CelticsStrong
Celtics Basketball => Celtics Talk => Topic started by: The One on November 18, 2017, 02:22:31 PM
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I know we all love Jayson...and his rookie year has been excellent.
But it’s no guarantee that he ends up better than Jaylen.
I’ve heard high national praise for him this week.
“He’s on the Kawhi track.” - two members of the national media
“I think he’s going to be a top 15 player in this league.” - one former coach
Jayson is more polished and smooth...but Jaylen is a straight up problem with a killer mentality.
I, for one, am curious to see how this turns out.
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Nobody is guaranteeing he will be better than Brown, but he appears to be better at 19 years old.
I just hope they keep pushing each other to be better and play together for the next decade.
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I'm going to guarantee that Tatum WILL be better than brown. Frankly, I think Tatum is better than brown right now. Jaylen has some real holes in his game that will take work to reach average. Jayson has no such holes and is only scratching the surface.
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I think it's a tossup right now due to Jaylen's stunted development.
Tatum had a great college coach/teacher/program at Duke, whereas Jaylen and Rabb and Jabari Bird played for a coach, Cuonzo Martin, who sucked. They basically lost valuable developmental years, 1,2 and 3 respectively due to this guy and didn't come close to maximizing their potential in college.
Maybe we were lucky that Martin sucked so badly and wasn't able to best utilize the many talented players he had. Maybe Jaylen would never have slipped to us had he played for a decent coach/system, and his true abilities were brought out.
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yes not so fast.... we won't know for sure until next season
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Until Jaylen shows me that he can create his own offense, and not just feast on opportunities created for him by others, yes, it does appear Jayson has the higher upside.
Jaylen looks like a #2 or #3 banana on a really good team. Jayson looks like he can potentially be an alpha. That's not written in stone, but it's how it looks at the moment.
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I think it's a tossup right now due to Jaylen's stunted development.
Tatum had a great college coach/teacher/program at Duke, whereas Jaylen and Rabb and Jabari Bird played for a coach, Cuonzo Martin, who sucked. They basically lost valuable developmental years, 1,2 and 3 respectively due to this guy and didn't come close to maximizing their potential in college.
Maybe we were lucky that Martin sucked so badly and wasn't able to best utilize the many talented players he had. Maybe Jaylen would never have slipped to us had he played for a decent coach/system, and his true abilities were brought out.
I am a huge Jaylen fan and don't necessarily disagree with your comment about development (although one and dones often never have the desire to develop much in college), but Jaylen went #3 - I don't exactly think he 'slipped' to us at that draft slot. If anything, Danny and Brad saw through his pedestrian freshman year and were able to snag him up before anybody else could. I just don't think he had any chance of ever before Simmons/Ingram.
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What I appreciate is that we have both guys and they compliment each other's skills. They also both look like they are going to get much stronger in the next couple of years. This is going to be a fun ride.
I wouldn't bet against Jaylen though. This already feels like his team, not Kyrie's. When he turns up the intensity all the way, he seems to be able to impose his will on the game, and he is doing that in most of our games these days, even when his shot isn't going in.
Think about it: It would be a legitimate argument whether Durant or Jaylen was the best player on the floor Thursday night, and that's even with all of his offensive flaws on display. He's shown the same level of competitiveness against LeBron. There's a dozen or so guys in the league that are just more athletic than everyone else, and you need someone like him to compete.
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To me Brown clearly has the high ceiling. His athleticism is upper echelin in the nba and in that regard he just had the ability to do things that Tatum can't, regardless of his evident skill. It's also worth pointing out that Brown has already demonstrated the ability to improve significantly from years one to year two, that's not a leap that any player including Tatum is guaranteed to make. To me that give the idea of Brown getting even better some credence, because he already done it. In addition for this year it's worth pointing out that Brown typically draws the tougher wing assignment, both offensively and defensively, so this eases Tatum burden. And his shooting from three will regress. Plus I love Jaylen attutude. None of this guarantees Brown will be better, Tatum may be more likely ti reach his ceiling, but I'll take Brown
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Ah what a glorious problem to have. Imagine having 2 children who both have the potential to dominate the same area of expertise. Regardless of who gets out on top, you'd still be beaming like a proud parent.
