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Celtics Basketball => Game Threads => Topic started by: FLCeltsFan on December 27, 2013, 12:40:16 PM

Title: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: FLCeltsFan on December 27, 2013, 12:40:16 PM
(http://images.footballfanatics.com/FFImage/thumb.aspx?i=/productImages/_1077000/ff_1077674_xl.jpg&w=180) at (http://images.footballfanatics.com/FFImage/thumb.aspx?i=/productImages/_1152000/ff_1152191_xl.jpg&w=180)
Cleveland Cavaliers (10-18) at Boston Celtics (12-17)
Saturday, December 28, 2013
1:00 PM ET
Regular Season Game #30, Home Game #16
TV: CSN-NE, FSOhio, NBA-LP 751(DTV)/751,752(xfinity)
Radio: WBZ, WTAM
TD Garden

(http://cdn3.sbnation.com/imported_assets/336623/2587354586_9eb59b3cd9.jpg)

(http://www.sportsecyclopedia.com/nba/boston/00-Celticslogos.gif)
Probable Starters
(http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/.e1d/img/4.0/global/basketball/nba/players/4758.jpg)(http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/.e1d/img/4.0/global/basketball/nba/players/4750.jpg)(http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/.e1d/img/4.0/global/basketball/nba/players/4247.jpg)(http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/.e1d/img/4.0/global/basketball/nba/players/3959.jpg)(http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/.e1d/img/4.0/global/basketball/nba/players/5055.jpg)
Jordan Crawford...Avery Bradley...Jeff Green...Brandon Bass...Jared Sullinger

Celtics Reserves
MarShon Brooks
Kris Humphries
Vitor Faverani
Courtney Lee
Phil Pressey
Gerald Wallace
Keith Bogans
Kelly Olynyk

Injuries
Rajon Rondo (ACL)out
Jared Sullinger (hand) probable
Avery Bradley (knee) probable
Gerald Wallace (knee)  probable

(http://stadiumjourney.com/images/stadiums/93_b9e666e080d2cfae576dcdc4de2c5deff9c570c0.jpg)

(http://www.sportsecyclopedia.com/nba/cleveland/00-Cavslogos.gif)
Probable Starters
(http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/.e1d/img/4.0/global/basketball/nba/players/4840.jpg)(http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/.e1d/img/4.0/global/basketball/nba/players/3960.jpg)(http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/.e1d/img/4.0/global/basketball/nba/players/4686.jpg)(http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/.e1d/img/4.0/global/basketball/nba/players/4884.jpg)(http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/.e1d/img/4.0/global/basketball/nba/players/3936.jpg)
Kyrie Irving...CJ Miles...Alonzo Gee...Tristan Thompson... Andrew Bynum

Cavaliers Reserves

Jarrett Jack
Anderson Varejao
Dion Waiters
Earl Clark
Sergey Karasev
Anthony Bennett
Carrick Felix
Tyler Zeller
Henry Sims
Matthew Dellavedova

Injuries
Carrick Felix (hernia)  out

Key Matchups
(http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/.e1d/img/4.0/global/basketball/nba/players/4758.jpg) vs (http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/.e1d/img/4.0/global/basketball/nba/players/4840.jpg)
Jordan Crawford vs Kyrie Irving
Irving has been a thorn in the Celtics side since he came into the league. He is averaging 22.1 points, 6.1 assists, 1.1 steals, and 3.0 rebounds. Expect to see Avery guarding Irving while Crawford picks up CJ Miles.  Jordan Crawford's triple double (11 points, 11 rebounds and 10 assists) was a big reason for the Celtics win in their first meeting.  The Celtics will need another strong performance from him in this game. 

(http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/.e1d/img/4.0/global/basketball/nba/players/5055.jpg) vs (http://i.cdn.turner.com/si/.e1d/img/4.0/global/basketball/nba/players/3936.jpg)
Jared Sullinger vs Andrew Bynum
Bynum missed all of last year with various and sundry injuries, including one that he suffered while bowling. He is averaging 8.4 points, 1.2 blocks,  and 5.3 rebounds this season and isn't the dominant player that he was before the injuries. He does have a height advantage on Sully that may give him an advantage.  Anderson Varejao is playing more minutes at center than Bynum even though he comes off the bench and may be an even tougher matchup for the Celtics at this position. 

Honorable Mention
Celtics Bench vs Cavaliers Bench
The Cavs have the highest scoring bench in the Eastern Conference at 40.0 points per game (4th-best in the NBA) and has outscored the opponent’s reserves in 21 of 27 contests. In the first meeting between these two teams, the Celtics bench was outscored 56-16.   The Celtics will need a strong game from their reserves if they want to get a win in this game.

Game Notes
After a 5 day break, the Celtics host the Cavaliers in the 2nd of 3 meetings this season.  The Celtics won the first meeting 103-86, which was also played in Boston.  The 3rd and final meeting between these two teams will be on April 12 in Cleveland. 

The Cavaliers would be out of the playoffs if they started today.  The Celtics have dropped to 8th place, half a game behind the Raptors, who have moved up to 4th by virtue of leading the Atlantic division. 

The Cavaliers are mostly healthy as are the Celtics.  There are a couple of concerns for the Celtics, though.  Jared Sullinger wore a glove in practice on Thursday and admitted to having a deep bone bruise in his hand that has been slow to heal.  Avery Bradley and Gerald Wallace bumped knees in practice and sat out the final portion.  All 3 are expected to play, however. 

 The Cavs last played on Thursday, losing a tough double overtime game to the Hawks by 2 points.  The Celtics last played almost a week ago on Sunday, losing in a blowout to the Indiana Pacers. 

Both teams have lost their last 3 games and will be looking to get off of the slide.  The Celtics are 5-5 in their last 10 games and are 7-8 at home.  The Cavs are 4-6 in their last 10 games and a woeful 2-12 at home. 

Keys to the game
Take Care of the Ball -  The Celtics have been getting off to a fast start and then seem to get careless and have a series of turnovers and allow the opponent to get back into the game.  They need to take care of the ball and try to limit those turnovers if they want to get a win.

Move the Ball and Run - The Celtics play best when they play uptempo and move the ball. They need to beat the defense down the court before it gets set up. When they slow the ball down and when they over dribble, they struggle to score.  They also need to trust each other and move the ball and not try to do too much individually. 

Start Strong and Finish Stronger - The Celtics have been coming out strong in the first quarters and establishing a lead.  However, they have also been slowing down, mostly in the 3rd quarter and then fall behind.  They also need to play hard until the final buzzer.

Go to the Hoop - The Celtics get very comfortable taking outside shots, especially when they are falling for them early and then stop trying to get to the basket.  They need to get inside and either draw the foul, get an easy score, or kick out to the open man.  Good things happen when they go to the hoop. 

