CelticsStrong
Celtics Basketball => Celtics Talk => Topic started by: jyyzzoel on December 18, 2012, 10:41:07 PM
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for signing jeff green more than anything else, or is it just me?
i just need to know im not alone in this :)
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I don't think signing Jeff Green was a mistake, and the dollar number doesn't bother me because it's not my money and it didn't prevent us from signing anybody else.
I don't really blame Danny because on paper, coming into this season, I thought we had a really great team. I was excited about taking the same basic core starting lineup from last season which was so effective in the second half and bolstering them with a stronger, deeper supporting cast.
So far, they've woefully underperformed and look terribly mismatched.
If anybody is to blame for this, I think it's probably Doc. But Doc has done enough over the last 5+ years to get the benefit of the doubt.
So really I'm just totally at a loss with this group right now.
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Danny blew it massively signing both Green and Terry. They have been positively awful.
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up until this game, Green has averaged around 13ppg the past few games.
IMO its kind of hard to dump on him when he only played 10minutes...its hard for ANY NBA player to make an impact in so few minutes.
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for signing jeff green more than anything else, or is it just me?
i just need to know im not alone in this :)
no, I have no problem with him signing Green. the contract was excessive but signing him was the right move.
I'm more disappointed in Doc in that he can't get better results with this roster.
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I don't think signing Jeff Green was a mistake, and the dollar number doesn't bother me because it's not my money and it didn't prevent us from signing anybody else.
I don't really blame Danny because on paper, coming into this season, I thought we had a really great team. I was excited about taking the same basic core starting lineup from last season which was so effective in the second half and bolstering them with a stronger, deeper supporting cast.
So far, they've woefully underperformed and look terribly mismatched.
If anybody is to blame for this, I think it's probably Doc. But Doc has done enough over the last 5+ years to get the benefit of the doubt.
So really I'm just totally at a loss with this group right now.
I don't think Doc deserves the benefit of the doubt, at all.
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woulda rather had Jamal Crawford instead of Terry mainly cuz of size Terry's defense is worse then expected nd Crawford is leadin da Clippers in scorin smh
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I'll be disappointed if he doesn't make a move for a true rebounding big man. If we get a good rebounder without giving up AB then this team will be in business. If we could get Gortat and go with.
Rondo/Terry/Barbosa
AB/Terry/Barbosa
Pierce/Green/Joeseph
KG/Bass/Green
Gortat/KG/Collins.
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woulda rather had Jamal Crawford instead of Terry mainly cuz of size Terry's defense is worse then expected nd Crawford is leadin da Clippers in scorin smh
Yup. At first I was on board with Terry (and C Lee.) Now, it's looking like the Celtics offseason acquisitions were a total failure.
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Yeah I even called for him to potentially being fired already. The lack of rebounding over the last four years. And the fact that we had to count on Darko to make an impact. As we have no quality big man at all other than Kevin. He's the only good player we have over 6'8" You can't win in the NBA with one really tall guy. And that old guy is thirty six.
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I don't think signing Jeff Green was a mistake, and the dollar number doesn't bother me because it's not my money and it didn't prevent us from signing anybody else.
I don't really blame Danny because on paper, coming into this season, I thought we had a really great team. I was excited about taking the same basic core starting lineup from last season which was so effective in the second half and bolstering them with a stronger, deeper supporting cast.
So far, they've woefully underperformed and look terribly mismatched.
If anybody is to blame for this, I think it's probably Doc. But Doc has done enough over the last 5+ years to get the benefit of the doubt.
So really I'm just totally at a loss with this group right now.
With what he had to work with, I think Danny has done quite well in the offseason.. Doc just couldn't make it work!
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I've been thoroughly disappointed in Danny for quite a while now, but it seems I'm the only one with that sentiment so I don't say much about it.
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I'll wait until after the trade deadline to really evaluate Dany's Job for this season...
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for signing jeff green more than anything else, or is it just me?
i just need to know im not alone in this :)
Absolutely. Danny actually had a pretty good offseason given our limited options, and then we sign Jeff for 4 years at $36m... Worst deal of the summer.
I've been one of Jeff's biggest defenders this season. I really thought, "this guy went through a life threatening event. The game he loves to play was almost taken from him. Its gonna light a fire under him and he's gonna be a different player." But no. Same Jeff as always. Except now, he's overpaid.
Did I mention we're committed to him for 4 years? At 36m? Ugh.
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AB will help and we won't lose all the NEXT 10 games... ;D
but serious ...this teams stars are too old to carry the load , they are alot of fun to watch , but losen gets old too.
We need some serious talented younger BIG to go with ROndo and AB , if you really truely want to complete.
What else can Danny do now?
Not sure...but he better think of it quick....or this team will be looking a horrible record .
Wow the pressure is on DANNY ...Celtic nation is waiting ...give us a plan ..
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I'm more disappointed in Doc and his stupid rotations, yeah I said it.
I believe Danny did a fine job landing solid players, drafted well from where our position is. But Doc is misusing these pieces. Two off the bench, sixth man type guys who flourish in that role are starting. We had solid 7 footer has not even played more than 15 minutes, to the point that he had to leave the team.
I don't blame Danny at all. Dare I say, it's Doc and he should be put in the hot seat?
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Doc is TOO soft , to be a coach.... he is all the time worried about egos...and divas ....either they play ball or bench ..trade em and get more guys who want to play defense.
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I simply cut and pasted this from the "Is anyone ready to fire Danny?" Thread:
So, let's recap the last few yrs:
Danny acquires KG and Ray Ray, even AFTER our attempt to land the number 1 or 2 pick in the 07-08 draft falls through.
We subsequently win Banner 17.
Absolutely BRILLIANT move by Danny, because neither Durant or Oden would've brought us Banner 17.
We then go 62-20, but fall to ORL in the playoffs due to KG's injury. Not Danny's fault. We retool the roster a bit, minus Posey, add Micky Moore and Marbury, but STILL have a fine season.
If KG was healthy, we'd have Banner 18 that yr, and the Lakers would still have only 15.
Next season 09-10, we have a miraculous run to the finals, Rondo establishes himself as a star, LeBron, frustrated by BOS once again, bolts. We frustrate DH again, Danny adds Nate and Sheed. Sheed proves big in the playoffs, but we still lose.
Basically, if KG was recovered AND Perk was healthy, we'd have banner 19.
10-11? Shaq proves HUGE for us while healthy. We have perhaps our best run in several yrs, going 40-11 with Shaqtus manning the middle. JO proves helpful while healthy. Thanks to a DWade takedown of Rondo, any shot we have at beating MIA is for nought.
Again - not Danny's fault.
11-12? Another awesome run...AB (Danny's pick) proves HUGE. We basically falter once again due to injuries.
So are we still rdy to can Danny? I'm not.
So..based off of my post, and the fact that - even though we are 12-12 after 24 games..have been playing a bit erratic, etc, etc...
I am STILL not disappointed with Danny or this team. If we are playing like this in late April or May, then of course we will have a quick playoff exit. But I expect this team to right itself before long.
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woulda rather had Jamal Crawford instead of Terry mainly cuz of size Terry's defense is worse then expected nd Crawford is leadin da Clippers in scorin smh
As much as I like Jason Terry, I think that was Danny's biggest mistake.
I just honestly think is isn't a great match for our team. In hindsight it would have been better to go after a younger player that was a better defender. Jet is too much of a liability on D when we are in tight games down the stretch. His shooting ability don't make up for the bad d.
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woulda rather had Jamal Crawford instead of Terry mainly cuz of size Terry's defense is worse then expected nd Crawford is leadin da Clippers in scorin smh
Why? he cant play off ball... With the way the offense is built we need guys who can play well and efficiently off ball.
Terry was supposed to be the man off the bench. With AB out and lee playing poorly he had to start. He's not an ideal fit with rondo right now. Too small and slow on defense. Needs the rock to get in a rhythm on offense.
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woulda rather had Jamal Crawford instead of Terry mainly cuz of size Terry's defense is worse then expected nd Crawford is leadin da Clippers in scorin smh
Why? he cant play off ball... With the way the offense is built we need guys who can play well and efficiently off ball.
Terry was supposed to be the man off the bench. With AB out and lee playing poorly he had to start. He's not an ideal fit with rondo right now. Too small and slow on defense. Needs the rock to get in a rhythm on offense.