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I thought it was a known thing that jaylen's ceiling was higher.
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Tatum will probably be the better passer and rebounder, but I doubt he'll be a better scorer.
I think Jaylen could have at least one 40 point game this year.
Defensively, still too soon to guess.
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The fact that we are using Tatum's 16 game sample size as a competitive comparison against Brown tells the story for me. Brown's level of mental toughness is higher than Tatum's right now but I wouldn't say his talent is considered better.
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jaylen beat the warriors. i dont think too many other plays in this league can accomplish that.
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I think Tatum has a higher ceiling, but I think Jaylen has more potential.
Jaylen's lateral quickness, and his ability to use his jumping ability to force players into tough shots cannot be understated, especially in a league where being able to switch on everything has become more and more prominent.
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I view Jaylen as the player with a higher potential ceiling, and Tatum with a much higher floor.
Either way it's a great problem to have. These guys are so similar, and yet different enough that they can coexist and I love it. I love the "Fire and Ice" nickname someone coined for them. Jaylen plays with fire and intensity, and Jayson plays with ice in his veins.
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This is like "first world problems". Whatever the outcome, it's good for the C's.
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yes not so fast.... we won't know for sure until next season
What month, so I can mark the calendar?
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This is like "first world problems". Whatever the outcome, it's good for the C's.
Yes. Just happy they are both Celtics and hope we are debating their merits still in 10 years time under the heading 'Who contributed most to all the recent championships'.
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I think it's a tossup right now due to Jaylen's stunted development.
Tatum had a great college coach/teacher/program at Duke, whereas Jaylen and Rabb and Jabari Bird played for a coach, Cuonzo Martin, who sucked. They basically lost valuable developmental years, 1,2 and 3 respectively due to this guy and didn't come close to maximizing their potential in college.
Maybe we were lucky that Martin sucked so badly and wasn't able to best utilize the many talented players he had. Maybe Jaylen would never have slipped to us had he played for a decent coach/system, and his true abilities were brought out.
TP. Coach Martin is a great recruiter, but that is it right now.
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I think it's a tossup right now due to Jaylen's stunted development.
Tatum had a great college coach/teacher/program at Duke, whereas Jaylen and Rabb and Jabari Bird played for a coach, Cuonzo Martin, who sucked. They basically lost valuable developmental years, 1,2 and 3 respectively due to this guy and didn't come close to maximizing their potential in college.
Maybe we were lucky that Martin sucked so badly and wasn't able to best utilize the many talented players he had. Maybe Jaylen would never have slipped to us had he played for a decent coach/system, and his true abilities were brought out.
TP. Coach Martin is a great recruiter, but that is it right now.
Yeah. Cal is one of the more disappointing programs out there considering his ability to get talent. I think Jabari Bird would have gone before 56 with a better coach as well. He clearly has an NBA future ahead of him — it was apparent in summer league.
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Personally, I think it's great we're debating the talent of young Celtics players. It means the FO is hitting in the draft.
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Both guys have some insane potential, and they both display it pretty clearly in glimpses and spurts during games. Defensively they have both bought in to the team philosophy, and they both are unselfish offensive players at this point in their career.
I think the main separating factor between them is the raw athleticism that Jaylen has, that simply cannot be taught. Not that Tatum is a slouch, and he is only 19; with some strength and conditioning coaching, the dude could possibly catch up to Brown. But Brown also has room to grow and develop.
Brown needs to work on his footwork, jumpshot (particularly off the dribble), and his handle against defenders playing tight on him. I think he has the athletic ability and has clearly made a drastic leap in controlling and harnessing his athleticism, to improve the handle and the footwork. The jumpshot confidence has made an obvious leap, so it's really just developing that rythym or "killer instinct". If he can do that, he has the potential to be about 85-90% of what made Kobe great. I actually wish he would reach out to Kobe and get him to mentor him, similar to Lebron with Greek Freak.