Rebound - The Celtics need to rebound as a team.  It takes effort and desire to grab rebounds and the Celtics need to show more of both.   In their first meeting, the Celtics allowed the Cavs to grab 13 offensive rebounds which led to a 16-7 edge in second chance points for the Cavs.     

X-Factors
Rust vs Rest and Home Game

The Celtics have been off 5 days while there is just one day since the Cavs played a tough double OT game.  The Celtics were able to get plenty of rest and go home for Christmas and also have had 2 days of practice leading up to this game.  Will the rest have them energized and ready to play or will they come out rusty. 

The Cavs have been pretty bad on the road so far, winning just 2 games away from home, beating only Orlando and Washington.  Hopefully, the Celtics can continue that trend and keep them struggling on the road in this game in front of one of the best crowds in the league.   
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: LatterDayCelticsfan on December 28, 2013, 01:41:12 AM
Bold Predictions, Avery Bradley has his first 30 point game in the NBA, Green gets a double double (20 points, 13 rebounds) and a tech, and Jared Sullinger hits 5+ 3s
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: BASS_THUMPER on December 28, 2013, 01:51:56 AM
I'll  be home for this one

Bass will be Thumpin
 and I'll be

*sippin*
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: bello_man09 on December 28, 2013, 08:15:02 AM
I will check this one out...
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: hwangjini_1 on December 28, 2013, 08:56:27 AM
Prediction: the highest scoring team manges to win. :)

Gooooo celtics!
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: TwinTower14 on December 28, 2013, 09:18:49 AM
C's smash them today, win by double figures and Sully goes for 23/15....
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SHAQATTACK on December 28, 2013, 10:18:00 AM
Cavs have how many top draft choices the past four years and they still can not play .500 ball.

One would think Celtics should win this,  but I really don't feel all that confident about it.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Neurotic Guy on December 28, 2013, 10:59:10 AM
Cavs unfortunately unable to beat the hawks the other night. That was disappointing. C's should take this one. Hope KO can play productively today.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: letsgoblue86 on December 28, 2013, 11:55:06 AM
Cavs have how many top draft choices the past four years and they still can not play .500 ball.

One would think Celtics should win this,  but I really don't feel all that confident about it.
Imagine that team if they had picked Barnes or Drummond instead of Waiters. 
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: makaveli on December 28, 2013, 12:35:21 PM
i guess bynum is out, that will help our odds. I think Irving will have his usual vs celtics performance.
Celtics by 7
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SHAQATTACK on December 28, 2013, 01:23:23 PM
i guess bynum is out, that will help our odds. I think Irving will have his usual vs celtics performance.
Celtics by 7

What did Bynum  do to get kicked off the team ???
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: timobusa on December 28, 2013, 01:28:15 PM
i guess bynum is out, that will help our odds. I think Irving will have his usual vs celtics performance.
Celtics by 7

What did Bynum  do to get kicked off the team ???

He was being himself. Hahaha
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: aporel#18 on December 28, 2013, 01:36:32 PM
i guess bynum is out, that will help our odds. I think Irving will have his usual vs celtics performance.
Celtics by 7

What did Bynum  do to get kicked off the team ???

He was being himself. Hahaha

Yeah... he has the tools to be a top 5 center, but he's got other things in mind, it seems. Never liked the guy, sucks for the Cavs, but they shoul've expected something like this.

I like how the team has started the game. Good effort.

Go Celtics!
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: LatterDayCelticsfan on December 28, 2013, 01:36:52 PM
TP!
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SHAQATTACK on December 28, 2013, 01:41:14 PM
I swear.......Sully has put the 10 pounds back on this holiday week.......gee...whiz
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: lon3lytoaster on December 28, 2013, 01:45:07 PM
How is Cleveland so terrible?
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: timobusa on December 28, 2013, 01:45:15 PM
I swear.......Sully has put the 10 pounds back on this holiday week.......gee...whiz

All in his back side. haha Pause.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: hpantazo on December 28, 2013, 01:50:01 PM
wow Bennett looks worse than Royce White out there
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: LatterDayCelticsfan on December 28, 2013, 01:50:12 PM
Cost of playing center?
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SHAQATTACK on December 28, 2013, 01:52:43 PM
We  got a ways to go to catch Indy
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SHAQATTACK on December 28, 2013, 01:53:41 PM
Why could n't lee shoot like this when KgWas here ???
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: BASS_THUMPER on December 28, 2013, 01:56:39 PM
looking good
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: nickagneta on December 28, 2013, 01:58:22 PM
When the C's are at home, they can simply shoot lights out in the first half of games.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: MVPPierceNoJoke on December 28, 2013, 02:01:31 PM
7 bounces on that Green and 1. That was pretty dang cool
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: timobusa on December 28, 2013, 02:04:22 PM
7 bounces on that Green and 1. That was pretty dang cool

That was red!
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SHAQATTACK on December 28, 2013, 02:05:04 PM
Wonder if Stevens can coach them though a second half letdown    ???
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: LatterDayCelticsfan on December 28, 2013, 02:07:21 PM
Stevens ain't responsible for fixing the Cavs problems :P
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SHAQATTACK on December 28, 2013, 02:09:04 PM
Hopefully Rondo practice with team a lot will......teach em  how to play together better
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SHAQATTACK on December 28, 2013, 02:10:09 PM
Stevens ain't responsible for Cavs problems :P

Browns got dat
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: LatterDayCelticsfan on December 28, 2013, 02:17:02 PM
" 0:20:Earl Clark pase errático (Jeff Green roba el balón) " Confused by ESPN's random language shifts.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Rondohara on December 28, 2013, 02:21:09 PM
Let's not blow this lead, alright fellas? :)
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: lon3lytoaster on December 28, 2013, 02:22:20 PM
Cleveland really wants another opportunity to waste a draft pick..
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: aporel#18 on December 28, 2013, 02:22:38 PM
Adams is working wonders on our player's shooting!

Bass for 3!!!

Go Celtics!
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SCeltic34 on December 28, 2013, 02:22:47 PM
Bass for 3?
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: timobusa on December 28, 2013, 02:23:24 PM
Lol Bass for 3? Is this a fake video?
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: vinnie on December 28, 2013, 02:24:29 PM
Hats off to anyone who watches this game to the end. My God, the Cavs are atrocious. I'm switching to Villanova Syracuse, then heading out to Amherst for UMass vs. Providence.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: timobusa on December 28, 2013, 02:28:02 PM
Where the heck is VEEETOORR?
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: aporel#18 on December 28, 2013, 02:30:08 PM
Hats off to anyone who watches this game to the end. My God, the Cavs are atrocious. I'm switching to Villanova Syracuse, then heading out to Amherst for UMass vs. Providence.

 ::)

Really? Cavs are terrible since the LeBroid days.

But the Celtics are an entertaining team, they try to play the right way, they fight and they share the ball.

Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: vinnie on December 28, 2013, 02:34:26 PM
Hats off to anyone who watches this game to the end. My God, the Cavs are atrocious. I'm switching to Villanova Syracuse, then heading out to Amherst for UMass vs. Providence.

 ::)

Really? Cavs are terrible since the LeBroid days.

But the Celtics are an entertaining team, they try to play the right way, they fight and they share the ball.

Extremely entertaining.  But the league is a joke this year.  College basketball far more entertaining,  I don't get pumped up to watch a 12-17 team versus a 10-18 team. Sorry.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Rondohara on December 28, 2013, 02:38:28 PM
Hats off to anyone who watches this game to the end. My God, the Cavs are atrocious.

Have to watch until the end to see how many phantom calls will be called against the Celtics.

Good news fellas: Bennett is in.  ;D
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: aporel#18 on December 28, 2013, 02:39:41 PM
Hats off to anyone who watches this game to the end. My God, the Cavs are atrocious. I'm switching to Villanova Syracuse, then heading out to Amherst for UMass vs. Providence.

 ::)

Really? Cavs are terrible since the LeBroid days.

But the Celtics are an entertaining team, they try to play the right way, they fight and they share the ball.

Extremely entertaining.  But the league is a joke this year.  College basketball far more entertaining,  I don't get pumped up to watch a 12-17 team versus a 10-18 team. Sorry.

To each his own, then. Enjoy both games.

I'd like to see Vitor out there for some minutes, and Gino too.

Go Celtics!
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 02:40:33 PM
Terrible shot, Jordan . . . I mean great shot!!!
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SCeltic34 on December 28, 2013, 02:40:49 PM
Tommy hit the nail on the head regarding Jason Kidd's coaching job with the Nets so far.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 02:41:34 PM
Avery's got to finish on that alley oop.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 02:43:42 PM
Hump is money on that mid range jumper.  It's ugly, but it's been very efficient.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: BleedGreen1989 on December 28, 2013, 02:44:31 PM
Kris Humphries on the fast break!

Never mind. Just kidding.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: LarBrd33 on December 28, 2013, 02:51:32 PM
I am shocked by how bad Cleveland's offense is.  Do they even have a coach?  It's a wonder they have won any games this year.  There seems to be no thought at all to what they are doing.  It's just 1 vs 5 on every play.  Insane.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 02:51:54 PM
Ugh.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 02:53:34 PM
Nice move, Klynyk. 
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: MVPPierceNoJoke on December 28, 2013, 02:54:24 PM
Is it just me, but does KO look like a complete bust?
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: letsgoblue86 on December 28, 2013, 02:54:44 PM
Get KO out of the game Stevens.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SCeltic34 on December 28, 2013, 02:56:02 PM
Is it just me, but does KO look like a complete bust?

We're 30 games into his rookie season and he's missed significant time with an injury.  Let's not overreact.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: hwangjini_1 on December 28, 2013, 02:56:47 PM
Is it just me, but does KO look like a complete bust?

No, no... You have confused olly with Bradley, who was deemed a total pile of poop during his rookie year.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SHAQATTACK on December 28, 2013, 02:57:05 PM
Celtics trying to lose this game....playing awful.......horrible
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: satch on December 28, 2013, 02:59:32 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Chief on December 28, 2013, 03:00:05 PM
Did Crash get hurt?
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: timobusa on December 28, 2013, 03:00:27 PM
AB vs Kyrie
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: timobusa on December 28, 2013, 03:01:05 PM
Did Crash get hurt?

I saw him hit his head on the 2nd quarter trying to take a charge..
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: letsgoblue86 on December 28, 2013, 03:01:07 PM
Refs have sucked all day
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SCeltic34 on December 28, 2013, 03:02:14 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: LarBrd33 on December 28, 2013, 03:02:31 PM
I am shocked by how bad Cleveland's offense is.  Do they even have a coach?  It's a wonder they have won any games this year.  There seems to be no thought at all to what they are doing.  It's just 1 vs 5 on every play.  Insane.
I see how they randomly win games... Sometimes while playing 1 vs 5, the 1 guy goes off.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: letsgoblue86 on December 28, 2013, 03:03:09 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.
Bradley could always play defense.  So far Olynyk hasn't showed that he can excel at something.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: satch on December 28, 2013, 03:03:41 PM
Get 19 point lead and start experimenting with line ups instead of putting game away.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Chief on December 28, 2013, 03:03:49 PM
Rondo, Bradley, Green, and Sully will be fun to watch for many years to come.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:04:23 PM
That was a sick move by Kyrie.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SHAQATTACK on December 28, 2013, 03:04:33 PM
Wow.....celtics had this game in the bag......clutching a defeat from jaws of victory
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: hpantazo on December 28, 2013, 03:05:21 PM
Get 19 point lead and start experimenting with line ups instead of putting game away.

this season is about development...
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Shamrocker on December 28, 2013, 03:05:28 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:05:40 PM
Beautiful pass by Craw!!  Come on, Cs!
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:06:34 PM
Nice, Jeff.  That should have been an and one.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SCeltic34 on December 28, 2013, 03:07:41 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry

That's true, but it doesn't support it either.  It's amazing how quickly people mistakenly judge players prematurely time and time again.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SHAQATTACK on December 28, 2013, 03:07:59 PM
Kelly can play.....he is really down on confidence ......he is a rookie

He ll eventually find his way
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:08:25 PM
Are you kidding me, Jordan?  Are you kidding me?!!
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Chief on December 28, 2013, 03:08:41 PM
Crawford being Crawford.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: timobusa on December 28, 2013, 03:09:41 PM
Jarret Jack has always been clutch
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: letsgoblue86 on December 28, 2013, 03:10:09 PM
Are you kidding me, Jordan?  Are you kidding me?!!
I look forward to him being on the bench during crunch time upon Rondo's return.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: satch on December 28, 2013, 03:10:32 PM
Get 19 point lead and start experimenting with line ups instead of putting game away.

this season is about development...
Lose games you should win and the only thing you develop is losing.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: hwangjini_1 on December 28, 2013, 03:10:38 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry

I believe the point is NOT that olly won't be a bust. But rather that it is way to soon to pass judgements such as he will be a bust. Yes, the point is nuanced, but worth understanding.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: umpacu on December 28, 2013, 03:11:05 PM
Oh Crawford... So talented and so dumb...
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:11:15 PM
Are you kidding me, Jordan?  Are you kidding me?!!
I look forward to him being on the bench during crunch time upon Rondo's return.

I guess you've got to take the good with the bad.  I'll say the good has outweighed the bad this season, but, my goodness, that was an awful play at a crucial moment. 
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:11:54 PM
Gotta score here, guys.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Chief on December 28, 2013, 03:12:26 PM
Bass hands. :'(
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SCeltic34 on December 28, 2013, 03:12:38 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry

I believe the point is NOT that olly won't be a bust. But rather that it is way to soon to pass judgements such as he will be a bust. Yes, the point is nuanced, but worth understanding.