Crawford can create his own shot nd woulda took some scorin load off Pierce plus his defense is betta then Terry's
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woulda rather had Jamal Crawford instead of Terry mainly cuz of size Terry's defense is worse then expected nd Crawford is leadin da Clippers in scorin smh
As much as I like Jason Terry, I think that was Danny's biggest mistake.
I just honestly think is isn't a great match for our team. In hindsight it would have been better to go after a younger player that was a better defender. Jet is too much of a liability on D when we are in tight games down the stretch. His shooting ability don't make up for the bad d.
yea man when it was rumored we was lookin at Crawford, Terry, nd Nick Young i wanted crawford mainly cuz of size nd his shot makin ability Terry's peremiter D was way worse then expected
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up until this game, Green has averaged around 13ppg the past few games.
IMO its kind of hard to dump on him when he only played 10minutes...its hard for ANY NBA player to make an impact in so few minutes.
I missed tonight's game, but NBA.Com has Green listed as playing twenty minutes tonight. Did they get it wrong? You've posted this numerous times.
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I wished he hadn't resigned Wilcox and Bass. It's impossible to have a good team when the second and third bigs possess basketball IQs as low as any in the league. The problem is compounded because Doc insists on going to them for LONG stretches against first unit bigs because KG is unfit to play longer than five minute stretches, if even that. Both routinely make terrible defensive decisions that lead to wide open shots everywhere on the court. There was a solid reason why Bass and Wilcox were 7th or lower guys before coming to the Celtics.
A guy I would have loved and who signed for the minimum was Kurt Thomas. He's still played at an effective level this year. The defense and rebounding to go along with shooting would've provided things this team miserably fails at.
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Sign Joey Dorsey.
I still think he'd combine brilliantly well with Garnett as a physical power forward who does the dirty work in the paint defensively and on the backboards for the Celtics.
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I wished he hadn't resigned Wilcox and Bass. It's impossible to have a good team when the second and third bigs possess basketball IQs as low as any in the league. The problem is compounded because Doc insists on going to them for LONG stretches against first unit bigs because KG is unfit to play longer than five minute stretches, if even that. Both routinely make terrible defensive decisions that lead to wide open shots everywhere on the court. There was a solid reason why Bass and Wilcox were 7th or lower guys before coming to the Celtics.
A guy I would have loved and who signed for the minimum was Kurt Thomas. He's still played at an effective level this year. The defense and rebounding to go along with shooting would've provided things this team miserably fails at.
co-sign dont kno how Bass got a 4 year deal nd Wilcox has 0 shotblockin or rebounding ability
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Yes. To reiterate, Ainge is a clown. See all previous posts for my explanation.
I'd love to know what Ainge did (independently of McHale) to stage himself as a "good"... even "above average" GM in some eyes. Please share a single success (late first-round, no-brainer draft picks that had the benefit of playing behind legends do not count..)
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not disappointed in Danny at all. He's done his best.
First of all, we had a string of horrible luck. I STILL would trade Perk for Jeff Green. Perk wasn't worth the money. Still isn't. Shaq came back for about 5 minutes and hobbled off the court. That was a blow. The lockout hurt us a bit... Kristik never came back from Europe. That was a bit of a blow. We thought we had David West signed and that deal fell apart... that was a bit of a blow. Jeff Green's heart condition came out of nowhere. That was a blow.
The smart play last deadline was to blow it up. We were below .500 and struggling. Danny made a wise decision and traded Ray to Memphis and Pierce to the Nets. Both deals fell apart for one reason or another. I've heard it said that both Ray and Pierce killed the deals. Regardless, Ainge tried to do the smart thing and it got shot down.
We went on a bit of a surprise run after the deadline. KG was playing vintage ball and dropping 20 and 10s nightly. We played well towards the end of the season mainly because of vintage KG and also a little bit because of the "unknown factor" of a streaking Bradleysanity at the tail end of a lockout shortened season. In the playoffs we really couldn't have gotten luckier. We beat the Hawks without HOrford and then snuck by the 8th seed 76ers in 7 games. The Bulls with or without Rose probably would have beat us. I also think any time with a dominant big (like Orlando had Dwight been around) would have given us nightmares. Facing Atlanta and Philly was basically a best-case-scenario path to the ECF. We gave Miami a little headache, Bosh came back and then LeBron took over and closed us out.
Ray obviously left us empty handed and Ainge scrambled to fill the void with whatever crap he could get his hands on... Jason Terry, Courtney Lee and Barbosa. All solid bench guards, but none of that solves our issues from last season. I think we got lucky in the draft with Sully falling to us. We might have some assets to try and throw a bandaid on this roster, but with KG and Pierce aging, it's unlikely we'll ever be in position to contend for a title in the near future. We might get lucky and make a run at it, but I wouldn't hold your breath on us being a "favorite" with this roster. Still, if we stockpile some assets and bring in another big, we could theoretically start to look a lot like the Spurs and make as much noise as them.
Ainge has done right by this team. I've very confident in his ability and very comfortable with the decisions he's made. He's not going to trade anyone just for the sake of trading them, but he absolutely will do anything possible to improve this team. Sometimes it's out of his control, though. As last year clearly showed... Luck plays a significant factor... both good and bad.
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for signing jeff green more than anything else, or is it just me?
i just need to know im not alone in this :)
What else would you have done? You do realize that we were up against the cap, right? The $9M we gave Green was going nowhere else. We could not sign any Free Agents for that sum.
Jeff Green is not the reason this team is .500 right now.
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I almost fully approved of Danny's off-season, so I'm not going to bash him now. The areas where I disagreed with him -- Green's contract, taking Melo over PJ3, and not signing Chris Andersen -- are all relatively minor.
I think Danny put together a good roster. Now, the players and Doc need to make it happen.
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I need to wait and see how this plays out.
I can't be too disappointed, because I thought he did an incredible job at first, and if I am going to go against myself with hindsight, I am going to wait for REAL hindsight. We are still relatively early in the season.
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Outside of the Green contract, no.
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I'm disappointed that the players we have perform way worse than their track record indicates.
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No.
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I have been saying for months I thought the entire off season was a disaster. I didn't like any moves he made outside of drafting Sullinger since last season ended. Sadly it appears I was correct. Perhaps he can salvage some of it with some trades, but even then I'm not sure we have the pieces or the value to get players that will actually help this team or undo the vast majority of the moves made.
Horrid off season which has regulated Boston to mediocrity for at least the next 3 seasons.
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I'm disappointed that the players we have perform way worse than their track record indicates.
which ones? Bass is shooting a bit worse, but everyone else is pretty much the player they have always been.
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I have been saying for months I thought the entire off season was a disaster. I didn't like any moves he made outside of drafting Sullinger since last season ended. Sadly it appears I was correct. Perhaps he can salvage some of it with some trades, but even then I'm not sure we have the pieces or the value to get players that will actually help this team or undo the vast majority of the moves made.
Horrid off season which has regulated Boston to mediocrity for at least the next 3 seasons.
You probably posted this elsewhere, but what would your preferred off-season have looked like?
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up until this game, Green has averaged around 13ppg the past few games.
IMO its kind of hard to dump on him when he only played 10minutes...its hard for ANY NBA player to make an impact in so few minutes.
With Green we can always take small samples to make him look better than he is. We can't disregard games or groups of games. And he played 20min, not 10. I was impressed with his 1 rebound and tough defense that Doc was raving about.
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I have been saying for months I thought the entire off season was a disaster. I didn't like any moves he made outside of drafting Sullinger since last season ended. Sadly it appears I was correct. Perhaps he can salvage some of it with some trades, but even then I'm not sure we have the pieces or the value to get players that will actually help this team or undo the vast majority of the moves made.
Horrid off season which has regulated Boston to mediocrity for at least the next 3 seasons.
So far, you have a good case. I was actually thrilled with this offseason. We obviously needed a rugged big guy who rebounds and defends. I wanted Reggie Evans or Birdman, but I figured Darko would play that role.
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I have been saying for months I thought the entire off season was a disaster. I didn't like any moves he made outside of drafting Sullinger since last season ended. Sadly it appears I was correct. Perhaps he can salvage some of it with some trades, but even then I'm not sure we have the pieces or the value to get players that will actually help this team or undo the vast majority of the moves made.
Horrid off season which has regulated Boston to mediocrity for at least the next 3 seasons.
You probably posted this elsewhere, but what would your preferred off-season have looked like?
