CelticsStrong
Celtics Basketball => Celtics Talk => Topic started by: Stig on December 28, 2012, 06:03:28 AM
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No, i don't mean he deserves it.
But his stats looks he only worth half the money, if we want to trade him soon, shouldn't we give him more minutes to inflate his value?
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I really think we could be trading him and Lee at some point. It might be worth it to "showcase" him. I am scared of Kris Joseph as PP backup but in some ways he is a better player than Etwaun Moore if this does go down.
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Jg has shown absolutely no initiative to come and lead this team. He deserves To .be traded
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Unfortunately i think the actual front offices oif nba teams have basic stat guys who know that 15 points in 36 minutes is no better than 10 points in 24 minutes even though there are still scores of announcers who still live in the "i dont care what the stats say, green is a 15 point per game player!" camp. Except the C's apparently.
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No, i don't mean he deserves it.
But his stats looks he only worth half the money, if we want to trade him soon, shouldn't we give him more minutes to inflate his value?
He's 25 games removed from open heart surgery. Who told you he's in a condition to play more?
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No, i don't mean he deserves it.
But his stats looks he only worth half the money, if we want to trade him soon, shouldn't we give him more minutes to inflate his value?
He's 25 games removed from open heart surgery. Who told you he's in a condition to play more?
Well, I'm not a doctor but it would seem to me that when it concerns the heart and the strenuous activity of professional basketball, someone should either be able to play significant minutes after being fully cleared for months or none at all. If his heart isn't recovered yet, even playing a little should be very dangerous.
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No, i don't mean he deserves it.
But his stats looks he only worth half the money, if we want to trade him soon, shouldn't we give him more minutes to inflate his value?
He's 25 games removed from open heart surgery. Who told you he's in a condition to play more?
Well, I'm not a doctor but it would seem to me that when it concerns the heart and the strenuous activity of professional basketball, someone should either be able to play significant minutes after being fully cleared for months or none at all. If his heart isn't recovered yet, even playing a little should be very dangerous.
Don't know why it seems that way to you. That would pretty much imply that every player coming back from a surgery should be ready to jump in the fray and play 35 minutes per game, which is clearly not true.
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We shall.
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Not at the 4.
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.....no
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he's a wuss.
said that 3 years ago.
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No, i don't mean he deserves it.
But his stats looks he only worth half the money, if we want to trade him soon, shouldn't we give him more minutes to inflate his value?
He's 25 games removed from open heart surgery. Who told you he's in a condition to play more?
Who told you he's not?
Even if this was a minutes restriction type of injury/recovery has any player ever been restricted for 3+ months after they return?
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No, i don't mean he deserves it.
But his stats looks he only worth half the money, if we want to trade him soon, shouldn't we give him more minutes to inflate his value?
He's 25 games removed from open heart surgery. Who told you he's in a condition to play more?
Who told you he's not?
Even if this was a minutes restriction type of injury/recovery has any player ever been restricted for 3+ months after they return?
Um, because players return from heart surgery to the NBA every year...
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Ugh, if I never have to see Green play a single, solitary second for the C's, I'd be a happy man.
Watching him play hurts my eyes.
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No, i don't mean he deserves it.
But his stats looks he only worth half the money, if we want to trade him soon, shouldn't we give him more minutes to inflate his value?
He's 25 games removed from open heart surgery. Who told you he's in a condition to play more?
Who told you he's not?
Even if this was a minutes restriction type of injury/recovery has any player ever been restricted for 3+ months after they return?
Um, because players return from heart surgery to the NBA every year...
Um, I said any player ever returning from injury.
Come on, are you seriously trying to make me look dumb on this?
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No, i don't mean he deserves it.
But his stats looks he only worth half the money, if we want to trade him soon, shouldn't we give him more minutes to inflate his value?
He's 25 games removed from open heart surgery. Who told you he's in a condition to play more?
Who told you he's not?
Even if this was a minutes restriction type of injury/recovery has any player ever been restricted for 3+ months after they return?
Um, because players return from heart surgery to the NBA every year...
Um, I said any player ever returning from injury.
Come on, are you seriously trying to make me look dumb on this?
It's been stated by a few analysts that Green is healthy and able to play, but he wouldn't really return to full pre-surgery form for about a year, so yes, he is still recovering.
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Yes.
And post him up more against other 3's. It seems that he's capable of taking opponent SF's on the post.
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Start him. He should be starting on this squad and in order for him to be more productive he needs more minutes with the starters. He could be the 4th/5th option in the starting lineup. There's too much pressure on him being the first option in the second unit. Let him get into a groove with the starters and play some minutes with the second unit.
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Yes, because he moves the ball.
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The answer to this question is a resounding, YES! And demand that he not defer to more tenured players while he's out there.
Seriously, we know what PP can do. Jeff needs to continue building himself up within the structure of the team, in hopes that he can be a true difference maker every game.
Give him a few starts where he's commanded to shoot 15 shots. Doc has given that command to KG before. Time to build Jeff up by giving him the keys to the family car.
