CelticsStrong
Celtics Basketball => Celtics Talk => Topic started by: CelticsElite on December 05, 2017, 07:42:57 AM
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https://twitter.com/ESPNForsberg/status/937832891278675969
Rookie Jayson Tatum averaging a team-best 1.137 points per play, per Synergy.
He’s 6th in NBA among high-volume players with > 250 plays finished.
Some names close behind him…
8. Klay Thompson (1.131)
9. Steph Curry (1.13)
10. LeBron James (1.123)
12. Kevin Durant (1.097)
This was before last night's game where he did great
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I know they don't want to force the issue, but why doesn't he get more touches?
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I know they don't want to force the issue, but why doesn't he get more touches?
I think you answered your own question. That said, I do think they’ll start calling more plays for him as the season progresses. Thought I saw that a couple times last night.
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I know they don't want to force the issue, but why doesn't he get more touches?
nba is scared that Tatum will rob Simmons of ROY and also rob Harden of league MVP at the same time. Nba forced brad to make Tatum 15th option on offense
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https://twitter.com/ESPNForsberg/status/937832891278675969
Rookie Jayson Tatum averaging a team-best 1.137 points per play, per Synergy.
He’s 6th in NBA among high-volume players with > 250 plays finished.
Some names close behind him…
8. Klay Thompson (1.131)
9. Steph Curry (1.13)
10. LeBron James (1.123)
12. Kevin Durant (1.097)
This was before last night's game where he did great
A tiny bit misleading given his usage rate, but he's still been absolutely fantastic at picking his spots and executing when they call on him.
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I know they don't want to force the issue, but why doesn't he get more touches?
I think you answered your own question. That said, I do think they’ll start calling more plays for him as the season progresses. Thought I saw that a couple times last night.
Thank goodness for Al Horford or we might be talking about how Tatum put up 0 points last night instead. Don't get me wrong, Tatum deserves all the credit in the world in being able to create space for himself on those 3s, but Horford was seemingly the only Cs player to look for him.
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He’s been way better than we’ve had any right to expect. His shooting, in particular, has taken a big leap from Duke.
The poise from a guy who should be a college sophomore is uncanny.
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I know they don't want to force the issue, but why doesn't he get more touches?
Cause Kyrie need 24 fga...
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https://twitter.com/ESPNForsberg/status/937832891278675969
Rookie Jayson Tatum averaging a team-best 1.137 points per play, per Synergy.
He’s 6th in NBA among high-volume players with > 250 plays finished.
Some names close behind him…
8. Klay Thompson (1.131)
9. Steph Curry (1.13)
10. LeBron James (1.123)
12. Kevin Durant (1.097)
This was before last night's game where he did great
Forsberg keeps talking about "high volume players", but there's no comparison in volume between Tatum and guys like LeBron. Tatum has been great, but he's benefiting greatly by the fact that Irving and Horford are on our team.
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So who is 1-5? That information would tell me whether this stat is worth a [dang]? Second, the fact that the guys behind him are so high on the list given there high usage rates is extremely impressive. More likely than not, increasing Tatum's usage rate would cause him to tumble down this list.
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He's still really feeling his way in the NBA. There are times when he simply can't find a shot. That will remedy itself with more experience.
By the end of the year, teammates will look to find him where he has the best chance to score the ball.
Also, he's bound to run into a stamina wall during his first season.
Think of it this way...only 2 years ago he was just getting his drivers license.
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I think he's the only on to have started every game too.
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He's obviously much lower volume than the Curry and LeBrons of the world, but it's worth noting that he also has a great free throw rate.
Given a couple more minutes per night, and some touches around the basket, I don't think it's crazy to say he could approach 20ppg without his efficiency tanking.