Since we struck out with any big name free agents, I would have only offered 1 year contracts to our returning free agents (KG, Bass, Green) and would not have signed anyone past 1 year except for small money type deals. I would have probably been ok with Terry or Lee, but not both (since the money in their deals isn't huge). The team now has no cap space or wiggle room any time in the next 3 seasons and doesn't have the talent to be a true contender.
I thought the C's would be better than they are this year, which is why I would have tried to bring everyone back on 1 year deals (plus the draft next summer is/was projected to be very weak so there was no point in tanking), with the possibility of utilizing Bradley and/or Sullinger to bring a big name in at the deadline to maybe put the team over the top (which is much easier if Jeff Green or Brandon Bass is an expiring contract). Then even if no trades had been made Boston would have still had the flexibility next summer to be active in the free agent market, especially with Josh Smith and Dwight Howard being friends with Rondo and both being available (at least in theory). Now Boston has no means to even pursue either in free agency (or Kevin Love the following summer) and has no real shot at trading for Josh Smith given the contracts they have on the team. Next summer if we struck out again in free agency, then Boston could have again signed whomever they wanted to keep to 1 year deals and tried again the following summer or could have just gone into tank mode for a season or two to try and rebuild that way (since the 2014 draft appears to be much stronger).
EDIT: Essentially Ainge has done what he said he would never do. Hang on to players too long and surround them with role players signed to massive and long contracts all on a team that isn't a realistic contender, and now has no real means to improve.
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I think Green gets a lot of crap for his contract but I think it would be a reasonable contract for him on any other team. If he was starting and playing 30 to 35 minutes I think 9 mil a year for four years is fair. But for his role on this team it is a way over payment. Makes me wonder if Danny had financial numbers in mind for future trade bait.
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I'm disappointed that the players we have perform way worse than their track record indicates.
which ones? Bass is shooting a bit worse, but everyone else is pretty much the player they have always been.
Well for starters Pierce is having one of his worst starts in his career. Without looking rondo deeply into it im sure the same could be said about Jason Terry as well. Let's not forget that Lee was also shooting 40% from 3 last year and is now below 30%.
Was this a serious comment?
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I'm disappointed that the players we have perform way worse than their track record indicates.
which ones? Bass is shooting a bit worse, but everyone else is pretty much the player they have always been.
Well for starters Pierce is having one of his worst starts in his career. Without looking rondo deeply into it im sure the same could be said about Jason Terry as well. Let's not forget that Lee was also shooting 40% from 3 last year and is now below 30%.
Was this a serious comment?
Terry is actually much more efficient than he was last year (though is shooting and playing less so his totals are down a bit).
Lee's 3PT shooting is worse, but his overall FG% is better as are pretty much all of his other numbers over the prior season.
Pierce's FG% is lower, but his 3PT and FT% are about the same as are his totals and per minutes in virtually every other category (i.e. rebounds, assists, steals, points).
Rondo has actually improved pretty much across the board both in efficiency and totals.
Green per 36 is essentially the same across the board.
KG per 36 is pretty much the same as last year.
So yeah, I was serious. Apparently you just think because the team is worse it must mean the players are performing worse, which just isn't the case.
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I am not at all disappointed in Danny. He put together a great off season.
Turned
Ray Allan
Greg Steimsma
Marquis Daniels
Keyon Dooling
Ryan Hollins
JJJ
E Moore
into
Jeff Green
Jason Terry
Courtney Lee
Sullinger
Barbosa
Joseph
J Collins
out of last years group the only guy who i think would improve our current rotation is Steimsma. That is even a big stretch.
The team is under performing but Danny is not to blame. He built the deepest celtics team I have seen in my life time (29).
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I am not at all disappointed in Danny. He put together a great off season.
Turned
Ray Allan
Greg Steimsma
Marquis Daniels
Keyon Dooling
Ryan Hollins
JJJ
E Moore
into
Jeff Green
Jason Terry
Courtney Lee
Sullinger
Barbosa
Joseph
J Collins
out of last years group the only guy who i think would improve our current rotation is Steimsma. That is even a big stretch.
The team is under performing but Danny is not to blame. He built the deepest celtics team I have seen in my life time (29).
Ray would improve this team. The offense is still tailored to his strengths. He would effectively stretch the floor.
Dooling would help this team taking PG duties when Rondo is on the bench (and probably help defensively)
Pietrus could also have helped this team.
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I am not at all disappointed in Danny. He put together a great off season.
Turned
Ray Allan
Greg Steimsma
Marquis Daniels
Keyon Dooling
Ryan Hollins
JJJ
E Moore
into
Jeff Green
Jason Terry
Courtney Lee
Sullinger
Barbosa
Joseph
J Collins
out of last years group the only guy who i think would improve our current rotation is Steimsma. That is even a big stretch.
The team is under performing but Danny is not to blame. He built the deepest celtics team I have seen in my life time (29).
it may be deep but it doesn't have the talent to truly compete for a title, which means he wasted a lot of money, resources, and cap space building a deeply mediocre team, which is a waste of pretty much everything.
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I am not at all disappointed in Danny. He put together a great off season.
Turned
Ray Allan
Greg Steimsma
Marquis Daniels
Keyon Dooling
Ryan Hollins
JJJ
E Moore
into
Jeff Green
Jason Terry
Courtney Lee
Sullinger
Barbosa
Joseph
J Collins
out of last years group the only guy who i think would improve our current rotation is Steimsma. That is even a big stretch.
The team is under performing but Danny is not to blame. He built the deepest celtics team I have seen in my life time (29).
it may be deep but it doesn't have the talent to truly compete for a title, which means he wasted a lot of money, resources, and cap space building a deeply mediocre team, which is a waste of pretty much everything.
As a paying fan, its not a waste if they win some more games, and make some noise in the playoffs.
Championships aren't the be all, end all. When you don't have a clear track to one, making a winning team can still be a success.
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Again, it is fine to say you are disappointed in him, but what EXACTLY would you have done differently this offseason?
We had basically no cap space. We acquired Jason Terry and Courtney Lee (moves almost everybody approved of at the time) using a mid-level exception and a sign-and-trade.
All the other signings were for own guys that allowed us to go over the cap. If you want to argue letting Bass go, then fine. If you want to argue letting Jeff Green go, then fine. Please explain how we add equal or better players with the limited cap space we had.
If you want to argue about the additions he made versus some other options (Jamal Crawford, or Ray) then fine. Please explain how Jamal Crawford dramatically alters the season thus far.
Danny added a play-now rookie in Sullinger with a pick in the early 20's. Maybe he could have added another play-now guy with the other pick instead of Melo. If you want to argue that, then fine. Explain what other rookie would have made a major difference that was selected after 21.
Even argue the Ray situation. Maybe losing Ray - and his knowledge of the team - was a bigger loss than we all thought at the time. Please explain how we could have avoided Ray going to Miami, when we offered him a contract, and he rejected it for less money.
My point with all of this is: if you are disappointed, please explain what Danny could have done that would have you otherwise not disappointed. If your sole disappointment comes from paying Jeff Green $9M per vs. whatever you magically think he would have accepted, then you are using him for a scapegoat for your true disappointment...
The play of the team, which is built on Rondo, KG, and Pierce.
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I am not at all disappointed in Danny. He put together a great off season.
Turned
Ray Allan
Greg Steimsma
Marquis Daniels
Keyon Dooling
Ryan Hollins
JJJ
E Moore
into
Jeff Green
Jason Terry
Courtney Lee
Sullinger
Barbosa
Joseph
J Collins
out of last years group the only guy who i think would improve our current rotation is Steimsma. That is even a big stretch.
The team is under performing but Danny is not to blame. He built the deepest celtics team I have seen in my life time (29).
it may be deep but it doesn't have the talent to truly compete for a title, which means he wasted a lot of money, resources, and cap space building a deeply mediocre team, which is a waste of pretty much everything.
I think we do have the talent to compete for a title. There aren't a lot of teams that can say that they have a top 10 player and 3 top 50 players. As a matter of fact, there are only two other teams in the league that can make that claim based on NBA.COMs efficiency stats.
Green, Terry, Bradley, Lee, Bass, Wilcox, and Sullinger make up a strong supporting cast for our three stars. This team has the talent. It's about putting it all together, which I think will come.
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I'm disappointed that the players we have perform way worse than their track record indicates.
which ones? Bass is shooting a bit worse, but everyone else is pretty much the player they have always been.