Burning out KG and PP by having them handle the load now does not seem like a good idea to me. We either get other people involved or we have an ugly finish to the season.
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The main probelm is not so Much Pierce or Green , they need a REAL front line of star calibre 4/5's to susceed.
Can play either alot more , but the end result is when KG sits , this team falls to pieces against all but the worst team.
Until IMPACT calibre players BIG of 4/5 size can be brought in , this team is stuck basically where its at. While appearing good against inferior comp. and ill-equipped to play stack teams with multiple athletic talents.
No bigs to score against other 4/5's and no bigs to stop interior penetration.
25-30 minutes is NOT enough of KG.... to win games against the best teams.
We need a tuff impact 4/5 player than can play 35-40 minutes EVERY NIGHT. Collins was barely noticeable out there.
With a good BIG PF/C I think we'd see Greens game grow and PP play alot better . , and DOc could coach better plays that the players are used to and can handle easy.
We can shuffle exsisting players and minutes a million times, but at the end of the day against the top 5 teams we aren't equipped to compete .
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No, i don't mean he deserves it.
But his stats looks he only worth half the money, if we want to trade him soon, shouldn't we give him more minutes to inflate his value?
He's 25 games removed from open heart surgery. Who told you he's in a condition to play more?
Who told you he's not?
Even if this was a minutes restriction type of injury/recovery has any player ever been restricted for 3+ months after they return?
Um, because players return from heart surgery to the NBA every year...
Um, I said any player ever returning from injury.
Come on, are you seriously trying to make me look dumb on this?
It's been stated by a few analysts that Green is healthy and able to play, but he wouldn't really return to full pre-surgery form for about a year, so yes, he is still recovering.
And it's been a year. There's "recovering" from surgery and then there's "recovering" NBA form. One is decided by doctors who restrict contact and the speed at which they can practice/build strength.
If there's analysts out there saying Green can play 28 minutes in 3 games straight but can't handle 30 minutes per game or whatever the heck the OP is talking about, I'm going to have to see it to believe it.
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Regarding whether Green's surgery is an excuse for either his mediocre play or restricted minutes, the other NBA players who had the same surgery weren't big minute guys (Turiaf, Etan Thomas) or didn't play in the league after the surgery (Hoiberg, Tractor Traylor). Green's per36 numbers are right at his career averages, which are pedestrian.
Even more frightening, Green's Celtics numbers are almost exactly the same as his per-surgery numbers in Celtic green(except for a dip in FG% from 48.5 to 43).
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No, i don't mean he deserves it.
But his stats looks he only worth half the money, if we want to trade him soon, shouldn't we give him more minutes to inflate his value?
He's 25 games removed from open heart surgery. Who told you he's in a condition to play more?
Who told you he's not?
Even if this was a minutes restriction type of injury/recovery has any player ever been restricted for 3+ months after they return?
Um, because players return from heart surgery to the NBA every year...
Um, I said any player ever returning from injury.
Come on, are you seriously trying to make me look dumb on this?
It's been stated by a few analysts that Green is healthy and able to play, but he wouldn't really return to full pre-surgery form for about a year, so yes, he is still recovering.
And it's been a year. There's "recovering" from surgery and then there's "recovering" NBA form. One is decided by doctors who restrict contact and the speed at which they can practice/build strength.
If there's analysts out there saying Green can play 28 minutes in 3 games straight but can't handle 30 minutes per game or whatever the heck the OP is talking about, I'm going to have to see it to believe it.
I'm sure medically he could play 48 minutes if Doc wants to, but he won't recover to NBA form until net year.
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The main probelm is not so Much Pierce or Green , they need a REAL front line of star calibre 4/5's to susceed.
Can play either alot more , but the end result is when KG sits , this team falls to pieces against all but the worst team.
Until IMPACT calibre players BIG of 4/5 size can be brought in , this team is stuck basically where its at. While appearing good against inferior comp. and ill-equipped to play stack teams with multiple athletic talents.
No bigs to score against other 4/5's and no bigs to stop interior penetration.
25-30 minutes is NOT enough of KG.... to win games against the best teams.
We need a tuff impact 4/5 player than can play 35-40 minutes EVERY NIGHT. Collins was barely noticeable out there.
With a good BIG PF/C I think we'd see Greens game grow and PP play alot better . , and DOc could coach better plays that the players are used to and can handle easy.
We can shuffle exsisting players and minutes a million times, but at the end of the day against the top 5 teams we aren't equipped to compete .
Yeah if we are playing our most influencial player in KG for only half of a game and expecting to beat the leagues best teams we have another thing coming. KG is our MVP, not the best or most talented player on the team, but he needs to be on the floor for us to be successful. If we limit him to only playing half the game, of course we are going to play poorly.
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No, i don't mean he deserves it.
But his stats looks he only worth half the money, if we want to trade him soon, shouldn't we give him more minutes to inflate his value?