Tatum clearly has the more polished offensive game. Even though he has nowhere near the hangtime or leaping ability of Brown, I actually trust Tatum to finish at the rim, where Jaylen just kind of tries to rule like Dominique Wilkins, but he is still too young/timid to just own people who are athletically inferior. The lateral quickness is something I don't know if Tatum will ever catch up to Brown on, but his basketball IQ allows him to cover this "weakness".
Offensive trajectory for Tatum seems more tangible and linear, and we can visualize where he ends up. If he grows and bulks up, he will be a contributor.
I think Brown has the higher defensive trajectory, and really his determination and confidence will determine if he is the 1A to Tatums 1B in the future for this team.
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Heard one of the announcers in a recent game say that Jaylen / Tatum is part of our future core.
I'm a believer.
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I view Jaylen as the player with a higher potential ceiling, and Tatum with a much higher floor.
This is exactly how I feel about it. Jaylen has a higher ceiling than Tatum, but Tatum's floor is better than Jaylen's. Sky's the limit for Jaylen if he can improve his handle, ability to shoot off the bounce, and solve the ft issue. Tatum I forsee a long steady improvement every year into at least an occasional all star player. Brown is the type of player if he figures it out could be one of the best two way players in the league.
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This is like "first world problems". Whatever the outcome, it's good for the C's.
Yeah, they’re both farther along than I expected they’d be this year. They’ve both got a ton of room for growth; either or both could be a legit star.
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This is like "first world problems". Whatever the outcome, it's good for the C's.
Yeah, they’re both farther along than I expected they’d be this year. They’ve both got a ton of room for growth; either or both could be a legit star.
the bright side is we could have ended up with bender and Jackson but we didn’t. The suns can enjoy that haha
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Both have been very impressive with Brown being a candidate for MIP and Tatum for ROY in most years. Particularly on defense they have unbelievable length that that contributed greatly to the C's defensive success. The defense is real and defense travels well in the playoffs. Their offense is a work in progress, but it's far ahead of expectations.
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I think it's a tossup right now due to Jaylen's stunted development.
Tatum had a great college coach/teacher/program at Duke, whereas Jaylen and Rabb and Jabari Bird played for a coach, Cuonzo Martin, who sucked. They basically lost valuable developmental years, 1,2 and 3 respectively due to this guy and didn't come close to maximizing their potential in college.
Maybe we were lucky that Martin sucked so badly and wasn't able to best utilize the many talented players he had. Maybe Jaylen would never have slipped to us had he played for a decent coach/system, and his true abilities were brought out.
I am a huge Jaylen fan and don't necessarily disagree with your comment about development (although one and dones often never have the desire to develop much in college), but Jaylen went #3 - I don't exactly think he 'slipped' to us at that draft slot. If anything, Danny and Brad saw through his pedestrian freshman year and were able to snag him up before anybody else could. I just don't think he had any chance of ever before Simmons/Ingram.
I agree with the first bolden sentence. Danny went out to see Jaylen in a PAC-12 game vs Arizona in Phoenix. He didn't exactly light it up, but Bill Walton was doing the color commentary on the game (and he must've been doing some of those peyote buttons from the dessert because he was tripping, I mean REALLY high) and he was anointing Jaylen as the second coming and implying that Danny didn't feel differently, despite the lackluster performance.
The last sentence I'm not so sure about.
If Jaylen had played in a better program (esp. Duke where he may have outshone Ingram, or Arizona, or Kentucky or UNC or maybe even with the high-flyers at Louisville) he may have jumped over Ingram and the Fakers could have taken him. He was the most explosive athlete at the top of that draft.
Danny made a great pick, no question, especially in light of all the boos that Jaylens selection elicited from the "faithful" on draft night. (And, I'll admit, I was one of the doubters, given how many PAC-12 games I watched, and how many times Jaylen didn't impress.)
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I think it's a tossup right now due to Jaylen's stunted development.
Tatum had a great college coach/teacher/program at Duke, whereas Jaylen and Rabb and Jabari Bird played for a coach, Cuonzo Martin, who sucked. They basically lost valuable developmental years, 1,2 and 3 respectively due to this guy and didn't come close to maximizing their potential in college.