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Marc D'Amico @celtics
about 1 hour ago
Most points by a BOS rookie through the team's first 25 games in franchise history (via @celtics_stats): 1. Bird - 454 (1979-80) 2. Cowens - 446 (1970-71) 3. Radja - 379 (1993-94) 4. TATUM - 348 (2017-18) 5. Pierce - 333 (1998-99)
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Marc D'Amico @celtics
about 1 hour ago
Most points by a BOS rookie through the team's first 25 games in franchise history (via @celtics_stats): 1. Bird - 454 (1979-80) 2. Cowens - 446 (1970-71) 3. Radja - 379 (1993-94) 4. TATUM - 348 (2017-18) 5. Pierce - 333 (1998-99)
Pretty solid company there.
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wow! Tatum is looking like a stud! who could have known his shooting would turn out to be this good? yes he is getting a lot of good looks, but the important part is that he is knocking them down!
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So who is 1-5? That information would tell me whether this stat is worth a [dang]? Second, the fact that the guys behind him are so high on the list given there high usage rates is extremely impressive. More likely than not, increasing Tatum's usage rate would cause him to tumble down this list.
You’re missing the point. LeBron’s been playing in the NBA for nearly as long as Tatum has been walking. But seriously, you can’t compare usage rates of guys who’ve been in the league as long as LeBron (15th season in NBA), Durant (11th), and Curry (9th) to a 19 year old.
Any way you slice it, it’s impressive. His TS% is .649 and his eFG% is .597. For a rookie forward, that’s pretty absurd. His ORtg is 121 and DRtg 101.
Once again, he’s 19!
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Marc D'Amico @celtics
about 1 hour ago
Most points by a BOS rookie through the team's first 25 games in franchise history (via @celtics_stats): 1. Bird - 454 (1979-80) 2. Cowens - 446 (1970-71) 3. Radja - 379 (1993-94) 4. TATUM - 348 (2017-18) 5. Pierce - 333 (1998-99)
That is a little misleading because it is team games, not player games (Pierce for example scored 357 points in his first 25 games).
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Marc D'Amico @celtics
about 1 hour ago
Most points by a BOS rookie through the team's first 25 games in franchise history (via @celtics_stats): 1. Bird - 454 (1979-80) 2. Cowens - 446 (1970-71) 3. Radja - 379 (1993-94) 4. TATUM - 348 (2017-18) 5. Pierce - 333 (1998-99)
Dino!!!
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I apologize, but I'm not that familiar with some of these advanced stats. What is the points per play stat measuring? In other words, what information is taken into account to come up with the stat?
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wow! Tatum is looking like a stud! who could have known his shooting would turn out to be this good? yes he is getting a lot of good looks, but the important part is that he is knocking them down!
Danny knew
He said after Tatum worked out pre-draft that Tatum is the best shooter who has ever come in for a workout.
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So who is 1-5? That information would tell me whether this stat is worth a [dang]? Second, the fact that the guys behind him are so high on the list given there high usage rates is extremely impressive. More likely than not, increasing Tatum's usage rate would cause him to tumble down this list.
You’re missing the point. LeBron’s been playing in the NBA for nearly as long as Tatum has been walking. But seriously, you can’t compare usage rates of guys who’ve been in the league as long as LeBron (15th season in NBA), Durant (11th), and Curry (9th) to a 19 year old.
Any way you slice it, it’s impressive. His TS% is .649 and his eFG% is .597. For a rookie forward, that’s pretty absurd. His ORtg is 121 and DRtg 101.
Once again, he’s 19!
Hey, I know Tatum looks great. I’m just asking for full disclosure on this stat. If the names at 1-5 aren’t as impressive as the ones immediately behind Tatum then the data is brought into proper perspective.
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Great article on Tatum's time with the team.
http://www.masslive.com/celtics/index.ssf/2017/12/kyrie_irving_al_horford_help_e.html
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Marc D'Amico @celtics
about 1 hour ago
Most points by a BOS rookie through the team's first 25 games in franchise history (via @celtics_stats): 1. Bird - 454 (1979-80) 2. Cowens - 446 (1970-71) 3. Radja - 379 (1993-94) 4. TATUM - 348 (2017-18) 5. Pierce - 333 (1998-99)
That is a little misleading because it is team games, not player games (Pierce for example scored 357 points in his first 25 games).