Exactly.

Remember, KO was looked at as a solid pick by other GMs and even other players from his draft class.

If he doesn't pan out, then he doesn't pan out.  But have some patience.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: timobusa on December 28, 2013, 03:12:54 PM
sweet move by crawford nice shot
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:13:02 PM
They blew the whistle too early on that double dribble. 

Nice shot, Jordan.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:13:52 PM
What the heck was that.  That's not a goal tend.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: letsgoblue86 on December 28, 2013, 03:14:40 PM
If they're gonna enforce this new delay of game rule, start enforcing it besides instances of made baskets.

There have been two times where the Cavs have committed a foul or turnover and Irving grabs the ball and delays the game by shooting it.

Enforce it!
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Shamrocker on December 28, 2013, 03:14:49 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry

I believe the point is NOT that olly won't be a bust. But rather that it is way to soon to pass judgements such as he will be a bust. Yes, the point is nuanced, but worth understanding.

Exactly.

Remember, KO was looked at as a solid pick by other GMs and even other players from his draft class.

If he doesn't pan out, then he doesn't pan out.  But have some patience.

I think the sample size is sufficient, sorry. He'll be playing in Europe in two years.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:15:51 PM
What are they going to do here?  If they take the basket away, is it a jump ball?
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Chief on December 28, 2013, 03:16:29 PM
Tommy!
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:17:08 PM
I love Brandon Bass!!!
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Chief on December 28, 2013, 03:18:31 PM
If Bass gave that much effort, on the boards every night, he would be an all-star.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:18:57 PM
My goodness, this team plays scared late in games. 
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: satch on December 28, 2013, 03:19:12 PM
This game should not have come down to this.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: LarBrd33 on December 28, 2013, 03:19:33 PM
The goaltending call was 100% a makeup call for the bogus traveling call right before it.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Rondohara on December 28, 2013, 03:19:33 PM
C'mon refs... What a terrible call!!

What's this Bradley, almost put the ball in on our own basket  :P Well, no worries, the refs will give them the basket anyway.

Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Chief on December 28, 2013, 03:19:49 PM
Go to Sully.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Shamrocker on December 28, 2013, 03:20:17 PM
Sully, yikes.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Chief on December 28, 2013, 03:20:25 PM
Go to Sully.

In the post. ::)
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:20:37 PM
Wow, just wow!!  I can't believe this game has come down to this. 
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SCeltic34 on December 28, 2013, 03:20:42 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry

I believe the point is NOT that olly won't be a bust. But rather that it is way to soon to pass judgements such as he will be a bust. Yes, the point is nuanced, but worth understanding.

Exactly.

Remember, KO was looked at as a solid pick by other GMs and even other players from his draft class.

If he doesn't pan out, then he doesn't pan out.  But have some patience.

I think the sample size is sufficient, sorry. He'll be playing in Europe in two years.

30 games into a rookie season, 19 of which he's played in, is a sufficient sample size?  In the NBA?  Can't say I agree but to each their own.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: hpantazo on December 28, 2013, 03:20:47 PM
Sullinger has gone ice cold. I wonder if his left hand is really bothering him today
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: The Rondo Show on December 28, 2013, 03:21:08 PM
We are terrible at the end of games.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: YoungOne87 on December 28, 2013, 03:21:48 PM
2 airballs in a row...
I rather have crawford take those bailout shots..
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: letsgoblue86 on December 28, 2013, 03:21:53 PM
We are terrible at the end of games.
That's cause we don't run any offense.  Just stand around and jack up threes.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:21:56 PM
Oh man, Kyrie Irving is going to get an opportunity to be a hero here. 
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SHAQATTACK on December 28, 2013, 03:22:02 PM
I think they have folded
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: esel1000 on December 28, 2013, 03:22:07 PM
No lead is too great... what a bunch of bone headed plays
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Shamrocker on December 28, 2013, 03:22:50 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry

I believe the point is NOT that olly won't be a bust. But rather that it is way to soon to pass judgements such as he will be a bust. Yes, the point is nuanced, but worth understanding.

Exactly.

Remember, KO was looked at as a solid pick by other GMs and even other players from his draft class.

If he doesn't pan out, then he doesn't pan out.  But have some patience.

I think the sample size is sufficient, sorry. He'll be playing in Europe in two years.

30 games into a rookie season, 19 of which he's played in, is a sufficient sample size?  In the NBA?  Can't say I agree but to each their own.

After Fab's first 30 games I think we all realized he couldn't play. Same with JJJ. Yeah, 30 games is enough to form a reasoned opinion. KO has given us no reason for optimism.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: satch on December 28, 2013, 03:23:08 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.
D league

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry

I believe the point is NOT that olly won't be a bust. But rather that it is way to soon to pass judgements such as he will be a bust. Yes, the point is nuanced, but worth understanding.

Exactly.

Remember, KO was looked at as a solid pick by other GMs and even other players from his draft class.

If he doesn't pan out, then he doesn't pan out.  But have some patience.

I think the sample size is sufficient, sorry. He'll be playing in Europe in two years.

30 games into a rookie season, 19 of which he's played in, is a sufficient sample size?  In the NBA?  Can't say I agree but to each their own.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: letsgoblue86 on December 28, 2013, 03:23:08 PM
Bradley should have passed it there.  I don't think he hits both.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:23:19 PM
Another big play by Brandon!  I can't believe the Cavs didn't foul earlier.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: celtic -_- pride on December 28, 2013, 03:23:41 PM
brandon bass is the man
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: letsgoblue86 on December 28, 2013, 03:24:02 PM
We better foul right away.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: abbmack9 on December 28, 2013, 03:24:12 PM
What a block by Bass! Great timing on that one
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Chief on December 28, 2013, 03:24:37 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry

I believe the point is NOT that olly won't be a bust. But rather that it is way to soon to pass judgements such as he will be a bust. Yes, the point is nuanced, but worth understanding.

Exactly.

Remember, KO was looked at as a solid pick by other GMs and even other players from his draft class.

If he doesn't pan out, then he doesn't pan out.  But have some patience.

I think the sample size is sufficient, sorry. He'll be playing in Europe in two years.

30 games into a rookie season, 19 of which he's played in, is a sufficient sample size?  In the NBA?  Can't say I agree but to each their own.

After Fab's first 30 games I think we all realized he couldn't play. Same with JJJ. Yeah, 30 games is enough to form a reasoned opinion. KO has given us no reason for optimism.

It took about 3 minutes watching Fab.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: timobusa on December 28, 2013, 03:24:40 PM
The refs are dumb. lol
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:24:45 PM
Keep the ball out of Kyrie's hands. 