Maybe we were lucky that Martin sucked so badly and wasn't able to best utilize the many talented players he had. Maybe Jaylen would never have slipped to us had he played for a decent coach/system, and his true abilities were brought out.
Jaylen development was never stunted.
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Love both of these guys and it's pretty early in both of their careers still.
The big difference I see besides Jaylens athleticism is confidence. Jaylen is very confident and Brad has convinced him to attack opposing teams. The combination has him excelling in his second year. I look for even bigger breakout performance from him this season..
Jason is getting a lot of minutes because of the Hayward injury. He hasn't disappointed and even though he is obviously thinking a lot out there, he is performing. When it comes together he looks very smooth and his talent is obvious. He makes very few big mistakes even when being schooled by Durant.
The fire and ice nickname is appropriate for these two.
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Jaylen Brown is my Keeper in my fantasy league, but deep down I know Tatum is the better prospect. Honestly he's the best draft pick the Celtics have made in decades. He's basically doing exactly what Paul Pierce did as a 21 year old Rookie, only with slightly higher efficiency and on a winning team.
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The comparison is what is Tatum doing in his first 20 games compared to what Brown did in his first 20 games. Tatum is way ahead in that regard. You still never know how these guys are going to develop. Brown is much more physically developed than Tatum but you would expect that in the next few years, Tatum will catch up. Most young men do but not all.
Tatum is so skilled, so smooth, things it is hard to teach or to practice and learn. Brown has shown remarkable improvement in those areas this season over last.
Flip a coin with these two.
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The big difference I see besides Jaylens athleticism is confidence.
I for one, do not think that Tatum is lacking in athletic ability nor confidence. Who would you trust more to take a clutch shot?
For me, it's Tatum
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I'm going to guarantee that Tatum WILL be better than brown. Frankly, I think Tatum is better than brown right now. Jaylen has some real holes in his game that will take work to reach average. Jayson has no such holes and is only scratching the surface.
I'm in this camp. LOL More polished just needs time on the court and once he really learns the NBA game...look out.
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I think Tatum has the higher ceiling as I could see Tatum being a top 5 player in the game. Brown's ceiling is top 15 player in the game, IMHO. But if they are both Celtics, who cares. They will grow together and be dominant
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Seems to be Tatum. But...
Some here predicted Jaylen's break out in Year Two. Not me. I thought he'd be a little better, and after SL I was sure that he'd take just a step rather than a leap (recall that after a big performance in game 1 of SL, Jaylen looked a lot like rookie Jaylen). What Jaylen's done has me stunned and giddy -- on both ends of the floor. Last year he couldn't dribble the lane without losing the handle or getting the ball knocked out. Still room for improvement there, but he's light year's ahead of rookie Jaylen. His shot has improved, passing has improved, rebounding has significantly improved. But most of all, his defense has leaped. Last year he was often in the wrong place and often beaten. This year he is emerging, and he looks like an elite defender in the making. I think he can be one of a few guys on this team capable of annoying the heck out of LBJ come playoffs. It is Jaylen's leap from Year One to Year Two that makes me wonder if he's got another leap in him. If so, he may challenge Jayson for top guy.
But Tatum comes into the league already special, and that's too rare to ignore.
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I'm going to guarantee that Tatum WILL be better than brown. Frankly, I think Tatum is better than brown right now. Jaylen has some real holes in his game that will take work to reach average. Jayson has no such holes and is only scratching the surface.
I definitely disagree but I am excited for this duo I really hope the pick from philly turns into one more stud young piece because Brown and Tatum are just oozing potential. Brown is the better player right now and has more potential then Tatum is some aspects of the game and the same can be said about Tatum. That is why they complement each other so well.
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I think someone earlier in the thread was right when they described them as Fire and Ice. Both are super talented and young and seem to "fit" well together.
I think Brown has the higher ceiling. He was a raw prospect coming out of Cal. He had a lot of traits and tools but hadn't put anything together yet. Tatum is clearly more advanced offesnively at his age but Brown took a massive leave from year one to year two. He's got the talent and the athleticism to be a legit 2 way force in this league. It might take him a little longer for his offensive game to develop but I believe he's more likely to develop into a legit 2 way star.