Well for starters Pierce is having one of his worst starts in his career. Without looking rondo deeply into it im sure the same could be said about Jason Terry as well. Let's not forget that Lee was also shooting 40% from 3 last year and is now below 30%.
Was this a serious comment?
Terry is actually much more efficient than he was last year (though is shooting and playing less so his totals are down a bit).
Lee's 3PT shooting is worse, but his overall FG% is better as are pretty much all of his other numbers over the prior season.
Pierce's FG% is lower, but his 3PT and FT% are about the same as are his totals and per minutes in virtually every other category (i.e. rebounds, assists, steals, points).
Rondo has actually improved pretty much across the board both in efficiency and totals.
Green per 36 is essentially the same across the board.
KG per 36 is pretty much the same as last year.
So yeah, I was serious. Apparently you just think because the team is worse it must mean the players are performing worse, which just isn't the case.
Haha I just think you are on an island if you think Pierce, Terry, and Lee are performing at the same level as last year.
Im going to venture a guess that you were whining about the team last year not being able to compete for a title and in 2010 for that matter.
If you want them to be the favorite from start to finish its not gonna happen.
Just funny how people whine to whine. If you were the GM no one would have taken a ridiculous 1 year contract for everyone. We wouldn't have had enough players to even field a team. Just a ridiculous post about what you would have done. Why not trade pierce for Lebron and wade while youre at it haha
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I'm disappointed that the players we have perform way worse than their track record indicates.
which ones? Bass is shooting a bit worse, but everyone else is pretty much the player they have always been.
Well for starters Pierce is having one of his worst starts in his career. Without looking rondo deeply into it im sure the same could be said about Jason Terry as well. Let's not forget that Lee was also shooting 40% from 3 last year and is now below 30%.
Was this a serious comment?
Terry is actually much more efficient than he was last year (though is shooting and playing less so his totals are down a bit).
Lee's 3PT shooting is worse, but his overall FG% is better as are pretty much all of his other numbers over the prior season.
Pierce's FG% is lower, but his 3PT and FT% are about the same as are his totals and per minutes in virtually every other category (i.e. rebounds, assists, steals, points).
Rondo has actually improved pretty much across the board both in efficiency and totals.
Green per 36 is essentially the same across the board.
KG per 36 is pretty much the same as last year.
So yeah, I was serious. Apparently you just think because the team is worse it must mean the players are performing worse, which just isn't the case.
Yet another example of satistics being deceiving. I would think most people would agree the the Celtics biggest issue is they lack of defense this year. I don't know how to measure that but I will say Pierce, and KG, are both a year older and look quite a bit slower on the defensive end than they did last year. I didn't really watch much of Terry last year, but I have seen enough this year to know he can't guard anyone. I would have to say there has been a drop off on their play.
Green didn't play last year, so that's hard to judge. Rondo's D or lack of is pretty clear. To be honest the only one who's defense has been pretty good is Lee in my opinion.
As for the question, I was one of the people who was fairly happy whit the players Danny signed, so I'm not going to be an I told you so now. The one thing I had hoped for than and still do now is a big who can defend and rebound in the middle, but they are not easy to find and don't come cheap.
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As for the question, I was one of the people who was fairly happy whit the players Danny signed, so I'm not going to be an I told you so now. The one thing I had hoped for than and still do now is a big who can defend and rebound in the middle, but they are not easy to find and don't come cheap.
You might have to choose between a big who can defend but is, at best, an average rebounder or a big who can rebound, but who will not be an upgrade in defense over Bass or Wilcox.
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for signing jeff green more than anything else, or is it just me?
i just need to know im not alone in this :)
no, danny did what he could in the offseason. now that things are NOT working he needs to trade whomever needs to be traded to make us better. try one more time and if it does not work then he can blow the whole thing up to kingdom come. he can blow it up at anytime and we know it will happen AT LEAST 2 years from now at the longest. may as well sell out to win now.....at least he can say he tried before he has to blow it up....
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I'm disappointed that the players we have perform way worse than their track record indicates.
which ones? Bass is shooting a bit worse, but everyone else is pretty much the player they have always been.
Well for starters Pierce is having one of his worst starts in his career. Without looking rondo deeply into it im sure the same could be said about Jason Terry as well. Let's not forget that Lee was also shooting 40% from 3 last year and is now below 30%.
Was this a serious comment?
Terry is actually much more efficient than he was last year (though is shooting and playing less so his totals are down a bit).
Lee's 3PT shooting is worse, but his overall FG% is better as are pretty much all of his other numbers over the prior season.
Pierce's FG% is lower, but his 3PT and FT% are about the same as are his totals and per minutes in virtually every other category (i.e. rebounds, assists, steals, points).
Rondo has actually improved pretty much across the board both in efficiency and totals.
Green per 36 is essentially the same across the board.
KG per 36 is pretty much the same as last year.
So yeah, I was serious. Apparently you just think because the team is worse it must mean the players are performing worse, which just isn't the case.
Haha I just think you are on an island if you think Pierce, Terry, and Lee are performing at the same level as last year.
Im going to venture a guess that you were whining about the team last year not being able to compete for a title and in 2010 for that matter.
If you want them to be the favorite from start to finish its not gonna happen.
Just funny how people whine to whine. If you were the GM no one would have taken a ridiculous 1 year contract for everyone. We wouldn't have had enough players to even field a team. Just a ridiculous post about what you would have done. Why not trade pierce for Lebron and wade while youre at it haha
The numbers don't lie. Statistically the vast majority of the Celtics are performing similarly to their recent career output and many are performing better. That is reality.
If Jeff Green or Brandon Bass wouldn't take a 1 year contract then you let them walk. You don't give a lot of years and big money to easily replaceable role players, which is exactly what Bass and Green are and is exactly what the C's did and should not have done. KG is a tougher question obviously, but I think if the C's would have given him a 1 year contract of 15-17 million with a no trade clause, he probably would have taken it. And for the record the Celtics signed numerous players to 1 year contracts this year for essentially the veteran minimum (Wilcox, Barbosa, Collins, Milicic). It isn't that hard to find credible players on 1 year near minimum contracts.
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I'm disappointed that the players we have perform way worse than their track record indicates.
which ones? Bass is shooting a bit worse, but everyone else is pretty much the player they have always been.
Well for starters Pierce is having one of his worst starts in his career. Without looking rondo deeply into it im sure the same could be said about Jason Terry as well. Let's not forget that Lee was also shooting 40% from 3 last year and is now below 30%.
Was this a serious comment?
Terry is actually much more efficient than he was last year (though is shooting and playing less so his totals are down a bit).
Lee's 3PT shooting is worse, but his overall FG% is better as are pretty much all of his other numbers over the prior season.
Pierce's FG% is lower, but his 3PT and FT% are about the same as are his totals and per minutes in virtually every other category (i.e. rebounds, assists, steals, points).
Rondo has actually improved pretty much across the board both in efficiency and totals.
Green per 36 is essentially the same across the board.
KG per 36 is pretty much the same as last year.
So yeah, I was serious. Apparently you just think because the team is worse it must mean the players are performing worse, which just isn't the case.
Yet another example of satistics being deceiving. I would think most people would agree the the Celtics biggest issue is they lack of defense this year. I don't know how to measure that but I will say Pierce, and KG, are both a year older and look quite a bit slower on the defensive end than they did last year. I didn't really watch much of Terry last year, but I have seen enough this year to know he can't guard anyone. I would have to say there has been a drop off on their play.
Green didn't play last year, so that's hard to judge. Rondo's D or lack of is pretty clear. To be honest the only one who's defense has been pretty good is Lee in my opinion.
As for the question, I was one of the people who was fairly happy whit the players Danny signed, so I'm not going to be an I told you so now. The one thing I had hoped for than and still do now is a big who can defend and rebound in the middle, but they are not easy to find and don't come cheap.
Boston's defense is worse because they let good defenders go in the off season and replaced them with guys who play terrible defense. Pietrus, Dooling, Stiemer, etc were all much better defenders than the guys that replaced them. Bradley (who has yet to play) is also a very strong defender. When you take away good defenders and put in crappy defenders, of course the overall defense of the team is worse. It also puts more pressure on the better defenders and thus worsens their defense as they have to cover more for others.
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I'm disappointed that the players we have perform way worse than their track record indicates.
which ones? Bass is shooting a bit worse, but everyone else is pretty much the player they have always been.
