get injured and get chance after chance again. They get the big break. They get the big money -- no matter if they're injured. There's a lot of people out there who've gotten serious injuries and gotten paid still. In my circumstance, it was bad timing. You've never seen a little guy like me get paid big dollars. Never seen it in the NBA. People know that I've earned and deserved the max contract, and that's the only reason why I didn't get paid what I deserved. Because I got injured. I get that. The biggest thing for me was to get to the best opportunity for me this summer and show that I'm healthy."
I am pretty sure everyone, including you, realizes his hip is his biggest problem.
well sure, but his mouth is what has gotten him traded out of every situation he has ever been in and why Sacramento and LA didn't even want him back. IT just can't stop talking and putting his tiny foot deeply within his mouth. Malone even made mention of Denver being a quiet lockerroom so they can handle IT (aside from just being able to cut him if he mouths off too much). IT is a cancer to a franchise because of that gigantic chip he carries on his shoulder which he just has to tell everyone about at every opportunity.
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Reading that whole article Thomas just doesn't get it and he can't stop putting his foot in his mouth.
It seemed like he gets it now, what was so bad in the article? He probably missed his only opportunity in his career to get that crazy pay check. From 100+ million guaranteed to 2, wouldn't you be upset?
IMO, he sounds bitter and not humbled by all of this in the least. Teams are concerned about his hip, but even if his hip got a 100% stamp of approval from every team DR in the league, no one is giving him anything resembling the $150 million contract he obviously still feels entitled to.
Having that attitude in our locker room would have been poisonous. Plus, for all his talents as a scorer, he's one of the worst defenders in the league.
I wish him well and hope his hip is 100%, but I'm not shedding crocodile tears for him. Yes, he missed on his big payday, but he's already made $30 million and will likely make a lot more in the coming years. What would be tear-worthy is if the Celtics or some other team guaranteed this guy $150 million.
I'd also be a bit more sympathetic to him if not for his repeated "brinks truck" comments. Even now, he admits his mind was not on winning and basketball....it was on $$$.
This sounds like he is moving forward but still frustrated he missed on the money. Is that terrible?
"Nothing that I did in the past can be used to get [a new contract]. Everybody else can, but me? I can't. That's been my story. It's never been, 'Oh, let's pay him off what he's done.' That's just what it is. That's the reality. I can't control that. But I can control taking advantage of an opportunity and showing that I can still play at a high level."
The thing is he’s so wrong about that. Is DeMarcus Cousins getting paid off what he’s done in the past while he’s also coming off an injury? I like IT but that’s some sanctimonious bullhockey right there.
Cousins is making 4.5 million this year and nobody knows if he will ever be the same player. He is actually currently injured and won't play till at least January. So getting 4.5 million for playing maybe a third of the season. That's definitely pay for past production. Fairly confused by this example
. You think $4.5MM vs $2.2MM is getting “paid” for past production? I’m fairly confused by that.
Thomas is also currently injured. And Cousins starting to play come January is not 1/3 of the season by any stretch. That’s more like 2/3rds. It’s also speculation. While he shouldn’t rush it he was hoping to be ready by training camp. He probably should wait until the AS break.
Similarly Thomas’ surgery does not have a good track record for full recovery. That was debated ad nauseum on this board last year. So it’s not like he’ll be 100% in November. His situation is far more similar to Cousins than you’re willing to admit.
And again the $2.3MM difference in salaries is negligible when compared to what both of these guys could have been making if they didn’t get injured ($20-$28MM per year). Cousins is in exactly the same boat as Thomas.
From what I understand thomas is not currently injured, at least to the point that he will miss the opener. Maybe there has been a more favorable update since I last looked into it, but had read cousins would miss at least 35-40 games and then likely be on a minutes restriction after that because this injury is unprecedented for a player his size. Of the two cousins definitely got paid more based on past production and a belief he could buck the odds because of it
There is major debate as to whether Thomas will ever rebound into form. While he might be available earlier in the season than Cousins both are looked at as damaged goods at the moment.