All that being said, I do not think Tatum is that far behind. He has an advanced feel for the game has already made him a solid contributor is his first NBA season as a 19 year old. He still has room for physical maturation but he isn't the type of elite athlete Brown is. That is not saying he is not athletic. He's got good athleticism, just not elite. He's been impressive to me defensively so early into his career. He seems to have a high BBIQ ad seems to be in the right spots he majority of the time. I think he's got the potential to be a star but I think his lack of upper tier athleticism will hold him back from reaching that type of level. I do think the Paul Pierce type of comparison is kind of fitting for him though.
Having both on the team is a nice problem to have. It's hard to hit on just one lottery pick, yet alone two of them in back to back years but the Cs might have hit the jackpot with both of these guys. Both could be perennial wing all star type players. Time will tell but it certainly is an exciting time here. If these guys pan out to what we think/hope they will be and add Kyrie/Hayward/Al to the mix over the next couple of seasons, they might be lifting that 18th banner at the Garden.
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The question is not meaningless, but it is one-dimensional, so there is only so far you can get with it. Thanks to these two, the team's ceiling is: multiple championships.
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I believe Brown has the upside to become a Scottie Pippen type force in the NBA, only he has a better 3 point shot.
Tatum has the potential to be a Melo level scorer in the NBA, except he's not a ball-stopper, he's a way better defender already, and he has an extremely impressive 3 point shot.
So think about that, if you can have the modern version of Pippen and Melo on your team, that's pretty scary. These guys are only 21 and 19 years old respectively too! And the best part is they both take pride in playing defense. So they are 2-way players and totally buying into Brad Steven's system. This team could be scary good as JB and JT grow into their games!
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Tatum has better natural feel for the game. Just does. And I love Brown. My favorite Celtic.
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Ultimately, nobody really knows. I thinks Brown may have the highest absolute ceiling. But Tatum maybe a safer bet to reach his ceiling than Brown.
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We are witnessing a #1 scoring option in its infancy…#JayBomb!!!
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I honestly don't care. It seems we have two future star players on our hands. I for one did not see the offensive efficiency coming like this but I also did not expect them to get the touches they are getting because of injuries. It sucks losing Kyrie and Hayward but losing both has been vital for the development for Brown, Tatum and Scary Terry. Without those two going down these three don't develop as rapidly as they have. As for Ceiling on Tatum versus Brown I would have said Tatum has the higher ceiling but at this time I'm not sure. Brown will continue to tighten his handle and become an even better lock down defender. If Brown continues to develop his shot this will be a scary arse duo. I don't know who to pick at this point and that is a wonderful thing because I feel both have insanely high superstar type levels.
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I honestly don't care. It seems we have two future star players on our hands. I for one did not see the offensive efficiency coming like this but I also did not expect them to get the touches they are getting because of injuries. It sucks losing Kyrie and Hayward but losing both has been vital for the development for Brown, Tatum and Scary Terry. Without those two going down these three don't develop as rapidly as they have. As for Ceiling on Tatum versus Brown I would have said Tatum has the higher ceiling but at this time I'm not sure. Brown will continue to tighten his handle and become an even better lock down defender. If Brown continues to develop his shot this will be a scary arse duo. I don't know who to pick at this point and that is a wonderful thing because I feel both have insanely high superstar type levels.
Exactly. TP.
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People are picking out a lot of the good in both players. Don't sleep on the other thing that makes these guys - and it seems, the whole team - special. They are going to keep developing because of their mindset, their makeup. They work hard, they work smart, and they're going to make the most of their talent - not everybody does. I'm expecting them to show new tricks next year, and the year after that.
I'm convinced there is a mental aspect to the team's player selection and development that sets the Cs apart. The resilience is incredible, the composure when the team is down or on the road against a hostile crowd. I don't think it's just luck. The team is picking players for talent, of course, but also there is something in the players' makeup that they see and select for that other teams don't see or can't see.
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Brown s better handle and control this year solidly makes him a bad to the bone long unstoppable 2 guard . He might be scary good by end of next year.