Well for starters Pierce is having one of his worst starts in his career. Without looking rondo deeply into it im sure the same could be said about Jason Terry as well. Let's not forget that Lee was also shooting 40% from 3 last year and is now below 30%.
Was this a serious comment?
Terry is actually much more efficient than he was last year (though is shooting and playing less so his totals are down a bit).
Lee's 3PT shooting is worse, but his overall FG% is better as are pretty much all of his other numbers over the prior season.
Pierce's FG% is lower, but his 3PT and FT% are about the same as are his totals and per minutes in virtually every other category (i.e. rebounds, assists, steals, points).
Rondo has actually improved pretty much across the board both in efficiency and totals.
Green per 36 is essentially the same across the board.
KG per 36 is pretty much the same as last year.
So yeah, I was serious. Apparently you just think because the team is worse it must mean the players are performing worse, which just isn't the case.
Yet another example of satistics being deceiving. I would think most people would agree the the Celtics biggest issue is they lack of defense this year. I don't know how to measure that but I will say Pierce, and KG, are both a year older and look quite a bit slower on the defensive end than they did last year. I didn't really watch much of Terry last year, but I have seen enough this year to know he can't guard anyone. I would have to say there has been a drop off on their play.
Green didn't play last year, so that's hard to judge. Rondo's D or lack of is pretty clear. To be honest the only one who's defense has been pretty good is Lee in my opinion.
As for the question, I was one of the people who was fairly happy whit the players Danny signed, so I'm not going to be an I told you so now. The one thing I had hoped for than and still do now is a big who can defend and rebound in the middle, but they are not easy to find and don't come cheap.
Boston's defense is worse because they let good defenders go in the off season and replaced them with guys who play terrible defense. Pietrus, Dooling, Stiemer, etc were all much better defenders than the guys that replaced them. Bradley (who has yet to play) is also a very strong defender. When you take away good defenders and put in crappy defenders, of course the overall defense of the team is worse. It also puts more pressure on the better defenders and thus worsens their defense as they have to cover more for others.
Dooling and Pietrus combined missed 60 games last year and played 14 and 20 min a game. Stiemsma played 13 min a game and missed 22 games.
Are you gonna start telling me that we are missing marquis now?
We were 5 min away from making the finals. Danny brought in more and better talent than they lost and according to you that talent is playing at or above their level. How can you blame Danny? If anything you have an issue with Doc or you think we could have somehow signed a superstar. Otherwise you'd rather just tank apparently.
Its kind of irrelevant anyway though since clearly his job nor this season is over yet. It actually has barely started
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If Jeff Green or Brandon Bass wouldn't take a 1 year contract then you let them walk. You don't give a lot of years and big money to easily replaceable role players, which is exactly what Bass and Green are and is exactly what the C's did and should not have done.
Given the Celtics cap situation, you'd probably be replacing them with the SF and PF equivalents of Jason Collins.
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for signing jeff green more than anything else, or is it just me?
i just need to know im not alone in this :)
Absolutely. Danny actually had a pretty good offseason given our limited options, and then we sign Jeff for 4 years at $36m... Worst deal of the summer.
I've been one of Jeff's biggest defenders this season. I really thought, "this guy went through a life threatening event. The game he loves to play was almost taken from him. Its gonna light a fire under him and he's gonna be a different player." But no. Same Jeff as always. Except now, he's overpaid.
Did I mention we're committed to him for 4 years? At 36m? Ugh.
I think the intent on signing Jeff Green at Four Years 36 million was to have him replace Paul Pierce when he retires. He needs more time to feel comfortable about his increased role. I say hw breaks out Avery Bradley style in January.
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Was last year just an incredible miracle that we made it to the Fourth Qtr of Game Seven of The ECF before the best basketball in the history of the NBA and his two top ten cohorts walked on our faces the last eight minutes to win the series and ultimately the NBA championship.
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for signing jeff green more than anything else, or is it just me?
i just need to know im not alone in this :)
Absolutely. Danny actually had a pretty good offseason given our limited options, and then we sign Jeff for 4 years at $36m... Worst deal of the summer.
I've been one of Jeff's biggest defenders this season. I really thought, "this guy went through a life threatening event. The game he loves to play was almost taken from him. Its gonna light a fire under him and he's gonna be a different player." But no. Same Jeff as always. Except now, he's overpaid.
Did I mention we're committed to him for 4 years? At 36m? Ugh.
I think the intent on signing Jeff Green at Four Years 36 million was to have him replace Paul Pierce when he retires. He needs more time to feel comfortable about his increased role. I say hw breaks out Avery Bradley style in January.
I don't buy it with Green.
AB broke out his second year after he gained a little NBA experience and the Celtics work on his jump shot (got him to lean less)
Green has played how many season now, heavy minutes?
And it has been consistent play.
I just don't understand why Green is suddenly going to explode into a better player after all these years just because he is now on the Celtics.
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I think the intent on signing Jeff Green at Four Years 36 million was to have him replace Paul Pierce when he retires. He needs more time to feel comfortable about his increased role. I say hw breaks out Avery Bradley style in January.
I dont expect Green to really break out. But when he does take over for Pierce and starts playing big minutes i expect at least what he is doing now just more consistency.
His current averages projected out to 38min would be 16pts 5 rb and he is shooting 38% from 3. These numbers and improved perimeter D I my hopes for jeff.
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I'm disappointed that the players we have perform way worse than their track record indicates.
which ones? Bass is shooting a bit worse, but everyone else is pretty much the player they have always been.
Well for starters Pierce is having one of his worst starts in his career. Without looking rondo deeply into it im sure the same could be said about Jason Terry as well. Let's not forget that Lee was also shooting 40% from 3 last year and is now below 30%.
Was this a serious comment?
Terry is actually much more efficient than he was last year (though is shooting and playing less so his totals are down a bit).
Lee's 3PT shooting is worse, but his overall FG% is better as are pretty much all of his other numbers over the prior season.
Pierce's FG% is lower, but his 3PT and FT% are about the same as are his totals and per minutes in virtually every other category (i.e. rebounds, assists, steals, points).
Rondo has actually improved pretty much across the board both in efficiency and totals.
Green per 36 is essentially the same across the board.
KG per 36 is pretty much the same as last year.
So yeah, I was serious. Apparently you just think because the team is worse it must mean the players are performing worse, which just isn't the case.
Yet another example of satistics being deceiving. I would think most people would agree the the Celtics biggest issue is they lack of defense this year. I don't know how to measure that but I will say Pierce, and KG, are both a year older and look quite a bit slower on the defensive end than they did last year. I didn't really watch much of Terry last year, but I have seen enough this year to know he can't guard anyone. I would have to say there has been a drop off on their play.
Green didn't play last year, so that's hard to judge. Rondo's D or lack of is pretty clear. To be honest the only one who's defense has been pretty good is Lee in my opinion.
As for the question, I was one of the people who was fairly happy whit the players Danny signed, so I'm not going to be an I told you so now. The one thing I had hoped for than and still do now is a big who can defend and rebound in the middle, but they are not easy to find and don't come cheap.
Boston's defense is worse because they let good defenders go in the off season and replaced them with guys who play terrible defense. Pietrus, Dooling, Stiemer, etc were all much better defenders than the guys that replaced them. Bradley (who has yet to play) is also a very strong defender. When you take away good defenders and put in crappy defenders, of course the overall defense of the team is worse. It also puts more pressure on the better defenders and thus worsens their defense as they have to cover more for others.
Dooling and Pietrus combined missed 60 games last year and played 14 and 20 min a game. Stiemsma played 13 min a game and missed 22 games.
Are you gonna start telling me that we are missing marquis now?
We were 5 min away from making the finals. Danny brought in more and better talent than they lost and according to you that talent is playing at or above their level. How can you blame Danny? If anything you have an issue with Doc or you think we could have somehow signed a superstar. Otherwise you'd rather just tank apparently.
Its kind of irrelevant anyway though since clearly his job nor this season is over yet. It actually has barely started
I said the players this year were playing at essentially the rate they were last year. I never said it was more or better talent or a better team. Bringing in a bunch of role players doesn't make your team better. It may make it deeper just not better.
