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Celtics Basketball => Celtics Talk => Topic started by: schabette on December 06, 2017, 01:14:38 PM

Title: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: schabette on December 06, 2017, 01:14:38 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a2kJpH3PR0M
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: mainevent on December 06, 2017, 01:16:53 PM
Whatever you say Isaiah  :laugh: :laugh:
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Monkhouse on December 06, 2017, 01:25:40 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a2kJpH3PR0M

Lol, I dunno about that, but there's another video literally a few threads below yours.

IT is a special player, but I hope JB shuts him down :)

TP for the share though.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: vjcsmoke on December 06, 2017, 01:37:10 PM
Props to Isaiah Thomas.  He was a great player and person for us during his time as a Celtic.  I'll always respect the guy.

But now that he plays for the Cavs.  Well, I hope he puts up some stinkers against us in that red and yellow uniform.  :P :)
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Roy H. on December 06, 2017, 01:47:45 PM
I hope he does, so long as we win the series.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: 18isGREATERthan72 on December 06, 2017, 01:52:02 PM
I know it'll probably never happen as long as Danny is at the helm, but I have dreams that IT signs with us in the off season and becomes the most explosive 6th man in NBA history.  I know that won't happen so no need to set me straight, but dang I've got nothing but love for the dude.  I don't think a player has ever captured my heart as quickly as IT did.  It was only a few seasons he was here, but he almost feels up there with Pierce to me.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: CelticD on December 06, 2017, 02:22:24 PM
IT has been pretty well contained all 3 years in the playoffs. With the exception of a few explosive games, he's been reasonably held in check.

It's Kyrie that's gonna be doin the torching.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Surferdad on December 06, 2017, 02:27:27 PM
The words in thread title can be easily rearranged to:

We're going to torch this guy in the ECFs.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Phantom255x on December 06, 2017, 02:31:18 PM
Honestly, I hope this is the year where we ACTUALLY have an answer for Love (and Thompson?), because it feels like they are the ones who ALWAYS kills us in the playoff series besides Lebron.

Thompson grabbing like 20 rebounds a game against us, Kevin Love averaging like 30 PPG and 15 RPG each time he plays us. So annoying.

It's a reason we lose to the Cavs a lot, because we also let Love kill us (matchup issues in Horford vs. Love)
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: tarheelsxxiii on December 06, 2017, 02:55:51 PM
I'm sure he'll be awesome, and I hope he tees off on the Celts.  It'll be interesting to see how he and LeBron play together, tho.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: libermaniac on December 06, 2017, 02:57:25 PM
Way to be a buzzkill on a great season so far.  :P . Man, I loved IT.  That is hard to watch, knowing how much he killed it for the C's.  But, he'll be just fine, and we know we are.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: rocknrollforyoursoul on December 06, 2017, 03:00:48 PM
IT has been pretty well contained all 3 years in the playoffs. With the exception of a few explosive games, he's been reasonably held in check.

It's Kyrie that's gonna be doin the torching.

To be fair, it was easy to keep him in check because those Cs teams didn't have a legit No. 2 scorer.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Atzar on December 06, 2017, 03:03:32 PM
I hope we destroy him.  Kyrie, Marcus, Jaylen, Rozier, whoever.  I hope we shut him down and then abuse him on the other end. 

I love the guy, but my loyalty is to the Celtics first.

Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Ilikesports17 on December 06, 2017, 03:04:08 PM
IT has been pretty well contained all 3 years in the playoffs. With the exception of a few explosive games, he's been reasonably held in check.

It's Kyrie that's gonna be doin the torching.

To be fair, it was easy to keep him in check because those Cs teams didn't have a legit No. 2 scorer.
And this past year he was going through a lot.

family tragedy, hip injury, and the tooth stuff.

That said, Cavs have no where to hide him against us. Brown's way too big and strong and Irving will have a field day.

If we lose, then I will root for Isaiah in the finals, but against us I want him to be garbage!!!
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: CelticD on December 06, 2017, 03:05:36 PM
IT has been pretty well contained all 3 years in the playoffs. With the exception of a few explosive games, he's been reasonably held in check.

It's Kyrie that's gonna be doin the torching.

To be fair, it was easy to keep him in check because those Cs teams didn't have a legit No. 2 scorer.

That's fair. Although, being that IT is going to be a 2nd option I'd still wonder how much torching he's going to do in a Lebron dominated offense. Lebron is gonna get his first.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: GreenFaith1819 on December 06, 2017, 03:16:35 PM
He's going to be on us like stink on poop.