Tatum has a bit different game
Both are gonna be a scary tandem of assassins next year .....with Irvin and Hayward ......buckets will,be scored in bunches.
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People are picking out a lot of the good in both players. Don't sleep on the other thing that makes these guys - and it seems, the whole team - special. They are going to keep developing because of their mindset, their makeup. They work hard, they work smart, and they're going to make the most of their talent - not everybody does. I'm expecting them to show new tricks next year, and the year after that.
I'm convinced there is a mental aspect to the team's player selection and development that sets the Cs apart. The resilience is incredible, the composure when the team is down or on the road against a hostile crowd. I don't think it's just luck. The team is picking players for talent, of course, but also there is something in the players' makeup that they see and select for that other teams don't see or can't see.
Couldn't agree more. I've mentioned in other discussions that Stevens' ability to develop players is an absolute game changer when it comes to drafting young talent. Ainge has the luxury of placing high priority on great athletes with determination, character, and high work ethic. Jaylen and Rozier are great examples of raw prospects who checked off all of those boxes. These guys are now able to grow together and learn how to impact winning under Brad.
The average NBA team doesn't have a strong coach and/or player development philosophy. I look toward the 2016 draft as a perfect example. Guys like Dunn, Hield, Murray, and Chriss were all projected higher than Jaylen according to most mock drafts. I also can't leave out Bender. People were drawn to a Dirk type of ceiling.
I can see why Jaylen would have been difficult to pick if you had no confidence in your player development. At that point you are putting 100% of your faith in the player to figure everything out. Going into the draft he didn't have a consistent shot, was a weak ball handler, and hadn't yet developed a high basketball IQ.
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More likely that Tatum is ultimately the better player, but Jaylen's ceiling is probably still higher. Like the best case scenario for Jaylen is probably a more dominant player than best case for Tatum. But the best case for each is still a top 10 guy.
So it really doesn't matter. Guys rarely hit their absolute ceilings anyway. Both are on the right track and ahead of where I would have expected them to be at this point in their careers. The absolute best thing about them is that they can play together now and going forward.
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I've always thought that Jaylen's ultimate upside was Paul George, and it seems like he's closing in on it already.
They both entered the league at the same age and check them out through two seasons:
http://tinyurl.com/ya48cg5c
George was slightly better in assists, steals, rebounds, Jaylen is slightly better in scoring and efficiency. But they're extremely close.
George wasn't very good in those first two postseasons, though ...
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I’m starting to think that JB is more “untouchable” than Tatum if we decide to trade one...
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I mean, Brown is both older and in his second season. He should look better right now.
Tatum has looked a lot better as a rookie than Brown did.
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I'm not seeing top 10, all-NBA, MVP candidate player in either of them -- at least not the way I see it in Ben Simmons or Embiid. Granted, Embiid has a couple years on them, but neither JB or JT scream likely top 10 to me. They do look like future all-stars (top 25) with the dream scenario being that they'll progress to league-elite players. But right now they are two very promising players who are getting fantastic experience -- and hopefully will adjust seamlessly when they go from being the 1-2 options to the 3-4 options next year.
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I’m starting to think that JB is more “untouchable” than Tatum if we decide to trade one...
It's hard not to feel that way given how he is performing right in front of our eyes. There's a chance that Jaylen could become an efficient 25+ PPG scorer and All-NBA defender.
What makes the decision so difficult for me is that I still see Tatum as having the higher overall offensive ceiling. I really belive Tatum will end up being able to score 20+ in his sleep while being a primary decision maker on offense. The good news is that I think their games will compliment each other perfectly.
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I'm not seeing top 10, all-NBA, MVP candidate player in either of them -- at least not the way I see it in Ben Simmons or Embiid. Granted, Embiid has a couple years on them, but neither JB or JT scream likely top 10 to me. They do look like future all-stars (top 25) with the dream scenario being that they'll progress to league-elite players. But right now they are two very promising players who are getting fantastic experience -- and hopefully will adjust seamlessly when they go from being the 1-2 options to the 3-4 options next year.