Last year was a fluke and a result of key injuries to great players (like Rose, Horford, and Bosh). If Horford was healthy there is a good chance Boston loses to Atlanta (that series was vastly different the couple of hobbled games he played). Same thing with Rose and Chicago. I don't think Boston gets by Chicago with Rose and as is barely survived 8th seed Philadelphia. Once Miami got Bosh back that series was over. A fully healthy Bosh and it is a 5 game series. Boston wasn't a real contender but had a deep playoff run because of other teams misfortunes. That run tricked a lot of fans into believe Boston was closer to a title than it was. The reality is Boston is a long way away from a title and the past off season made it even farther away because it took away all short term flexibility. Boston has no real way to get better this summer either and is stuck with this team for awhile.
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If Jeff Green or Brandon Bass wouldn't take a 1 year contract then you let them walk. You don't give a lot of years and big money to easily replaceable role players, which is exactly what Bass and Green are and is exactly what the C's did and should not have done.
Given the Celtics cap situation, you'd probably be replacing them with the SF and PF equivalents of Jason Collins.
Barbosa signed late. Martin is available. Birdman is available. Pietrus was available. All better options than destroying cap space on mediocre players.
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for signing jeff green more than anything else, or is it just me?
i just need to know im not alone in this :)
Absolutely. Danny actually had a pretty good offseason given our limited options, and then we sign Jeff for 4 years at $36m... Worst deal of the summer.
I've been one of Jeff's biggest defenders this season. I really thought, "this guy went through a life threatening event. The game he loves to play was almost taken from him. Its gonna light a fire under him and he's gonna be a different player." But no. Same Jeff as always. Except now, he's overpaid.
Did I mention we're committed to him for 4 years? At 36m? Ugh.
I think the intent on signing Jeff Green at Four Years 36 million was to have him replace Paul Pierce when he retires. He needs more time to feel comfortable about his increased role. I say hw breaks out Avery Bradley style in January.
I don't buy it with Green.
AB broke out his second year after he gained a little NBA experience and the Celtics work on his jump shot (got him to lean less)
Green has played how many season now, heavy minutes?
And it has been consistent play.
I just don't understand why Green is suddenly going to explode into a better player after all these years just because he is now on the Celtics.
exactly. He is an average player and has been for years. He isn't magically going to become Lebron.
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for signing jeff green more than anything else, or is it just me?
i just need to know im not alone in this :)
Absolutely. Danny actually had a pretty good offseason given our limited options, and then we sign Jeff for 4 years at $36m... Worst deal of the summer.
I've been one of Jeff's biggest defenders this season. I really thought, "this guy went through a life threatening event. The game he loves to play was almost taken from him. Its gonna light a fire under him and he's gonna be a different player." But no. Same Jeff as always. Except now, he's overpaid.
Did I mention we're committed to him for 4 years? At 36m? Ugh.
I think the intent on signing Jeff Green at Four Years 36 million was to have him replace Paul Pierce when he retires. He needs more time to feel comfortable about his increased role. I say hw breaks out Avery Bradley style in January.
I don't buy it with Green.
AB broke out his second year after he gained a little NBA experience and the Celtics work on his jump shot (got him to lean less)
Green has played how many season now, heavy minutes?
And it has been consistent play.
I just don't understand why Green is suddenly going to explode into a better player after all these years just because he is now on the Celtics.
exactly. He is an average player and has been for years. He isn't magically going to become Lebron.
While I agree with this, the player he was his whole career would still make this team much better IMO, and is probably not too far off from a $9 million per year player in todays NBA.
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Again, it is fine to say you are disappointed in him, but what EXACTLY would you have done differently this offseason?
We had basically no cap space. We acquired Jason Terry and Courtney Lee (moves almost everybody approved of at the time) using a mid-level exception and a sign-and-trade.
All the other signings were for own guys that allowed us to go over the cap. If you want to argue letting Bass go, then fine. If you want to argue letting Jeff Green go, then fine. Please explain how we add equal or better players with the limited cap space we had.
If you want to argue about the additions he made versus some other options (Jamal Crawford, or Ray) then fine. Please explain how Jamal Crawford dramatically alters the season thus far.
Danny added a play-now rookie in Sullinger with a pick in the early 20's. Maybe he could have added another play-now guy with the other pick instead of Melo. If you want to argue that, then fine. Explain what other rookie would have made a major difference that was selected after 21.
Even argue the Ray situation. Maybe losing Ray - and his knowledge of the team - was a bigger loss than we all thought at the time. Please explain how we could have avoided Ray going to Miami, when we offered him a contract, and he rejected it for less money.
My point with all of this is: if you are disappointed, please explain what Danny could have done that would have you otherwise not disappointed. If your sole disappointment comes from paying Jeff Green $9M per vs. whatever you magically think he would have accepted, then you are using him for a scapegoat for your true disappointment...
The play of the team, which is built on Rondo, KG, and Pierce.
off the top of my head i would have signed kirilenko instead of green - they are on similar money and kirilenko is playing out of his mind - which was absolutely foreseeable.
i sign matt barnes. very underated.
i trade paul pierce. i would have back then, even before all of this, but you prob wont believe me. i trade him to utah for paul milsap and kanter. if that doesnt work, i trade pierce all the same... perhaps to golden state for bogut (i know hes injured but he'll come good).
def do the courtney lee trade. def sign barbosa and jason terry. i ABSOLUTELY let jeff walk for the money he wants. i sign and trade bass for a rebounding center.
i take the same gamble on hasheem thabeet that okc did. i do whatever i need to do to get reggie evans, who is absurdly underated. and i trade off avery bradley during the draft with our 22nd pick and grab andre drummond (not necessarily at number 9 in the draft).
and i grab kg if he wants back.
so i at the least have:
pg - rondo, barbosa
sg - terry, lee
sf - kirilenko, barnes
pf - kg, sullinger, evans
c - bogut, drummond, thabeet
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I'm disappointed that the players we have perform way worse than their track record indicates.
which ones? Bass is shooting a bit worse, but everyone else is pretty much the player they have always been.
Well for starters Pierce is having one of his worst starts in his career. Without looking rondo deeply into it im sure the same could be said about Jason Terry as well. Let's not forget that Lee was also shooting 40% from 3 last year and is now below 30%.
Was this a serious comment?
Terry is actually much more efficient than he was last year (though is shooting and playing less so his totals are down a bit).
Lee's 3PT shooting is worse, but his overall FG% is better as are pretty much all of his other numbers over the prior season.
Pierce's FG% is lower, but his 3PT and FT% are about the same as are his totals and per minutes in virtually every other category (i.e. rebounds, assists, steals, points).
Rondo has actually improved pretty much across the board both in efficiency and totals.
Green per 36 is essentially the same across the board.
KG per 36 is pretty much the same as last year.
So yeah, I was serious. Apparently you just think because the team is worse it must mean the players are performing worse, which just isn't the case.
Yet another example of satistics being deceiving. I would think most people would agree the the Celtics biggest issue is they lack of defense this year. I don't know how to measure that but I will say Pierce, and KG, are both a year older and look quite a bit slower on the defensive end than they did last year. I didn't really watch much of Terry last year, but I have seen enough this year to know he can't guard anyone. I would have to say there has been a drop off on their play.
Green didn't play last year, so that's hard to judge. Rondo's D or lack of is pretty clear. To be honest the only one who's defense has been pretty good is Lee in my opinion.
As for the question, I was one of the people who was fairly happy whit the players Danny signed, so I'm not going to be an I told you so now. The one thing I had hoped for than and still do now is a big who can defend and rebound in the middle, but they are not easy to find and don't come cheap.
Boston's defense is worse because they let good defenders go in the off season and replaced them with guys who play terrible defense. Pietrus, Dooling, Stiemer, etc were all much better defenders than the guys that replaced them. Bradley (who has yet to play) is also a very strong defender. When you take away good defenders and put in crappy defenders, of course the overall defense of the team is worse. It also puts more pressure on the better defenders and thus worsens their defense as they have to cover more for others.
Dooling and Pietrus combined missed 60 games last year and played 14 and 20 min a game. Stiemsma played 13 min a game and missed 22 games.
Are you gonna start telling me that we are missing marquis now?
We were 5 min away from making the finals. Danny brought in more and better talent than they lost and according to you that talent is playing at or above their level. How can you blame Danny? If anything you have an issue with Doc or you think we could have somehow signed a superstar. Otherwise you'd rather just tank apparently.
Its kind of irrelevant anyway though since clearly his job nor this season is over yet. It actually has barely started
I said the players this year were playing at essentially the rate they were last year. I never said it was more or better talent or a better team. Bringing in a bunch of role players doesn't make your team better. It may make it deeper just not better.