We'd better be ready if we face him in the playoffs and he's HEALTHY.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: slamtheking on December 06, 2017, 03:17:14 PM
IT has been pretty well contained all 3 years in the playoffs. With the exception of a few explosive games, he's been reasonably held in check.

It's Kyrie that's gonna be doin the torching.

To be fair, it was easy to keep him in check because those Cs teams didn't have a legit No. 2 scorer.
it wasn't so much his offense that was kept in check as the opposing team having their PG pick on IT in the post and just plain go over him for passes and shots.  That's where he becomes a liability.  Love what IT did for the C's but I suspect he's going to be a liability for Cleveland on the court just like he was for the C's and that's pretty much regardless of who Cleveland faces.

Where can they hide IT against Washington (Wall/Beal), Toronto (Lowry/Derozan), C's (Kyrie/Jaylen), Philly (Simmons/Reddick), Detroit (AB/Jackson), Bucks (Bledsoe/Brogdon), Charlotte (Kemba/Lamb), Orlando (Fournier/Payton), Indiana (Oladipo/Collison), Miami (Tragic/Waiters)?

Every team they could meet in the playoffs has a great-to-solid backcourt pairing that no matter which one IT tries to cover, can just feast on his defense.  It's not like IT doesn't try, but there's only so much he can do when giving up that much height --> offers no block potential nor any real resistance to passes over his head.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: GreenFaith1819 on December 06, 2017, 03:20:12 PM
He was the Quintessential Celtic.

He embodied what it meant to be a Boston Celtic.

He wore the uniform with Pride and played with such.

Next to "Celtic" in the dictionary is a picture of Isaiah Thomas.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Big333223 on December 06, 2017, 03:40:16 PM
The words in thread title can be easily rearranged to:

We're going to torch this guy in the ECFs.
Yeah. I'll love Isaiah forever for everything he did as a Celtic but when I think about who he's going to have to guard on this Celtic team in the playoffs, I am not afriad.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: coffee425 on December 06, 2017, 03:56:20 PM
(http://mrwgifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/Mark-Bill-Hader-Down-As-Scared-On-Saturday-Night-Live-Skit.gif)
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Onslaught on December 06, 2017, 04:23:57 PM
First he has to come back and make it all the way to the ECF without getting hurt again. Then  both teams must make the ECF. It's Dec so lets not get too worked up right now.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: makaveli on December 06, 2017, 05:16:36 PM
If somebody HAD to do it, i would chose IT.
But it's never going to happen, i love this kid but i firmly believe that the Cavs are cooked and we are the team to beat
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: cman88 on December 06, 2017, 05:27:38 PM
whatever...this is the cavs last year to really do it. Their team is old and injury prone. And I think Lebron knows it.

 Next year with another year of development for tatum/brown and returning hayward we should rule the east. just imagine if tatum/brown take big jumps again and we add a 20ppg allstar in hayward? we would be warriors of the east.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Boston Garden Leprechaun on December 06, 2017, 07:31:00 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/rTgzJX9.gif)
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: tarheelsxxiii on December 06, 2017, 08:18:31 PM
I'm high enough on painkillers to prefer Kyrie to IT right now.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: mr. dee on December 06, 2017, 08:20:40 PM
He gonna get torched on defense. I hope the Cavs are prepared for that.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: gouki88 on December 06, 2017, 08:37:40 PM
Doubt it, lol
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: tarheelsxxiii on December 06, 2017, 08:40:28 PM
Doubt it, lol

How quickly we forget a historic season...
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: gouki88 on December 06, 2017, 08:53:16 PM
Doubt it, lol

How quickly we forget a historic season...
Not really at all. I think we're well suited to defend him, especially if his slows him down. And it doesn't really matter about his offence, because he won't be able to stop anyone on our team from obliterating him. Is he going to guard Kyrie? JB? Tatum??
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: tarheelsxxiii on December 06, 2017, 08:54:49 PM
Doubt it, lol

How quickly we forget a historic season...
Not really at all. I think we're well suited to defend him, especially if his slows him down. And it doesn't really matter about his offence, because he won't be able to stop anyone on our team from obliterating him. Is he going to guard Kyrie? JB? Tatum??