Not misleading, just attaching value to being able to play right away.
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https://twitter.com/ESPNForsberg/status/937832891278675969
Rookie Jayson Tatum averaging a team-best 1.137 points per play, per Synergy.
He’s 6th in NBA among high-volume players with > 250 plays finished.
Some names close behind him…
8. Klay Thompson (1.131)
9. Steph Curry (1.13)
10. LeBron James (1.123)
12. Kevin Durant (1.097)
This was before last night's game where he did great
A tiny bit misleading given his usage rate, but he's still been absolutely fantastic at picking his spots and executing when they call on him.
I don't care if it is misleading, this is legit superstar type stuff for a rookie.
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I know they don't want to force the issue, but why doesn't he get more touches?
Cause Kyrie need 24 fga...
To be fair, Kyrie is shooting 49% / 37% / 87% while putting up an extremely respectable 1.32 Points Per FGA - which I would hazard a guess is probably BY FAR the most efficient of his career.
1.32 Pts Per FGA is an exceptional number for a PG, especially one who is a high volume scorer like Kyrie. Hard to complain about him getting those shots.
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So who is 1-5? That information would tell me whether this stat is worth a [dang]? Second, the fact that the guys behind him are so high on the list given there high usage rates is extremely impressive. More likely than not, increasing Tatum's usage rate would cause him to tumble down this list.
You’re missing the point. LeBron’s been playing in the NBA for nearly as long as Tatum has been walking. But seriously, you can’t compare usage rates of guys who’ve been in the league as long as LeBron (15th season in NBA), Durant (11th), and Curry (9th) to a 19 year old.
Any way you slice it, it’s impressive. His TS% is .649 and his eFG% is .597. For a rookie forward, that’s pretty absurd. His ORtg is 121 and DRtg 101.
Once again, he’s 19!
Hey, I know Tatum looks great. I’m just asking for full disclosure on this stat. If the names at 1-5 aren’t as impressive as the ones immediately behind Tatum then the data is brought into proper perspective.
I think the numbers are in perfectly fine perspective.
Tatum's efficiency is absolutely historical, not just for a rookie, but for any player.
If he was playing 18 MPG and putting up those efficiency numbers in garbage time, then I would say fair enough those numbers should be taken with a huge grain of salt.
But this kid is playing >30 MPG as a starter and core contributor on the best team in the NBA.
- He's leading the league in 3PT shooting at 51%, and he's doing it on 3 attempts per game - it's not like he's taking a three every 2 or 3 games and it's just down to fluke of small sample size. This kid takes quite a large number of threes, and he's hitting them at a higher percentage than anybody else in the NBA.
- He's got almost half as many free throw attempts (99) as he has FGA (238) - that free throw rate ranks him 12th among all nba players.
How do you secure a place as one of the most efficient offensive players in the NBA? By scoring as many points as possible off as little attempts. How do you do that? By getting free additoinal points off three point shots and free throws - and Tatum is pretty much dominating the league in both categories.
You're holding his usage rate against him - I see it the opposite way. Usage rate measures how many plays/possessions a given player uses on offence. Tatum is a guy who can give you points WITHOUT the need to call a lot of plays for him.
How many times have you seen Tatum finish with something like 14 points, then you look at his stats and he's only taken like 4 shots? It just so happens that he he's gone 3-5 from three (9 pts), 3-4 from the foul line (3 points) and 1-2 on twos (2 points).
If you have a kid who can give you 14 points on 4 field goal attempts, that's not something you complain about..that's for sure.
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Marc D'Amico @celtics
about 1 hour ago
Most points by a BOS rookie through the team's first 25 games in franchise history (via @celtics_stats): 1. Bird - 454 (1979-80) 2. Cowens - 446 (1970-71) 3. Radja - 379 (1993-94) 4. TATUM - 348 (2017-18) 5. Pierce - 333 (1998-99)
That is a little misleading because it is team games, not player games (Pierce for example scored 357 points in his first 25 games).