Last year was a fluke and a result of key injuries to great players (like Rose, Horford, and Bosh). If Horford was healthy there is a good chance Boston loses to Atlanta (that series was vastly different the couple of hobbled games he played). Same thing with Rose and Chicago. I don't think Boston gets by Chicago with Rose and as is barely survived 8th seed Philadelphia. Once Miami got Bosh back that series was over. A fully healthy Bosh and it is a 5 game series. Boston wasn't a real contender but had a deep playoff run because of other teams misfortunes. That run tricked a lot of fans into believe Boston was closer to a title than it was. The reality is Boston is a long way away from a title and the past off season made it even farther away because it took away all short term flexibility. Boston has no real way to get better this summer either and is stuck with this team for awhile.
once miami got bosh back the series was over? umm miami beat us two times without bosh. We beat them with bosh in game 5 and took a 3-2 lead. lebum won game 6 single handedly. bosh was not a factor until late in game 7.
bottom line is injuries are part of the game. we had them also. but nobody makes excuses for us though right? I am sure miami was saying yeah the C's had no bench and a bunch of geriatric hurt guys so this win really does not count right? ::) ::)
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for signing jeff green more than anything else, or is it just me?
i just need to know im not alone in this :)
Absolutely. Danny actually had a pretty good offseason given our limited options, and then we sign Jeff for 4 years at $36m... Worst deal of the summer.
I've been one of Jeff's biggest defenders this season. I really thought, "this guy went through a life threatening event. The game he loves to play was almost taken from him. Its gonna light a fire under him and he's gonna be a different player." But no. Same Jeff as always. Except now, he's overpaid.
Did I mention we're committed to him for 4 years? At 36m? Ugh.
I think the intent on signing Jeff Green at Four Years 36 million was to have him replace Paul Pierce when he retires. He needs more time to feel comfortable about his increased role. I say hw breaks out Avery Bradley style in January.
I don't buy it with Green.
AB broke out his second year after he gained a little NBA experience and the Celtics work on his jump shot (got him to lean less)
Green has played how many season now, heavy minutes?
And it has been consistent play.
I just don't understand why Green is suddenly going to explode into a better player after all these years just because he is now on the Celtics.
exactly. He is an average player and has been for years. He isn't magically going to become Lebron.
While I agree with this, the player he was his whole career would still make this team much better IMO, and is probably not too far off from a $9 million per year player in todays NBA.
He is that player. His numbers are virtually the same on a per minute basis and his shooting numbers are right about his career averages.
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for signing jeff green more than anything else, or is it just me?
i just need to know im not alone in this :)
Absolutely. Danny actually had a pretty good offseason given our limited options, and then we sign Jeff for 4 years at $36m... Worst deal of the summer.
I've been one of Jeff's biggest defenders this season. I really thought, "this guy went through a life threatening event. The game he loves to play was almost taken from him. Its gonna light a fire under him and he's gonna be a different player." But no. Same Jeff as always. Except now, he's overpaid.
Did I mention we're committed to him for 4 years? At 36m? Ugh.
I think the intent on signing Jeff Green at Four Years 36 million was to have him replace Paul Pierce when he retires. He needs more time to feel comfortable about his increased role. I say hw breaks out Avery Bradley style in January.
I don't buy it with Green.
AB broke out his second year after he gained a little NBA experience and the Celtics work on his jump shot (got him to lean less)
Green has played how many season now, heavy minutes?
And it has been consistent play.
I just don't understand why Green is suddenly going to explode into a better player after all these years just because he is now on the Celtics.
exactly. He is an average player and has been for years. He isn't magically going to become Lebron.
While I agree with this, the player he was his whole career would still make this team much better IMO, and is probably not too far off from a $9 million per year player in todays NBA.
He is that player. His numbers are virtually the same on a per minute basis and his shooting numbers are right about his career averages.
That's true. The only difference is he was much more consistent from game to game in OKC. He hasn't reached that consistency in Boston, which has been the biggest problem. You don't know if he is going to be assertive or completely disappear from game to game.
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I'm disappointed that the players we have perform way worse than their track record indicates.
which ones? Bass is shooting a bit worse, but everyone else is pretty much the player they have always been.
Well for starters Pierce is having one of his worst starts in his career. Without looking rondo deeply into it im sure the same could be said about Jason Terry as well. Let's not forget that Lee was also shooting 40% from 3 last year and is now below 30%.
Was this a serious comment?
Terry is actually much more efficient than he was last year (though is shooting and playing less so his totals are down a bit).
Lee's 3PT shooting is worse, but his overall FG% is better as are pretty much all of his other numbers over the prior season.
Pierce's FG% is lower, but his 3PT and FT% are about the same as are his totals and per minutes in virtually every other category (i.e. rebounds, assists, steals, points).
Rondo has actually improved pretty much across the board both in efficiency and totals.
Green per 36 is essentially the same across the board.
KG per 36 is pretty much the same as last year.
So yeah, I was serious. Apparently you just think because the team is worse it must mean the players are performing worse, which just isn't the case.
Yet another example of satistics being deceiving. I would think most people would agree the the Celtics biggest issue is they lack of defense this year. I don't know how to measure that but I will say Pierce, and KG, are both a year older and look quite a bit slower on the defensive end than they did last year. I didn't really watch much of Terry last year, but I have seen enough this year to know he can't guard anyone. I would have to say there has been a drop off on their play.
Green didn't play last year, so that's hard to judge. Rondo's D or lack of is pretty clear. To be honest the only one who's defense has been pretty good is Lee in my opinion.
As for the question, I was one of the people who was fairly happy whit the players Danny signed, so I'm not going to be an I told you so now. The one thing I had hoped for than and still do now is a big who can defend and rebound in the middle, but they are not easy to find and don't come cheap.
Boston's defense is worse because they let good defenders go in the off season and replaced them with guys who play terrible defense. Pietrus, Dooling, Stiemer, etc were all much better defenders than the guys that replaced them. Bradley (who has yet to play) is also a very strong defender. When you take away good defenders and put in crappy defenders, of course the overall defense of the team is worse. It also puts more pressure on the better defenders and thus worsens their defense as they have to cover more for others.
Dooling and Pietrus combined missed 60 games last year and played 14 and 20 min a game. Stiemsma played 13 min a game and missed 22 games.
Are you gonna start telling me that we are missing marquis now?
We were 5 min away from making the finals. Danny brought in more and better talent than they lost and according to you that talent is playing at or above their level. How can you blame Danny? If anything you have an issue with Doc or you think we could have somehow signed a superstar. Otherwise you'd rather just tank apparently.
Its kind of irrelevant anyway though since clearly his job nor this season is over yet. It actually has barely started
I said the players this year were playing at essentially the rate they were last year. I never said it was more or better talent or a better team. Bringing in a bunch of role players doesn't make your team better. It may make it deeper just not better.
Last year was a fluke and a result of key injuries to great players (like Rose, Horford, and Bosh). If Horford was healthy there is a good chance Boston loses to Atlanta (that series was vastly different the couple of hobbled games he played). Same thing with Rose and Chicago. I don't think Boston gets by Chicago with Rose and as is barely survived 8th seed Philadelphia. Once Miami got Bosh back that series was over. A fully healthy Bosh and it is a 5 game series. Boston wasn't a real contender but had a deep playoff run because of other teams misfortunes. That run tricked a lot of fans into believe Boston was closer to a title than it was. The reality is Boston is a long way away from a title and the past off season made it even farther away because it took away all short term flexibility. Boston has no real way to get better this summer either and is stuck with this team for awhile.
once miami got bosh back the series was over? umm miami beat us two times without bosh. We beat them with bosh in game 5 and took a 3-2 lead. lebum won game 6 single handedly. bosh was not a factor until late in game 7.
bottom line is injuries are part of the game. we had them also. but nobody makes excuses for us though right? I am sure miami was saying yeah the C's had no bench and a bunch of geriatric hurt guys so this win really does not count right? ::) ::)
Bosh's first game back doesn't count, he was far from his normal self and wasn't all that close to normal at all in games 6 or 7 either. He was however the difference in that series once he came back. He gave Miami an interior presence they were lacking and provided solid defense on KG, something else they were lacking. The same can be said of Horford in the Atlanta series. If Horford was healthier, Atlanta probably beats Boston. Chicago probably would have beaten Boston even without Rose, they just couldn't get by Philly without Rose.