Tommy and Mike are talking about giving the foul here.  That might not be a bad move.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: YoungOne87 on December 28, 2013, 03:25:00 PM
we still try to blow this game.. smh
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: LarBrd33 on December 28, 2013, 03:25:37 PM
wow.. Cleveland's coach is a joke.  I can't believe some of the decisions they have made this game... and their offense is complete garbage.  They play hero ball the entire game. 

Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: letsgoblue86 on December 28, 2013, 03:25:41 PM
Celtics tried as hard as they could to give this one away.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:25:42 PM
Whew!!  I'll take it.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Shamrocker on December 28, 2013, 03:25:48 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry

I believe the point is NOT that olly won't be a bust. But rather that it is way to soon to pass judgements such as he will be a bust. Yes, the point is nuanced, but worth understanding.

Exactly.

Remember, KO was looked at as a solid pick by other GMs and even other players from his draft class.

If he doesn't pan out, then he doesn't pan out.  But have some patience.

I think the sample size is sufficient, sorry. He'll be playing in Europe in two years.

30 games into a rookie season, 19 of which he's played in, is a sufficient sample size?  In the NBA?  Can't say I agree but to each their own.

After Fab's first 30 games I think we all realized he couldn't play. Same with JJJ. Yeah, 30 games is enough to form a reasoned opinion. KO has given us no reason for optimism.

It took about 3 minutes watching Fab.

Fair point.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SHAQATTACK on December 28, 2013, 03:27:10 PM
Too many bone head plays......Bass zero , then hero.....

Bradley had Hump standing alone under the bucket.....geesse........
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: celtic -_- pride on December 28, 2013, 03:27:36 PM
wow.. Cleveland's coach is a joke.  I can't believe some of the decisions they have made this game... and their offense is complete garbage.  They play hero ball the entire game.
Mike Brown is a joke. lebron is the only reason those cavs teams did anything.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: satch on December 28, 2013, 03:28:16 PM
The d league is there for a reason.....KO
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: satch on December 28, 2013, 03:29:28 PM
Too many bone head plays......Bass zero , then hero.....

Bradley had Hump standing alone under the bucket.....geesse........
I think Hump starts before the season is over with...
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: celtic -_- pride on December 28, 2013, 03:29:55 PM
im still confused why the cavs took bennett ???
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:29:57 PM
I thought Klynyk looked pretty good in his stint in the first half, not so much the second.  He'll be o.k.  He's only played twenty NBA games so far. 
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: satch on December 28, 2013, 03:30:59 PM
I thought Klynyk looked pretty good in his stint in the first half, not so much the second.  He'll be o.k.  He's only played twenty NBA games so far.
are you serious??
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:31:53 PM
I thought Klynyk looked pretty good in his stint in the first half, not so much the second.  He'll be o.k.  He's only played twenty NBA games so far.
are you serious??

Yes.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Shamrocker on December 28, 2013, 03:33:08 PM
While I miss Greg Dickerson like an old friend, A. Chen is growing on me. She's getting better.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: aporel#18 on December 28, 2013, 03:34:11 PM
I thought Klynyk looked pretty good in his stint in the first half, not so much the second.  He'll be o.k.  He's only played twenty NBA games so far.
are you serious??

He probably is, I can't detect the sarcasm here.

And he's spot on, too. It will take some time to Kelly before he gets it in the NBA. But he'll be a nice player.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SCeltic34 on December 28, 2013, 03:34:57 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry

I believe the point is NOT that olly won't be a bust. But rather that it is way to soon to pass judgements such as he will be a bust. Yes, the point is nuanced, but worth understanding.

Exactly.

Remember, KO was looked at as a solid pick by other GMs and even other players from his draft class.

If he doesn't pan out, then he doesn't pan out.  But have some patience.

I think the sample size is sufficient, sorry. He'll be playing in Europe in two years.

30 games into a rookie season, 19 of which he's played in, is a sufficient sample size?  In the NBA?  Can't say I agree but to each their own.

After Fab's first 30 games I think we all realized he couldn't play. Same with JJJ. Yeah, 30 games is enough to form a reasoned opinion. KO has given us no reason for optimism.

Imagine if coaches and GMs used a rookie's first 20 games as an overall player evaluation. 

It takes years - and an opportunity, a chance to play - to learn the NBA game and develop as a player.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: satch on December 28, 2013, 03:35:10 PM
My guess is we will start to see less and less of KO.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: KGs Knee on December 28, 2013, 03:39:58 PM
I thought Klynyk looked pretty good in his stint in the first half, not so much the second.  He'll be o.k.  He's only played twenty NBA games so far.
are you serious??

He probably is, I can't detect the sarcasm here.

And he's spot on, too. It will take some time to Kelly before he gets it in the NBA. But he'll be a nice player.

Meh, I doubt Oly will amount to much more than an end-of-bench player.

Then again, I felt this way about Giddens, Walker, Pruitt, Bradley, Johnson etc..  Only Bradley actually proved me wrong, and he was much younger as a rookie than Oly.

Also, that 'Klynyk' nickname is horrendous, sounds stupid.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Shamrocker on December 28, 2013, 03:42:08 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry

I believe the point is NOT that olly won't be a bust. But rather that it is way to soon to pass judgements such as he will be a bust. Yes, the point is nuanced, but worth understanding.

Exactly.

Remember, KO was looked at as a solid pick by other GMs and even other players from his draft class.

If he doesn't pan out, then he doesn't pan out.  But have some patience.

I think the sample size is sufficient, sorry. He'll be playing in Europe in two years.

30 games into a rookie season, 19 of which he's played in, is a sufficient sample size?  In the NBA?  Can't say I agree but to each their own.

After Fab's first 30 games I think we all realized he couldn't play. Same with JJJ. Yeah, 30 games is enough to form a reasoned opinion. KO has given us no reason for optimism.

Imagine if coaches and GMs used a rookie's first 20 games as an overall player evaluation. 

It takes years - and an opportunity, a chance to play - to learn the NBA game and develop as a player.

What league are you watching? Players drafted outside the lottery don't get years to develop in the NBA. Fab got one. JJJ got one year. JR Giddens got about one as well.

Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: celtic -_- pride on December 28, 2013, 03:43:02 PM
While I miss Greg Dickerson like an old friend, A. Chen is growing on me. She's getting better.
i don't miss dickersons psycho stare into the camera. it kinda freaked me out
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Rondohara on December 28, 2013, 03:44:58 PM
Bass saved this team of being called chokers this time.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Shamrocker on December 28, 2013, 03:45:13 PM
While I miss Greg Dickerson like an old friend, A. Chen is growing on me. She's getting better.
i don't miss dickersons psycho stare into the camera. it kinda freaked me out

I don't miss Gary Tangway.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Neurotic Guy on December 28, 2013, 03:46:57 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry

I believe the point is NOT that olly won't be a bust. But rather that it is way to soon to pass judgements such as he will be a bust. Yes, the point is nuanced, but worth understanding.