He and Kyrie will do an awful job of defending one another, as theyre both horrible on that end.  I'm happy to point out all of Kyrie's mistakes for you during next game, if you remain doubtful.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: esel1000 on December 06, 2017, 09:02:08 PM
wrong thread
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: tarheelsxxiii on December 06, 2017, 09:05:45 PM
wrong thread

There's no wrong thread, esel.  Wherever you are, there you'll be.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: gouki88 on December 06, 2017, 09:14:28 PM
Doubt it, lol

How quickly we forget a historic season...
Not really at all. I think we're well suited to defend him, especially if his slows him down. And it doesn't really matter about his offence, because he won't be able to stop anyone on our team from obliterating him. Is he going to guard Kyrie? JB? Tatum??

He and Kyrie will do an awful job of defending one another, as theyre both horrible on that end.  I'm happy to point out all of Kyrie's mistakes for you during next game, if you remain doubtful.
I like how you continue to think Kyrie is in the same realm of useless that IT is in on that end. It's very out of touch.

I'll pass on that offer
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: tarheelsxxiii on December 06, 2017, 09:15:25 PM
Doubt it, lol

How quickly we forget a historic season...
Not really at all. I think we're well suited to defend him, especially if his slows him down. And it doesn't really matter about his offence, because he won't be able to stop anyone on our team from obliterating him. Is he going to guard Kyrie? JB? Tatum??

He and Kyrie will do an awful job of defending one another, as theyre both horrible on that end.  I'm happy to point out all of Kyrie's mistakes for you during next game, if you remain doubtful.
I like how you continue to think Kyrie is in the same realm of useless that IT is in on that end. It's very out of touch.

Cool dude. 
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Surferdad on December 06, 2017, 09:16:36 PM
Wrong thread.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: tarheelsxxiii on December 06, 2017, 09:20:57 PM
Wrong thread.

There is no wrong thread, surferdad.  Wherever you are, there you'll be.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: wayupnorth on December 06, 2017, 09:21:43 PM
Doubt it, lol

How quickly we forget a historic season...
Not really at all. I think we're well suited to defend him, especially if his slows him down. And it doesn't really matter about his offence, because he won't be able to stop anyone on our team from obliterating him. Is he going to guard Kyrie? JB? Tatum??

He and Kyrie will do an awful job of defending one another, as theyre both horrible on that end.  I'm happy to point out all of Kyrie's mistakes for you during next game, if you remain doubtful.

Lol bro.

IT isn't even close to Kyrie as far as defense goes.

Bias aside, that shouldn't even be in question.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: tarheelsxxiii on December 06, 2017, 09:22:39 PM
Doubt it, lol

How quickly we forget a historic season...
Not really at all. I think we're well suited to defend him, especially if his slows him down. And it doesn't really matter about his offence, because he won't be able to stop anyone on our team from obliterating him. Is he going to guard Kyrie? JB? Tatum??

He and Kyrie will do an awful job of defending one another, as theyre both horrible on that end.  I'm happy to point out all of Kyrie's mistakes for you during next game, if you remain doubtful.

Lol bro.

IT isn't even close to Kyrie as far as defense goes.

Bias aside, that shouldn't even be in question.

Cool dude.

I'm high on pain killers, but I'll bet you 10 TPs that i did not state that in the quoted post.  Deal?

Remember... wherever you are wayupnorth, there you will be.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: bopna on December 06, 2017, 10:05:03 PM
IT has been pretty well contained all 3 years in the playoffs. With the exception of a few explosive games, he's been reasonably held in check.

It's Kyrie that's gonna be doin the torching.

To be fair, it was easy to keep him in check because those Cs teams didn't have a legit No. 2 scorer.
And this past year he was going through a lot.

family tragedy, hip injury, and the tooth stuff.

That said, Cavs have no where to hide him against us. Brown's way too big and strong and Irving will have a field day.

If we lose, then I will root for Isaiah in the finals, but against us I want him to be garbage!!!

As much as I hate Lebron...if the Cavs beat us fair and square then yes..im also rooting for the Cavs against the Warriors..heck even in the last Finals i actually found myself rooting for the Cavs just because of that snake.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: SparzWizard on December 06, 2017, 11:04:02 PM
IT has been pretty well contained all 3 years in the playoffs. With the exception of a few explosive games, he's been reasonably held in check.

It's Kyrie that's gonna be doin the torching.

To be fair, it was easy to keep him in check because those Cs teams didn't have a legit No. 2 scorer.
And this past year he was going through a lot.

family tragedy, hip injury, and the tooth stuff.