So Jaylen Brown, who is 21, has two 30 pt games in the first 4 games of the playoffs and plays all-NBA level defense, and you don't see top 10 potential in him?
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Brown and Tatum have really stepped up. Both looking like future all stars. This is great experience for them.
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I've always believed the that Jaylen has the high absolute ceiling for the simple reason thats he a freak NBA athlete, and the best players usually have soné skill or traía that is élite level. Durants length, Westbrook athleticism, Irving handles, ect. Tatum could get their with his shooting but right now his best skill is the ability to create a semi open long two. In either case both have along way to go skill wise, especially passing the ball. But Jaylen has shown some high level ability to get his shot (that se back 3!!) and done improved ball handling that make me think he could at least reach high level #2 option ability, and he may be ahead of Tatum in that area.
All in all I think its close. People like to point out Tatum is better his rookie year than Brown, but not all development is linear or as simple as that. In any case im glad we have both.
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Jaylen really stands out with his killer mentality.
And it seems like he’s willed himself to be a good player.
He’s a force.
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I was high on Brown the year before we drafted him. During the lotto, I was leaning more towards Ingram, he just looked better in college. But was super happy when they picked him over Dunn because of his potential. IT will be interesting next season to see how he does when he has to share the ball more. But thing is, even if we lose this round, Brown has shown he can step up and and play at a higher level. Which will be scary for other teams. Even scarier if Tatum has the leap that Brown had.
Remember when the crowd booed and people on here were wondering if DA had lost his mind when they drafted him?
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I'm not seeing top 10, all-NBA, MVP candidate player in either of them -- at least not the way I see it in Ben Simmons or Embiid. Granted, Embiid has a couple years on them, but neither JB or JT scream likely top 10 to me. They do look like future all-stars (top 25) with the dream scenario being that they'll progress to league-elite players. But right now they are two very promising players who are getting fantastic experience -- and hopefully will adjust seamlessly when they go from being the 1-2 options to the 3-4 options next year.
So Jaylen Brown, who is 21, has two 30 pt games in the first 4 games of the playoffs and plays all-NBA level defense, and you don't see top 10 potential in him?
I guess my point comes down to usesless semantics. I agree that there is potential in both Jaylen and Jayson to be top 10 players in the league. My point is that I don't expect it -- at least not in the way I expect(ed) it after watching the second year of Giannis, Towns, Embiid, Simmons, Davis, Porzingus.
JB has taken another leap so far in the playoffs, and took a big leap from Year 1 to Year 2, but he still seems to me to be one small rung below the elite young guys. But it certainly wouldn't shock me if JB or JT become all-NBA some day.
BTW -- I think Paul Pierce was a barely top 10 player (maybe 8 or 9) in his prime -- so I consider top 10 a very high bar.
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I'm not seeing top 10, all-NBA, MVP candidate player in either of them -- at least not the way I see it in Ben Simmons or Embiid. Granted, Embiid has a couple years on them, but neither JB or JT scream likely top 10 to me. They do look like future all-stars (top 25) with the dream scenario being that they'll progress to league-elite players. But right now they are two very promising players who are getting fantastic experience -- and hopefully will adjust seamlessly when they go from being the 1-2 options to the 3-4 options next year.
So Jaylen Brown, who is 21, has two 30 pt games in the first 4 games of the playoffs and plays all-NBA level defense, and you don't see top 10 potential in him?
I guess my point comes down to usesless semantics. I agree that there is potential in both Jaylen and Jayson to be top 10 players in the league. My point is that I don't expect it -- at least not in the way I expect(ed) it after watching the second year of Giannis, Towns, Embiid, Simmons, Davis, Porzingus.
JB has taken another leap so far in the playoffs, and took a big leap from Year 1 to Year 2, but he still seems to me to be one small rung below the elite young guys. But it certainly wouldn't shock me if JB or JT become all-NBA some day.
BTW -- I think Paul Pierce was a barely top 10 player (maybe 8 or 9) in his prime -- so I consider top 10 a very high bar.
Is Jaylen the best defender on your list? Davis is better and maybe Giannis is better and Simmons and Embiid about the same. Porzingis and Towns are terrible defenders.