Exactly.

Remember, KO was looked at as a solid pick by other GMs and even other players from his draft class.

If he doesn't pan out, then he doesn't pan out.  But have some patience.

I think the sample size is sufficient, sorry. He'll be playing in Europe in two years.

Well, I am not sure how many 22 yo rookies who play 20 mpg and produce about 7 and 5 are correctly projected after 20 games as NBA busts -- not just a bust relative to expectatons, but a total bust as you are projecting.   

His shooting % has been atrocious but that's something that should improve.  Confidence and comfort will help -- if these factors do not occur, he'll be in Turkey in two years, but if these do happen, he'll be an NBA player for a long time. 
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: satch on December 28, 2013, 03:47:15 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.
I think he is getting playing time that he has not earned.
Just like Bradley couldn't play.

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry

I believe the point is NOT that olly won't be a bust. But rather that it is way to soon to pass judgements such as he will be a bust. Yes, the point is nuanced, but worth understanding.

Exactly.

Remember, KO was looked at as a solid pick by other GMs and even other players from his draft class.

If he doesn't pan out, then he doesn't pan out.  But have some patience.

I think the sample size is sufficient, sorry. He'll be playing in Europe in two years.

30 games into a rookie season, 19 of which he's played in, is a sufficient sample size?  In the NBA?  Can't say I agree but to each their own.

After Fab's first 30 games I think we all realized he couldn't play. Same with JJJ. Yeah, 30 games is enough to form a reasoned opinion. KO has given us no reason for optimism.

Imagine if coaches and GMs used a rookie's first 20 games as an overall player evaluation. 

It takes years - and an opportunity, a chance to play - to learn the NBA game and develop as a player.

What league are you watching? Players drafted outside the lottery don't get years to develop in the NBA. Fab got one. JJJ got one year. JR Giddens got about one as well.


C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry

I believe the point is NOT that olly won't be a bust. But rather that it is way to soon to pass judgements such as he will be a bust. Yes, the point is nuanced, but worth understanding.

Exactly.

Remember, KO was looked at as a solid pick by other GMs and even other players from his draft class.

If he doesn't pan out, then he doesn't pan out.  But have some patience.

I think the sample size is sufficient, sorry. He'll be playing in Europe in two years.

30 games into a rookie season, 19 of which he's played in, is a sufficient sample size?  In the NBA?  Can't say I agree but to each their own.

After Fab's first 30 games I think we all realized he couldn't play. Same with JJJ. Yeah, 30 games is enough to form a reasoned opinion. KO has given us no reason for optimism.

Imagine if coaches and GMs used a rookie's first 20 games as an overall player evaluation. 

It takes years - and an opportunity, a chance to play - to learn the NBA game and develop as a player.

What league are you watching? Players drafted outside the lottery don't get years to develop in the NBA. Fab got one. JJJ got one year. JR Giddens got about one as well.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SCeltic34 on December 28, 2013, 03:47:25 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry

I believe the point is NOT that olly won't be a bust. But rather that it is way to soon to pass judgements such as he will be a bust. Yes, the point is nuanced, but worth understanding.

Exactly.

Remember, KO was looked at as a solid pick by other GMs and even other players from his draft class.

If he doesn't pan out, then he doesn't pan out.  But have some patience.

I think the sample size is sufficient, sorry. He'll be playing in Europe in two years.

30 games into a rookie season, 19 of which he's played in, is a sufficient sample size?  In the NBA?  Can't say I agree but to each their own.

After Fab's first 30 games I think we all realized he couldn't play. Same with JJJ. Yeah, 30 games is enough to form a reasoned opinion. KO has given us no reason for optimism.

Imagine if coaches and GMs used a rookie's first 20 games as an overall player evaluation. 

It takes years - and an opportunity, a chance to play - to learn the NBA game and develop as a player.

What league are you watching? Players drafted outside the lottery don't get years to develop in the NBA. Fab got one. JJJ got one year. JR Giddens got about one as well.

You're kidding me right?   

Rondo?  Bradley?  Sully?  And that's just our team.

Even 2nd rounders get time to develop if they're worthwhile.  Go ask Mark Gasol and Manu Ginobili.

The list would be endless.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 03:47:26 PM
While I miss Greg Dickerson like an old friend, A. Chen is growing on me. She's getting better.
i don't miss dickersons psycho stare into the camera. it kinda freaked me out

I don't miss Gary Tangway.

Abby is a much better friend to me than Dickerson ever was.  She's smart, charismatic, she's got good chemistry with Mike and Tommy, and I don't hate looking at her. 
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: satch on December 28, 2013, 03:49:10 PM
KO is getting playing time he has not earned.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Shamrocker on December 28, 2013, 03:54:12 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry

I believe the point is NOT that olly won't be a bust. But rather that it is way to soon to pass judgements such as he will be a bust. Yes, the point is nuanced, but worth understanding.

Exactly.

Remember, KO was looked at as a solid pick by other GMs and even other players from his draft class.

If he doesn't pan out, then he doesn't pan out.  But have some patience.

I think the sample size is sufficient, sorry. He'll be playing in Europe in two years.

30 games into a rookie season, 19 of which he's played in, is a sufficient sample size?  In the NBA?  Can't say I agree but to each their own.

After Fab's first 30 games I think we all realized he couldn't play. Same with JJJ. Yeah, 30 games is enough to form a reasoned opinion. KO has given us no reason for optimism.

Imagine if coaches and GMs used a rookie's first 20 games as an overall player evaluation. 

It takes years - and an opportunity, a chance to play - to learn the NBA game and develop as a player.

What league are you watching? Players drafted outside the lottery don't get years to develop in the NBA. Fab got one. JJJ got one year. JR Giddens got about one as well.

You're kidding me right?   

Rondo?  Bradley?  Sully?  And that's just our team.

Even 2nd rounders get time to develop if they're worthwhile.  Go ask Mark Gasol and Manu Ginobili.

The list would be endless.

It seems like you missed the point; I'll try again. Rondo and Sully showed promise in year one. It was clear they belonged in the NBA. JJJ, Fab and Giddens didn't. Rondo and Sully got more opportunities in year two. JJJ, Fab and Giddens didn't.

 

Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Neurotic Guy on December 28, 2013, 03:54:37 PM
I thought Klynyk looked pretty good in his stint in the first half, not so much the second.  He'll be o.k.  He's only played twenty NBA games so far.
are you serious??

He probably is, I can't detect the sarcasm here.

And he's spot on, too. It will take some time to Kelly before he gets it in the NBA. But he'll be a nice player.

Meh, I doubt Oly will amount to much more than an end-of-bench player.