That said, Cavs have no where to hide him against us. Brown's way too big and strong and Irving will have a field day.

If we lose, then I will root for Isaiah in the finals, but against us I want him to be garbage!!!

As much as I hate Lebron...if the Cavs beat us fair and square then yes..im also rooting for the Cavs against the Warriors..heck even in the last Finals i actually found myself rooting for the Cavs just because of that snake.

If the Cavs beat the Celtics, I'm gonna root for whoever comes out of the West. Last year I was for the Cavs because I got tired of the Warriors' and their mighty Big 4. Now I'm whatever with them.

I hate rooting for James Harden and the Rockets, but they're playing at championship-level basketball right now.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: KGs Knee on December 07, 2017, 01:23:05 AM
If IT actually is 95% healthy when the playoffs roll around, and we face the Cavs in what will likely be the ECF, it's certainly possible he scores a lot of points.

But he'll give up more than he scores, which is all that matters.  He has no chance of guarding anyone in the Celtics starting lineup.  Kyrie-Jaylen-Jayson -- ask yourself who does he guard?
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Celtics4ever on December 07, 2017, 06:33:06 AM
Quote
..if the Cavs beat us fair and square then yes..im also rooting for the Cavs against the Warriors..heck even in the last Finals i actually found myself rooting for the Cavs just because of that snake.

I simply quit watching once we are out.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Moranis on December 07, 2017, 08:19:06 AM
If IT actually is 95% healthy when the playoffs roll around, and we face the Cavs in what will likely be the ECF, it's certainly possible he scores a lot of points.

But he'll give up more than he scores, which is all that matters.  He has no chance of guarding anyone in the Celtics starting lineup.  Kyrie-Jaylen-Jayson -- ask yourself who does he guard?
Who is going to guard IT though?  It works both ways.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Roy H. on December 07, 2017, 08:28:09 AM
If IT actually is 95% healthy when the playoffs roll around, and we face the Cavs in what will likely be the ECF, it's certainly possible he scores a lot of points.

But he'll give up more than he scores, which is all that matters.  He has no chance of guarding anyone in the Celtics starting lineup.  Kyrie-Jaylen-Jayson -- ask yourself who does he guard?

I feel fairly confident that he’ll outscore Brown and Tatum.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Surferdad on December 07, 2017, 08:36:42 AM
Wrong thread.

There is no wrong thread, surferdad.  Wherever you are, there you'll be.
Thanks for the philosophical response.  I was in the game thread, and like you say, I was there.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: jpotter33 on December 07, 2017, 08:47:45 AM
If IT actually is 95% healthy when the playoffs roll around, and we face the Cavs in what will likely be the ECF, it's certainly possible he scores a lot of points.

But he'll give up more than he scores, which is all that matters.  He has no chance of guarding anyone in the Celtics starting lineup.  Kyrie-Jaylen-Jayson -- ask yourself who does he guard?
Who is going to guard IT though?  It works both ways.

Yeah, you always say that, but that's not what people are talking about. We're not talking about defensive ability alone here; we're talking about general size. IT will give up at least 6 inches guarding Kyrie, and he'll give up 10 inches to a foot on Brown and Tatum. That's not the same thing as saying, "Kyrie is an average individual defender going up against a good offensive player in IT." It's much more of a disadvantage.

Besides, it'll probably be Brown on him anyways. IT has always struggled against bigger, lankier defenders, and Stevens knows this. And Brown will be the biggest, lankiest, and most athletic defender to have ever guarded IT full time.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: BitterJim on December 07, 2017, 09:56:28 AM
If IT actually is 95% healthy when the playoffs roll around, and we face the Cavs in what will likely be the ECF, it's certainly possible he scores a lot of points.

But he'll give up more than he scores, which is all that matters.  He has no chance of guarding anyone in the Celtics starting lineup.  Kyrie-Jaylen-Jayson -- ask yourself who does he guard?

I feel fairly confident that he’ll outscore Brown and Tatum.

I don't know why people feel like he'll give up more than he scores. There's a reason we were so much better with him on the floor than off last year, and it's because he was absolutely elite offensively.  Unless his hip is still really dogging him, he'll be a net positive out there.  His elite offensive ability will outweigh his defensive impact, just like it did for us.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Ilikesports17 on December 07, 2017, 10:19:39 AM
If IT actually is 95% healthy when the playoffs roll around, and we face the Cavs in what will likely be the ECF, it's certainly possible he scores a lot of points.