Not misleading, just attaching value to being able to play right away.
Pierce played right away. He missed a couple of games over the first 25 the team played. That is like saying Embiid scored 0 points in the first 164 team games. All true, but has no real value as a stat.
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So who is 1-5? That information would tell me whether this stat is worth a [dang]? Second, the fact that the guys behind him are so high on the list given there high usage rates is extremely impressive. More likely than not, increasing Tatum's usage rate would cause him to tumble down this list.
You’re missing the point. LeBron’s been playing in the NBA for nearly as long as Tatum has been walking. But seriously, you can’t compare usage rates of guys who’ve been in the league as long as LeBron (15th season in NBA), Durant (11th), and Curry (9th) to a 19 year old.
Any way you slice it, it’s impressive. His TS% is .649 and his eFG% is .597. For a rookie forward, that’s pretty absurd. His ORtg is 121 and DRtg 101.
Once again, he’s 19!
Hey, I know Tatum looks great. I’m just asking for full disclosure on this stat. If the names at 1-5 aren’t as impressive as the ones immediately behind Tatum then the data is brought into proper perspective.
I think the numbers are in perfectly fine perspective.
Tatum's efficiency is absolutely historical, not just for a rookie, but for any player.
If he was playing 18 MPG and putting up those efficiency numbers in garbage time, then I would say fair enough those numbers should be taken with a huge grain of salt.
But this kid is playing >30 MPG as a starter and core contributor on the best team in the NBA.
- He's leading the league in 3PT shooting at 51%, and he's doing it on 3 attempts per game - it's not like he's taking a three every 2 or 3 games and it's just down to fluke of small sample size. This kid takes quite a large number of threes, and he's hitting them at a higher percentage than anybody else in the NBA.
- He's got almost half as many free throw attempts (99) as he has FGA (238) - that free throw rate ranks him 12th among all nba players.
How do you secure a place as one of the most efficient offensive players in the NBA? By scoring as many points as possible off as little attempts. How do you do that? By getting free additoinal points off three point shots and free throws - and Tatum is pretty much dominating the league in both categories.
You're holding his usage rate against him - I see it the opposite way. Usage rate measures how many plays/possessions a given player uses on offence. Tatum is a guy who can give you points WITHOUT the need to call a lot of plays for him.
How many times have you seen Tatum finish with something like 14 points, then you look at his stats and he's only taken like 4 shots? It just so happens that he he's gone 3-5 from three (9 pts), 3-4 from the foul line (3 points) and 1-2 on twos (2 points).
If you have a kid who can give you 14 points on 4 field goal attempts, that's not something you complain about..that's for sure.
the way you worded Tatums performance and statistics makes tatum accomplishment look incredible. Tp
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over the last 6 games, tatums stats have risen to now being
14.3ppg which is 3rd on the team, and 5.6 rpg on 51% shooting from the field and 51% shooting from 3. as he gets even more comfortable with the nba game, I wonder where he can end up at the end of the season?
I think in any other year without Ben simmons, tatum wins the rookie of the year. and tatum is doing this as a major contributer on a top team in the nba
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Can we call Tatum's comp player Klay Thompson but at SF now officially. I said a few times his game and approach mirrors Klay now the numbers are starting show how much.
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Tatum’s three point shooting is just shocking. Unsustainable of course, but shocking nonetheless.
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Tatum ranks #1 in 3 point shooting % so far this season.
#2? Kelly Olynyk... :o
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Can we call Tatum's comp player Klay Thompson but at SF now officially. I said a few times his game and approach mirrors Klay now the numbers are starting show how much.
They're both good shooters but Tatum is much more capable at getting to the rim than Klay already and, I think, more athletic as well.
And when it's said and done Klay will likely be the better shooter as he's probably one of the 5 best pure shooters all time.
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Tatum ranks #1 in 3 point shooting % so far this season.
#2? Kelly Olynyk... :o
Jayson vs Kelly in the three-point contest this season.