Then again, I felt this way about Giddens, Walker, Pruitt, Bradley, Johnson etc..  Only Bradley actually proved me wrong, and he was much younger as a rookie than Oly.

Also, that 'Klynyk' nickname is horrendous, sounds stupid.

I don't recall Giddens, Walker, Pruitt or JJJ averaging 7 and 5 in 20 MPG. Not great, but for a guy adjusting to the NBA, not terrible.  Did JJJ, Pruitt or JR ever look like they belonged?  I guess you could argue that KO hasn't looked like he belongs, but I wouldn't count the games post-injury too highly -- he's not 100% physically and whatever lack of confidence was influencing him before the injury is surely added to in the immediate injury aftermath.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SCeltic34 on December 28, 2013, 03:59:18 PM
C's have not been the same since KO return from ankle injury. No chemistry and he ....can't play.

Just like Bradley couldn't play.

Yup! Just like JJJ and JR Giddens and Billy Walker couldn't play...ohh wait those examples don't help the KO won't be a bust argument. Sorry

I believe the point is NOT that olly won't be a bust. But rather that it is way to soon to pass judgements such as he will be a bust. Yes, the point is nuanced, but worth understanding.

Exactly.

Remember, KO was looked at as a solid pick by other GMs and even other players from his draft class.

If he doesn't pan out, then he doesn't pan out.  But have some patience.

I think the sample size is sufficient, sorry. He'll be playing in Europe in two years.

30 games into a rookie season, 19 of which he's played in, is a sufficient sample size?  In the NBA?  Can't say I agree but to each their own.

After Fab's first 30 games I think we all realized he couldn't play. Same with JJJ. Yeah, 30 games is enough to form a reasoned opinion. KO has given us no reason for optimism.

Imagine if coaches and GMs used a rookie's first 20 games as an overall player evaluation. 

It takes years - and an opportunity, a chance to play - to learn the NBA game and develop as a player.

What league are you watching? Players drafted outside the lottery don't get years to develop in the NBA. Fab got one. JJJ got one year. JR Giddens got about one as well.

You're kidding me right?   

Rondo?  Bradley?  Sully?  And that's just our team.

Even 2nd rounders get time to develop if they're worthwhile.  Go ask Mark Gasol and Manu Ginobili.

The list would be endless.

It seems like you missed the point; I'll try again. Rondo and Sully showed promise in year one. It was clear they belonged in the NBA. JJJ, Fab and Giddens didn't. Rondo and Sully got more opportunities in year two. JJJ, Fab and Giddens didn't.

What was I supposed to infer from your statement: "Players drafted outside the lottery don't get years to develop in the NBA"?

But that's really besides the entire premise of the argument - that it takes time to develop as a player.  But I won't belabor it any further because it's obvious I can't convince you.

Stick to your 30 game evaluation criteria.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: nickagneta on December 28, 2013, 04:32:16 PM
When youhave to take 7+ shots a game to score 6+ points a game, I don't care if you are averaging 6+ PPG, that's not a good thing. Its a very very bad thing.

One of the best things I saw in this thread was someone saying Olynyk is playing minutes he hasn't earned. Nothing could be more true. Faverani deserves minutes over Olynyk right now.

Oh, and BTW, there is zero guarantee Olynyk's shots start dropping. His FG% was good at Gonzaga because he played against inferior competition and was 7 feet tall but his three point shooting was never anything to write home about.

He's missing longer three in the NBA at an alarming rate and his inside moves that worked so well against mid major big men isn't working and probably never will work versus NBA big men.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Celtics18 on December 28, 2013, 05:20:38 PM
I'm seeing a rookie tentativeness from Klynyk right now that I think he can start to correct as he gets more confidence.  Maybe it's just wishful thinking, but when I watch him, he looks close to pulling it together. 

We'll see.  He's not athletic, but he does have very nifty moves for a seven footer.  The hope is getting dimmer and dimmer, but it's still not completely extinguished for me . . . not after the kid's only played in 20 NBA games. 
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: hpantazo on December 28, 2013, 05:58:02 PM
When youhave to take 7+ shots a game to score 6+ points a game, I don't care if you are averaging 6+ PPG, that's not a good thing. Its a very very bad thing.

One of the best things I saw in this thread was someone saying Olynyk is playing minutes he hasn't earned. Nothing could be more true. Faverani deserves minutes over Olynyk right now.

Oh, and BTW, there is zero guarantee Olynyk's shots start dropping. His FG% was good at Gonzaga because he played against inferior competition and was 7 feet tall but his three point shooting was never anything to write home about.

He's missing longer three in the NBA at an alarming rate and his inside moves that worked so well against mid major big men isn't working and probably never will work versus NBA big men.

then why were all these moves and shots working for him in the NBA at the start of the season? I think he just needs to readjust after his ankle injury
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: nickagneta on December 28, 2013, 06:26:59 PM
When youhave to take 7+ shots a game to score 6+ points a game, I don't care if you are averaging 6+ PPG, that's not a good thing. Its a very very bad thing.

One of the best things I saw in this thread was someone saying Olynyk is playing minutes he hasn't earned. Nothing could be more true. Faverani deserves minutes over Olynyk right now.

Oh, and BTW, there is zero guarantee Olynyk's shots start dropping. His FG% was good at Gonzaga because he played against inferior competition and was 7 feet tall but his three point shooting was never anything to write home about.

He's missing longer three in the NBA at an alarming rate and his inside moves that worked so well against mid major big men isn't working and probably never will work versus NBA big men.

then why were all these moves and shots working for him in the NBA at the start of the season? I think he just needs to readjust after his ankle injury
Its the beginning of the season and players aren't playing defense all that well as they get into shape. They had never seen him before or knew his moves. Then teams got film on him and adjusted. Can he readjust?
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Neurotic Guy on December 28, 2013, 07:06:14 PM
When youhave to take 7+ shots a game to score 6+ points a game, I don't care if you are averaging 6+ PPG, that's not a good thing. Its a very very bad thing.

One of the best things I saw in this thread was someone saying Olynyk is playing minutes he hasn't earned. Nothing could be more true. Faverani deserves minutes over Olynyk right now.

Oh, and BTW, there is zero guarantee Olynyk's shots start dropping. His FG% was good at Gonzaga because he played against inferior competition and was 7 feet tall but his three point shooting was never anything to write home about.

He's missing longer three in the NBA at an alarming rate and his inside moves that worked so well against mid major big men isn't working and probably never will work versus NBA big men.

I can agree that 7+ shots for 6+ points is a bad thing, but 5 boards in 20 minutes isn't a bad thing.  It's not Dennis Rodman, bad it's not a bad thing.  He is assisting decently as a PF rookie and shots that he's missing I think will evenutally fall.  If not, you'll be proven correct.