But he'll give up more than he scores, which is all that matters.  He has no chance of guarding anyone in the Celtics starting lineup.  Kyrie-Jaylen-Jayson -- ask yourself who does he guard?

I feel fairly confident that he’ll outscore Brown and Tatum.

I don't know why people feel like he'll give up more than he scores. There's a reason we were so much better with him on the floor than off last year, and it's because he was absolutely elite offensively.  Unless his hip is still really dogging him, he'll be a net positive out there.  His elite offensive ability will outweigh his defensive impact, just like it did for us.
part of it was the role he was able to have in our offense.

His shot creation was so crucial to our offense that his offensive impact was immense. He was asked to create [dang] near everything for us and he was unbelievably successful in doing so, but theres a few things.

1. Last seasons production was unsustainable. He was due for some level of regression no matter what.

2. Hip injury is unlikely to go away. That injury doesnt heal on its own and he didnt get surgery. He can manage the pain (like he did for a lot of last year) but he wont ever be 100%.

3. Lebron James is there and will create most of the offense. When IT was on the floor with us last year he was able to give us A+ offense because it all revolved around him. His gravity, his shot creation, his playmaking, the whole thing. In Cleveland, Lebron monopolizes a lot of this stuff and although he will not hesitate to allow IT to handle the ball, the system simply isnt built to maximize ITs skills like it was in Boston(this is speculation on my part). Because of this, Thomas wont be able to give the same level of positive impact on offense, while having almost exactly the same level of negative impact on D.

4. He is no longer on the Celtics and I now want to beat the team that he is on.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Rosco917 on December 07, 2017, 11:11:44 AM
I'm sure he'll get his...just as I'm sure he'll force his teammates to carry his defensive load in each game. His lack of defensive value is an energy draw on the entire team. His teammates get fatigued as he tries to score on the other end.   

It's only a matter of time when he goes to the rim and gets knocked down that he'll come up limping and go to the bench.

As we're now seeing...team defense matters.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: crimson_stallion on December 07, 2017, 11:59:55 PM
The more correct statement would be that IT's defense is going to torch the Cavs. 

Love the guy, but he probably is the worst defensive player in the entire NBA. 
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: tarheelsxxiii on December 08, 2017, 12:31:56 AM
The more correct statement would be that IT's defense is going to torch the Cavs. 

Love the guy, but he probably is the worst defensive player in the entire NBA.

Probably one of the worst, but there are some horrific defenders.  That includes several 'stars'.

CLE has an elite defense that will prob be able to hide him effectively though, and with LBJ, they have everything it takes to become uber elite in the playoffs.  With experience to boot.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: wayupnorth on December 08, 2017, 12:33:27 AM
The more correct statement would be that IT's defense is going to torch the Cavs. 

Love the guy, but he probably is the worst defensive player in the entire NBA.

Probably one of the worst, but there are some horrific defenders.  That includes several 'stars'.

CLE has an elite defense that will prob be able to hide him effectively though, and with LBJ, they have everything it takes to become uber elite in the playoffs.  With experience to boot.

Outside of LBJ, maybe Crowder, what do you think they have that gives them "uber-elite" defensive potential?
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: tarheelsxxiii on December 08, 2017, 12:41:49 AM
The more correct statement would be that IT's defense is going to torch the Cavs. 

Love the guy, but he probably is the worst defensive player in the entire NBA.

Probably one of the worst, but there are some horrific defenders.  That includes several 'stars'.

CLE has an elite defense that will prob be able to hide him effectively though, and with LBJ, they have everything it takes to become uber elite in the playoffs.  With experience to boot.

Outside of LBJ, maybe Crowder, what do you think they have that gives them "uber-elite" defensive potential?

No one really, and they're mediocre right now -- i should've said potential. So you're right there - I was wrong - statistically, they're mediocre at best right now in terms of efficiency. But with LBJ, they can clamp down when needed in the playoffs.  I think that won them their chip over GS as much as Kyrie's hail mary 3.

They're coasting right now.  I argued that they'd coast thru reg season well before their current win streak.  A'nd when u coast, youre more likely to dog it on D than O.  Don't u think?