He's 25 games removed from open heart surgery. Who told you he's in a condition to play more?
Who told you he's not?
Even if this was a minutes restriction type of injury/recovery has any player ever been restricted for 3+ months after they return?
Um, because players return from heart surgery to the NBA every year...
Um, I said any player ever returning from injury.
Come on, are you seriously trying to make me look dumb on this?
It's been stated by a few analysts that Green is healthy and able to play, but he wouldn't really return to full pre-surgery form for about a year, so yes, he is still recovering.
And it's been a year. There's "recovering" from surgery and then there's "recovering" NBA form. One is decided by doctors who restrict contact and the speed at which they can practice/build strength.
If there's analysts out there saying Green can play 28 minutes in 3 games straight but can't handle 30 minutes per game or whatever the heck the OP is talking about, I'm going to have to see it to believe it.
I'm sure medically he could play 48 minutes if Doc wants to, but he won't recover to NBA form until net year.
That's a subjective observation, not any type of quantitative evaluation. If you ask some people he's already where he was.
Do you guys actually watch Green? Does he look weak to you? You're saying a guy who's not back in shape could be doing the things he does? Flying past people with 1 dribble and dunking on bigger guys?
I literally can not believe this is a discussion.
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No, i don't mean he deserves it.
But his stats looks he only worth half the money, if we want to trade him soon, shouldn't we give him more minutes to inflate his value?
He's 25 games removed from open heart surgery. Who told you he's in a condition to play more?
Who told you he's not?
Even if this was a minutes restriction type of injury/recovery has any player ever been restricted for 3+ months after they return?
Um, because players return from heart surgery to the NBA every year...
Um, I said any player ever returning from injury.
Come on, are you seriously trying to make me look dumb on this?
It's been stated by a few analysts that Green is healthy and able to play, but he wouldn't really return to full pre-surgery form for about a year, so yes, he is still recovering.
And it's been a year. There's "recovering" from surgery and then there's "recovering" NBA form. One is decided by doctors who restrict contact and the speed at which they can practice/build strength.
If there's analysts out there saying Green can play 28 minutes in 3 games straight but can't handle 30 minutes per game or whatever the heck the OP is talking about, I'm going to have to see it to believe it.
I'm sure medically he could play 48 minutes if Doc wants to, but he won't recover to NBA form until net year.
That's a subjective observation, not any type of quantitative evaluation. If you ask some people he's already where he was.
Do you guys actually watch Green? Does he look weak to you? You're saying a guy who's not back in shape could be doing the things he does? Flying past people with 1 dribble and dunking on bigger guys?
I literally can not believe this is a discussion.
Some people think he won't be fully recovered until he is better than... Michael Jordan.
And how come he seemed more "recovered" a month ago?
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So, Green is doing what he has done his ENTIRE career but people are still saying his play is somehow strained by surgery? LOL Okay, if you say so! They fixed Green's heart, they didn't remove it, but most of the time he plays like the Cowardly Lion (has it in him but for some reason he can't use it at will)! When Jeff is aggressive everyone gives the ball to him and let's him do his thing... he has no problem not conceding to the Vets in those times so it's not that. Jeff just isn't built for stardom, he is a guy who can be your 3rd or 4th guy on a contender (don't expect him to carry your team in a tough situation).
Now also, let me see if I understand some of you correctly, you say Green is afraid to take shots from the vets or ruffle feathers... so you suggest you put him in WITH those vets to see him do what exactly? Continue to defer to them? I don't understand that...
Green was so bad last night that even when Doc had him out there with our less talented group against the Clips less talented group he was still as passive as ever! A time where he should be able to do anything he wants he does nothing! When I say bad, I don't actually mean he was garbage, I just mean bad as to what is expected of him... I just wish my expectations were lower, it's not all my fault that they are high though.
I know I get on Green when he DISAPPEARS but I actually like him, I just hate that we expect so much from him (we need it), but he just isn't THAT dude! Green has played well enough, if we didn't expect more or need it he wouldn't be an issue... I blame Danny and Doc for thinking he could be that dude. He wasn't even a guy to take over for PP during his best time in OKC, if you think he could then not only do you not know Jeff but you don't appreciate what PP does!
On his good nights no mention of surgery, his mediocre nights, "he JUST had heart surgery!"
No one is going to ever have all good nights and there have been people more inconsistent than Jeff but there should never be a time when a player just stands around looking dead out there... I would rather see Jeff miss 15 shots than stand around being useless, at least then I would know he is engaged in the action... even during Sully's worst games the guy is always out there at least making an effort.
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No, i don't mean he deserves it.
But his stats looks he only worth half the money, if we want to trade him soon, shouldn't we give him more minutes to inflate his value?
He's 25 games removed from open heart surgery. Who told you he's in a condition to play more?
25 games? Jeff had surgery January 9th 2012. Its coming up on a year.
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You should probably give up on trading Green until he has two or fewer years left on his contract unless he is needed as trade ballast in a deal involving the Celtics sending out a good first round pick.