He does tend to take a giddyap first step which has caused him some traveling violations and I think some subsequent head problems.  His moves are less fluid and natural as a result -- far too thoughtful. This influences his shot as well.  I think he feels awkward.  Throw the speed of the game and the unforgiving nature of the game at this level and I think you have a rookie who needs to adjust and find a comfort zone.  He may never find it, but you are a far keener observer than I if you already know that he won't.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Nowee on December 28, 2013, 07:22:29 PM
Terrible 4th quarter!

Bad defense, turnovers and bad shots.

Celtics won but i did not like how the won the game at all.

Nice block by Bass to get the win at the end.

Also i think that Avery Bradley should have passed the ball to the players in the open front court to run the clock down. (Or throw it in the air?)
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: hpantazo on December 28, 2013, 07:26:51 PM
The celtics didn't win the game, Mike Brown lost it.

Why the heck did he go with Bennett down the stretch?
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: kozlodoev on December 28, 2013, 07:29:07 PM
then why were all these moves and shots working for him in the NBA at the start of the season? I think he just needs to readjust after his ankle injury
Um, they weren't? He has shot abysmally pretty much since the opening bell of the regular season.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Surferdad on December 28, 2013, 08:14:14 PM
When youhave to take 7+ shots a game to score 6+ points a game, I don't care if you are averaging 6+ PPG, that's not a good thing. Its a very very bad thing.

One of the best things I saw in this thread was someone saying Olynyk is playing minutes he hasn't earned. Nothing could be more true. Faverani deserves minutes over Olynyk right now.

Oh, and BTW, there is zero guarantee Olynyk's shots start dropping. His FG% was good at Gonzaga because he played against inferior competition and was 7 feet tall but his three point shooting was never anything to write home about.

He's missing longer three in the NBA at an alarming rate and his inside moves that worked so well against mid major big men isn't working and probably never will work versus NBA big men.

I can agree that 7+ shots for 6+ points is a bad thing, but 5 boards in 20 minutes isn't a bad thing.  It's not Dennis Rodman, bad it's not a bad thing.  He is assisting decently as a PF rookie and shots that he's missing I think will evenutally fall.  If not, you'll be proven correct.

He does tend to take a giddyap first step which has caused him some traveling violations and I think some subsequent head problems.  His moves are less fluid and natural as a result -- far too thoughtful. This influences his shot as well.  I think he feels awkward.  Throw the speed of the game and the unforgiving nature of the game at this level and I think you have a rookie who needs to adjust and find a comfort zone.  He may never find it, but you are a far keener observer than I if you already know that he won't.
I was at the game and spent some time focusing on KO. Although his shot is not falling, he is doing quite a few other good things out there like setting high picks, cutting to the basket, good passing.  If his Fg% was better, no one would be writing this kid off.   It is true he's got the rookie awkwardness which we should hope he sheds by next season.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: SHAQATTACK on December 28, 2013, 09:56:42 PM
When youhave to take 7+ shots a game to score 6+ points a game, I don't care if you are averaging 6+ PPG, that's not a good thing. Its a very very bad thing.

One of the best things I saw in this thread was someone saying Olynyk is playing minutes he hasn't earned. Nothing could be more true. Faverani deserves minutes over Olynyk right now.

Oh, and BTW, there is zero guarantee Olynyk's shots start dropping. His FG% was good at Gonzaga because he played against inferior competition and was 7 feet tall but his three point shooting was never anything to write home about.

He's missing longer three in the NBA at an alarming rate and his inside moves that worked so well against mid major big men isn't working and probably never will work versus NBA big men.

I can agree that 7+ shots for 6+ points is a bad thing, but 5 boards in 20 minutes isn't a bad thing.  It's not Dennis Rodman, bad it's not a bad thing.  He is assisting decently as a PF rookie and shots that he's missing I think will evenutally fall.  If not, you'll be proven correct.

He does tend to take a giddyap first step which has caused him some traveling violations and I think some subsequent head problems.  His moves are less fluid and natural as a result -- far too thoughtful. This influences his shot as well.  I think he feels awkward.  Throw the speed of the game and the unforgiving nature of the game at this level and I think you have a rookie who needs to adjust and find a comfort zone.  He may never find it, but you are a far keener observer than I if you already know that he won't.
I was at the game and spent some time focusing on KO. Although his shot is not falling, he is doing quite a few other good things out there like setting high picks, cutting to the basket, good passing.  If his Fg% was better, no one would be writing this kid off.   It is true he's got the rookie awkwardness which we should hope he sheds by next season.

TP.........your right ....I see this stuff too......the effort is there .....he is just so low on confidence .right now...I think his finding identity on the court is troublesome .....he is not a all hog by nature ......he needs to learn the NBA post game......learn how to get position,  box out his man ,  and demand the ball ,  and Never hesitate to take a good shot.   He is still playing like a guard.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: DesertDweller on December 29, 2013, 11:47:12 AM
The 2013 Summer League games in Orlando seem so long ago. I watched all of those games thinking this kid Olynyk has got it all. but that was then and this is now and Kelly Olynyk has found that life among the trees in the NBA is a lot different than the good old Summer League games.
I hate to say this but I am seriously worried about this kid making this team the way he is playing now. all that athleticism seems to have vanished and been turned into clumsy ball handling and bad decision making. Kelly looks lost, to say the least, in the vet world of pro basketball.  all those cute over and under layups he was making in Orlando don't come so easy without position and strength in the real NBA, and unfortunately, Olynyk, has mastered neither.
I would go as far as saying that Faverani has a better chance at sticking with the Celtics because of his strength but even Vitor makes bad decisions.
It just seems to me that Boston is cursed when it comes to signing a solid big guy.
As far as today's game....same old thing, that one bad quarter that haunts this team.  in this game it was the fourth quarter that almost killed them if not for the great block by Bass on the final shot. also no movement on the ball and some stupid passes from Jordan Crawford whom I mentioned the other day that Brad Stevens needs to reel in before he starts costing us games.
The difference between this team being where they are now and them having won another 5 to 6 games is the ability to cut down on Dumb mistakes and most importantly knowing when to step on the other team's throat and finish the game!!!
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: Boston Garden Leprechaun on December 29, 2013, 12:38:36 PM
nice win but we are terrible at blowing big leads.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: satch on December 29, 2013, 01:02:43 PM
I agree with desertdweller....Plus when KO and Vitor are playing bad Vitor actually hurts the team less. It seems that Stevens is force feeding playing time for KO that he has not earned. I thought the best ball the C'c have played this year was when KO was out with the ankle injury. If he had played one more minute yesterday the C's more than likely would have lost. Time will settle this argument but if I'm wrong I will it admit it. Hope the C's do likewise.
Title: Re: Cavaliers (10-18) at Celtics (12-17) Game #30 12/28
Post by: j804 on December 29, 2013, 01:06:57 PM
And to think during summer league I remember folks calling KO a poor mans version of Dirk  ;D