Edit: 2nd best defensive efficiency in the playoffs last year,but pretty bad in reg season:

https://stats.nba.com/teams/defense/?sort=W&dir=-1&Season=2016-17&SeasonType=Playoffs (https://stats.nba.com/teams/defense/?sort=W&dir=-1&Season=2016-17&SeasonType=Playoffs)
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: KGs Knee on December 08, 2017, 01:04:07 AM
If IT actually is 95% healthy when the playoffs roll around, and we face the Cavs in what will likely be the ECF, it's certainly possible he scores a lot of points.

But he'll give up more than he scores, which is all that matters.  He has no chance of guarding anyone in the Celtics starting lineup.  Kyrie-Jaylen-Jayson -- ask yourself who does he guard?
Who is going to guard IT though?  It works both ways.

My guess would be Jaylen, but it could be Kyrie, at least when the starters are in.  And if it is Kyrie, well, I trust him to be able to limit IT much more than IT being able to limit Kyrie.

And if for some reason the Cavs think they can hide IT on Jaylen, I feel confident Jaylen will be able to score with ease.

There just is no where for the Cavs to hide IT against the C's.  It will be a big problem for them.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Celtics4ever on December 08, 2017, 06:11:32 AM
I think we will be fine.   I don't think we are favorites but when you play the Cavs I worry more about LeBron than what IT will do to us.   Maybe he will be like Crowder and revert to his old self once outside of CBS system.   It happened to Turner, too.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Moranis on December 08, 2017, 08:43:24 AM
If IT actually is 95% healthy when the playoffs roll around, and we face the Cavs in what will likely be the ECF, it's certainly possible he scores a lot of points.

But he'll give up more than he scores, which is all that matters.  He has no chance of guarding anyone in the Celtics starting lineup.  Kyrie-Jaylen-Jayson -- ask yourself who does he guard?
Who is going to guard IT though?  It works both ways.

Yeah, you always say that, but that's not what people are talking about. We're not talking about defensive ability alone here; we're talking about general size. IT will give up at least 6 inches guarding Kyrie, and he'll give up 10 inches to a foot on Brown and Tatum. That's not the same thing as saying, "Kyrie is an average individual defender going up against a good offensive player in IT." It's much more of a disadvantage.

Besides, it'll probably be Brown on him anyways. IT has always struggled against bigger, lankier defenders, and Stevens knows this. And Brown will be the biggest, lankiest, and most athletic defender to have ever guarded IT full time.
Sure IT is smaller, but he is also a lot faster than any Celtic defender (even Irving).  IT's speed is a real problem for Boston.  Brown and Smart aren't fast enough and Irving just isn't good enough to defend IT.  Teams could double him up last year and slow him down, but you can't double IT on the Cavs because they are just too good offensively as a whole. 
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: mmmmm on December 08, 2017, 11:01:32 AM

2. Hip injury is unlikely to go away. That injury doesnt heal on its own and he didnt get surgery. He can manage the pain (like he did for a lot of last year) but he wont ever be 100%.


So ... you've seen Thomas' MRI scans and x-rays?  And you've spoken to his doctors?   Or are you just making stuff up because it makes for a story you like?

As someone who had to learn an awful lot about hips in recent years, I can tell you that the fact that he didn't need surgery doesn't mean he's more likely to have trouble with it.   It can very much mean he won't have any trouble with it.   It's impossible for you or I to say.   It all depends on the exact nature of HIS hips.  And as far as I can tell, no one has violated HEPA laws yet by releasing Thomas' scans.   So we just don't know.

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3. Lebron James is there and will create most of the offense. When IT was on the floor with us last year he was able to give us A+ offense because it all revolved around him. His gravity, his shot creation, his playmaking, the whole thing. In Cleveland, Lebron monopolizes a lot of this stuff and although he will not hesitate to allow IT to handle the ball, the system simply isnt built to maximize ITs skills like it was in Boston(this is speculation on my part). Because of this, Thomas wont be able to give the same level of positive impact on offense, while having almost exactly the same level of negative impact on D.

I think this is extremely off-base.  Thomas worked a ton 'off the ball' last year due to  Smart's ineffectiveness away from the ball and because we ran the offense through Al Horford so much and should have no problem doing so with James.  Thomas is also a far more credible outside threat than Rose, Barea or Wade and will greatly improve the spacing for James to attack with.

Also - and this is perhaps the most critical, is that when Lebron sits, Thomas and Kevin Love will be able run an elite pick & roll attack.   The two have extremely complementary skills, similar to the way Thomas and Horford matched up last year.    Thomas and Love have history, being very close friends way back in their AAU days - even sleeping over at each other's houses.   I expect them to have very good chemistry -- something Love and Kyrie never seemed to have.