While Cousins is getting paid $2.3MM more I would categorize both of their contracts as being in the same range. That’s not Cousins getting paid on past performance. If IT were making $4.5MM he’d still be complaining.
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I have his injury. It was not logical to skip the surgery. That meant he was counting on his hip to correct itself. Turns out 9 days into his season (or whatever) he wasn't above doctor's orders. He was above letting his agent negotiate for him in a professional setting and it effected his earnings. His hubris is stupid but his situation is tragic. If he doesn't ball in Denver we're looking at China or Dancing With The Stars.
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The narrative is that playing through his injury cost him a major deal. It is more likely that it wasn't going to work out regardless of what he did.
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If IT stopped talking about how he needs and deserves max money then it might be in the realm of possibility... Until then, I pass on him and let him do his thing elsewhere.
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I have his injury. It was not logical to skip the surgery. That meant he was counting on his hip to correct itself. Turns out 9 days into his season (or whatever) he wasn't above doctor's orders. He was above letting his agent negotiate for him in a professional setting and it effected his earnings. His hubris is stupid but his situation is tragic. If he doesn't ball in Denver we're looking at China or Dancing With The Stars.
Sorry to hear that you have his injury. From all the research I've read, though, athletes don't always benefit from the surgery, effectiveness often depends on severity, and it's common for recovery to take several years at the pro-level. At 30 y/o and heavily reliant on athleticism, allowing it to heal on its own was probably the ideal option and clearly within the scope of possibility if doctors believed the same. Unless, of course, the Celtics trainers and/or brass were biased in their interpretation, which is consistent with his saying the organization could've handled it better.
Regarding his hubris and stupidity, that's unfair. You can argue whether his intentions were self-serving (e.g., paycheck), but regardless, he sacrificed his own well-being for the organization at several times during the season. Moreover, he indicates in this interview that his decision to play was affected by his sister's passing - basketball served as a coping mechanism, clearly a distraction from the pain. Minimizing that, cracking on IT, and not appreciating the fact that he 1) made us relevant during gap years, and 2) was the most entertaining show since Broadway on Ice is tough. Shame on you, Mr. Pemulis.
(https://media.giphy.com/media/HiBNkOKRhBJew/giphy.gif)
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Tarheel, thanks for the info. I had to give up hockey. My doctor seriously advised against rehab without surgery to heal it. I had to have microfracture which meant it was severe, hopefully IT's wasn't that bad... 2.5 years after surgery I finally felt good enough to play pickup but couldn't sustain it for a men's league. My idea for him would be to have surgery after the Minnesota game, recover as well as humanly possible, return and show the league he's still worth a big contract.
I meant not to belittle or crack on IT. I truly empathize with the the guy due to the injury and having lost a younger sibling myself. Basketball aside he's someone I think of on tough days. I mean it. Although I wasn't clear enough, Mr Pemulis shall accept said shame.
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Tarheel, thanks for the info. I had to give up hockey. My doctor seriously advised against rehab without surgery to heal it. I had to have microfracture which meant it was severe, hopefully IT's wasn't that bad... 2.5 years after surgery I finally felt good enough to play pickup but couldn't sustain it for a men's league. My idea for him would be to have surgery after the Minnesota game, recover as well as humanly possible, return and show the league he's still worth a big contract.
I meant not to belittle or crack on IT. I truly empathize with the the guy due to the injury and having lost a younger sibling myself. Basketball aside he's someone I think of on tough days. I mean it. Although I wasn't clear enough, Mr Pemulis shall accept said shame.
Yeah, I'm sorry to hear - that sounds like a brutal experience. Interesting that it was a hockey injury because the vast majority of studies I read involved hockey players. You must be especially vulnerable to it. It is admittedly hard to parse whether he should've had the surgery sooner or not - I tend to give him the benefit of the doubt since I'm such a big fan.
Just kidding with the shame gif, but I hope I can continue to call you Mr. Pemulis. Instant street/forum credit afaik.