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4. He is no longer on the Celtics and I now want to beat the team that he is on.

I concur with that.  But it would be a mistake to underestimate that team.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Monkhouse on December 08, 2017, 11:16:41 AM

2. Hip injury is unlikely to go away. That injury doesnt heal on its own and he didnt get surgery. He can manage the pain (like he did for a lot of last year) but he wont ever be 100%.


So ... you've seen Thomas' MRI scans and x-rays?  And you've spoken to his doctors?   Or are you just making stuff up because it makes for a story you like?

As someone who had to learn an awful lot about hips in recent years, I can tell you that the fact that he didn't need surgery doesn't mean he's more likely to have trouble with it.   It can very much mean he won't have any trouble with it.   It's impossible for you or I to say.   It all depends on the exact nature of HIS hips.  And as far as I can tell, no one has violated HEPA laws yet by releasing Thomas' scans.   So we just don't know.

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3. Lebron James is there and will create most of the offense. When IT was on the floor with us last year he was able to give us A+ offense because it all revolved around him. His gravity, his shot creation, his playmaking, the whole thing. In Cleveland, Lebron monopolizes a lot of this stuff and although he will not hesitate to allow IT to handle the ball, the system simply isnt built to maximize ITs skills like it was in Boston(this is speculation on my part). Because of this, Thomas wont be able to give the same level of positive impact on offense, while having almost exactly the same level of negative impact on D.

I think this is extremely off-base.  Thomas worked a ton 'off the ball' last year due to  Smart's ineffectiveness away from the ball and because we ran the offense through Al Horford so much and should have no problem doing so with James.  Thomas is also a far more credible outside threat than Rose, Barea or Wade and will greatly improve the spacing for James to attack with.

Also - and this is perhaps the most critical, is that when Lebron sits, Thomas and Kevin Love will be able run an elite pick & roll attack.   The two have extremely complementary skills, similar to the way Thomas and Horford matched up last year.    Thomas and Love have history, being very close friends way back in their AAU days - even sleeping over at each other's houses.   I expect them to have very good chemistry -- something Love and Kyrie never seemed to have.

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4. He is no longer on the Celtics and I now want to beat the team that he is on.

I concur with that.  But it would be a mistake to underestimate that team.

TP. I agree with literally everything you say...

I actually think even though Isaiah Thomas isn't a better defender than Kyrie, the chemistry that Love and IT will have on the pick and roll will actually allow them both to have complimentary scoring options and will allow LBJ to sit for extended minutes.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: mmmmm on December 08, 2017, 11:21:04 AM
The more correct statement would be that IT's defense is going to torch the Cavs. 

Love the guy, but he probably is the worst defensive player in the entire NBA.

I'm betting you have never seen Devin Booker play defense.

(Hint:  Because he doesn't.)

Ultimately, though, guard defense is such an overrated thing.    Especially for elite scoring guards.    I don't put much weight on their defense at all because it's not nearly as important as the defense you get from your bigs & wings.    And the last thing I want is for my elite scoring guard to get tagged with a couple of early fouls because he was trying to take charges or getting too aggressive reaching in on defense.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: celticsclay on December 08, 2017, 12:17:26 PM
The more correct statement would be that IT's defense is going to torch the Cavs. 

Love the guy, but he probably is the worst defensive player in the entire NBA.

I'm betting you have never seen Devin Booker play defense.

(Hint:  Because he doesn't.)

Ultimately, though, guard defense is such an overrated thing.    Especially for elite scoring guards.    I don't put much weight on their defense at all because it's not nearly as important as the defense you get from your bigs & wings.    And the last thing I want is for my elite scoring guard to get tagged with a couple of early fouls because he was trying to take charges or getting too aggressive reaching in on defense.

I think bad guard defense can be overcome to a degree by having a great interior defender that can deter some drives and/or great team defensive schemes. The Cavs rim protector is currently Kevin Love or Tristan Thompson who probably couldn't even stop his girlfriend from dunking on him earlier in the season. Their team defense is also very mediocre and Lue is hardly known as an innovative coach that can come up with elaborate schemes to hide IT.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Larry for 3 on December 08, 2017, 12:23:18 PM
Good luck 2 IT in trying to guard that Kyrie Horford 1-5 pick and roll In the 4th quarter which then means he gets switched 2 someone else, would love to see IT try be hidden on Smart or Brown. Hello post ups . The the defense has to double which puts everyone in rotation. I like my chances in that situation, espically witb he way Tatum’s shooting the 3 so far , getting open looks in the 4 th quarter is so key. We knock em down we win.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Ilikesports17 on December 08, 2017, 12:50:49 PM

2. Hip injury is unlikely to go away. That injury doesnt heal on its own and he didnt get surgery. He can manage the pain (like he did for a lot of last year) but he wont ever be 100%.


So ... you've seen Thomas' MRI scans and x-rays?  And you've spoken to his doctors?   Or are you just making stuff up because it makes for a story you like?

As someone who had to learn an awful lot about hips in recent years, I can tell you that the fact that he didn't need surgery doesn't mean he's more likely to have trouble with it.   It can very much mean he won't have any trouble with it.   It's impossible for you or I to say.   It all depends on the exact nature of HIS hips.  And as far as I can tell, no one has violated HEPA laws yet by releasing Thomas' scans.   So we just don't know.
I havent seen any MRIs or anything of that nature, but unless Boston has lied about the injury, and it is a torn hip labrum, then it will not heal. Those things dont heal on their own. Its possible that he will be able to manage the injury such that he is able to play at 100% percent, so my post was perhaps inaccurate, but I wouldnt expect it and even if he is at 100% on the court, he will have to manage pain in that hip for the rest of his career.

Dont need to look at MRIs to figure that out. Cant do the stuff a pro athlete does with a torn labrum and expect there not to be a lot of pain.
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3. Lebron James is there and will create most of the offense. When IT was on the floor with us last year he was able to give us A+ offense because it all revolved around him. His gravity, his shot creation, his playmaking, the whole thing. In Cleveland, Lebron monopolizes a lot of this stuff and although he will not hesitate to allow IT to handle the ball, the system simply isnt built to maximize ITs skills like it was in Boston(this is speculation on my part). Because of this, Thomas wont be able to give the same level of positive impact on offense, while having almost exactly the same level of negative impact on D.

I think this is extremely off-base.  Thomas worked a ton 'off the ball' last year due to  Smart's ineffectiveness away from the ball and because we ran the offense through Al Horford so much and should have no problem doing so with James.  Thomas is also a far more credible outside threat than Rose, Barea or Wade and will greatly improve the spacing for James to attack with.

Also - and this is perhaps the most critical, is that when Lebron sits, Thomas and Kevin Love will be able run an elite pick & roll attack.   The two have extremely complementary skills, similar to the way Thomas and Horford matched up last year.    Thomas and Love have history, being very close friends way back in their AAU days - even sleeping over at each other's houses.   I expect them to have very good chemistry -- something Love and Kyrie never seemed to have.
They played together when they were like 16. I dont think that means auto-chemistry.

More importantly, IT simply cant have the same offensive level of impact that he did last year. If you think he can have that impact I just dont know what to say to you. It was a freakish combination of volume and efficiency that Id be shocked to see him match on either count with the Cavs. If nothing else you can chalk up his "decline" in impact to the law of diminishing returns. With an elite offense and Lebron James already in place, IT simply cant provide the same impact he did last year.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: playdream on December 08, 2017, 12:55:11 PM
I love IT but the truth is he will be lucky to get 15PPG with 45% shooting on the Cavs
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: Ilikesports17 on December 08, 2017, 03:12:40 PM
I love IT but the truth is he will be lucky to get 15PPG with 45% shooting on the Cavs
que?

Derrick Rose got 14 on 47% shooting.

I expect Thomas to get somewhere around 20 a game(probably a bit more) and I expect him to be very efficient.

Unless you know something about his hip the rest of us dont, your projection is nothing short of absurd, especially for someone who "loves" Thomas.
Title: Re: This guy is going to torch us in the ECFs
Post by: kozlodoev on December 08, 2017, 03:46:24 PM
I love IT but the truth is he will be lucky to get 15PPG with 45% shooting on the Cavs
que?

Derrick Rose got 14 on 47% shooting.

I expect Thomas to get somewhere around 20 a game(probably a bit more) and I expect him to be very efficient.

Unless you know something about his hip the rest of us dont, your projection is nothing short of absurd, especially for someone who "loves" Thomas.
I agree, I think he'll be able to score 18-20 just by showing up. It's the other aspects of his game that will make or break how much he contributes.