And sure Boston had injuries, to bench players, not to a top 20ish (or better) players in the league (like Atlanta, Chicago, and Miami).
My point is, Boston's run last year was clearly a fluke. This team just isn't a contender and the role players signed by Boston this summer were never going to put the team over the top. It was a pipe dream and thus those role players never should have been signed for the years or dollars they were signed for. Total and utter failure of an off season.
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for signing jeff green more than anything else, or is it just me?
i just need to know im not alone in this :)
Absolutely. Danny actually had a pretty good offseason given our limited options, and then we sign Jeff for 4 years at $36m... Worst deal of the summer.
I've been one of Jeff's biggest defenders this season. I really thought, "this guy went through a life threatening event. The game he loves to play was almost taken from him. Its gonna light a fire under him and he's gonna be a different player." But no. Same Jeff as always. Except now, he's overpaid.
Did I mention we're committed to him for 4 years? At 36m? Ugh.
I think the intent on signing Jeff Green at Four Years 36 million was to have him replace Paul Pierce when he retires. He needs more time to feel comfortable about his increased role. I say hw breaks out Avery Bradley style in January.
I don't buy it with Green.
AB broke out his second year after he gained a little NBA experience and the Celtics work on his jump shot (got him to lean less)
Green has played how many season now, heavy minutes?
And it has been consistent play.
I just don't understand why Green is suddenly going to explode into a better player after all these years just because he is now on the Celtics.
exactly. He is an average player and has been for years. He isn't magically going to become Lebron.
While I agree with this, the player he was his whole career would still make this team much better IMO, and is probably not too far off from a $9 million per year player in todays NBA.
He is that player. His numbers are virtually the same on a per minute basis and his shooting numbers are right about his career averages.
That's true. The only difference is he was much more consistent from game to game in OKC. He hasn't reached that consistency in Boston, which has been the biggest problem. You don't know if he is going to be assertive or completely disappear from game to game.
He has been pretty consistent the last three weeks or so (obviously he was pretty bad against Chicago, but that is a clear outlier).
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for signing jeff green more than anything else, or is it just me?
i just need to know im not alone in this :)
Absolutely. Danny actually had a pretty good offseason given our limited options, and then we sign Jeff for 4 years at $36m... Worst deal of the summer.
I've been one of Jeff's biggest defenders this season. I really thought, "this guy went through a life threatening event. The game he loves to play was almost taken from him. Its gonna light a fire under him and he's gonna be a different player." But no. Same Jeff as always. Except now, he's overpaid.
Did I mention we're committed to him for 4 years? At 36m? Ugh.
I think the intent on signing Jeff Green at Four Years 36 million was to have him replace Paul Pierce when he retires. He needs more time to feel comfortable about his increased role. I say hw breaks out Avery Bradley style in January.
I don't buy it with Green.
AB broke out his second year after he gained a little NBA experience and the Celtics work on his jump shot (got him to lean less)
Green has played how many season now, heavy minutes?
And it has been consistent play.
I just don't understand why Green is suddenly going to explode into a better player after all these years just because he is now on the Celtics.
exactly. He is an average player and has been for years. He isn't magically going to become Lebron.
While I agree with this, the player he was his whole career would still make this team much better IMO, and is probably not too far off from a $9 million per year player in todays NBA.
He is that player. His numbers are virtually the same on a per minute basis and his shooting numbers are right about his career averages.
That's true. The only difference is he was much more consistent from game to game in OKC. He hasn't reached that consistency in Boston, which has been the biggest problem. You don't know if he is going to be assertive or completely disappear from game to game.
He has been pretty consistent the last three weeks or so (obviously he was pretty bad against Chicago, but that is a clear outlier).
Oh yeah. I think the Green we have seen the last 3 weeks has been what they expected...and pretty much what they paid for (although they certainly hoped for more). It was the beginning of the season that I think was a bit of an aberation.
Over the last 3 weeks (well, I rounded it off to in December, for ease of stat finding), he is averaging 12.3 points, 4.3 rebounds in 25 minutes, shooting 50% from 3 (this is a bit of an aberation, but doesn't affect things that much), 46% from the field.
Not what you WANT from a $9 million man, but not far from what you would probably expect from that.
And if someone did need a scoring wing, and had a starting job, those numbers probably are pretty attractive. He is not going to be a star, but if he is playing 35 minutes a night, and putting up say, 16 points and 6 rebounds, that is decent value.
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I'm disappointed that the players we have perform way worse than their track record indicates.
which ones? Bass is shooting a bit worse, but everyone else is pretty much the player they have always been.
Well for starters Pierce is having one of his worst starts in his career. Without looking rondo deeply into it im sure the same could be said about Jason Terry as well. Let's not forget that Lee was also shooting 40% from 3 last year and is now below 30%.
Was this a serious comment?
Terry is actually much more efficient than he was last year (though is shooting and playing less so his totals are down a bit).
Lee's 3PT shooting is worse, but his overall FG% is better as are pretty much all of his other numbers over the prior season.
Pierce's FG% is lower, but his 3PT and FT% are about the same as are his totals and per minutes in virtually every other category (i.e. rebounds, assists, steals, points).
Rondo has actually improved pretty much across the board both in efficiency and totals.
Green per 36 is essentially the same across the board.
KG per 36 is pretty much the same as last year.
So yeah, I was serious. Apparently you just think because the team is worse it must mean the players are performing worse, which just isn't the case.
Yet another example of satistics being deceiving. I would think most people would agree the the Celtics biggest issue is they lack of defense this year. I don't know how to measure that but I will say Pierce, and KG, are both a year older and look quite a bit slower on the defensive end than they did last year. I didn't really watch much of Terry last year, but I have seen enough this year to know he can't guard anyone. I would have to say there has been a drop off on their play.
Green didn't play last year, so that's hard to judge. Rondo's D or lack of is pretty clear. To be honest the only one who's defense has been pretty good is Lee in my opinion.
As for the question, I was one of the people who was fairly happy whit the players Danny signed, so I'm not going to be an I told you so now. The one thing I had hoped for than and still do now is a big who can defend and rebound in the middle, but they are not easy to find and don't come cheap.
Boston's defense is worse because they let good defenders go in the off season and replaced them with guys who play terrible defense. Pietrus, Dooling, Stiemer, etc were all much better defenders than the guys that replaced them. Bradley (who has yet to play) is also a very strong defender. When you take away good defenders and put in crappy defenders, of course the overall defense of the team is worse. It also puts more pressure on the better defenders and thus worsens their defense as they have to cover more for others.
Dooling and Pietrus combined missed 60 games last year and played 14 and 20 min a game. Stiemsma played 13 min a game and missed 22 games.
Are you gonna start telling me that we are missing marquis now?
We were 5 min away from making the finals. Danny brought in more and better talent than they lost and according to you that talent is playing at or above their level. How can you blame Danny? If anything you have an issue with Doc or you think we could have somehow signed a superstar. Otherwise you'd rather just tank apparently.
Its kind of irrelevant anyway though since clearly his job nor this season is over yet. It actually has barely started
I said the players this year were playing at essentially the rate they were last year. I never said it was more or better talent or a better team. Bringing in a bunch of role players doesn't make your team better. It may make it deeper just not better.
Last year was a fluke and a result of key injuries to great players (like Rose, Horford, and Bosh). If Horford was healthy there is a good chance Boston loses to Atlanta (that series was vastly different the couple of hobbled games he played). Same thing with Rose and Chicago. I don't think Boston gets by Chicago with Rose and as is barely survived 8th seed Philadelphia. Once Miami got Bosh back that series was over. A fully healthy Bosh and it is a 5 game series. Boston wasn't a real contender but had a deep playoff run because of other teams misfortunes. That run tricked a lot of fans into believe Boston was closer to a title than it was. The reality is Boston is a long way away from a title and the past off season made it even farther away because it took away all short term flexibility. Boston has no real way to get better this summer either and is stuck with this team for awhile.
I'm sorry, but saying that the success of a team that has won one title, two conference titles, and been conferences finalists three times over a five year span is a fluke, well, that's ridiculous.
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If Jeff Green or Brandon Bass wouldn't take a 1 year contract then you let them walk. You don't give a lot of years and big money to easily replaceable role players, which is exactly what Bass and Green are and is exactly what the C's did and should not have done.
Given the Celtics cap situation, you'd probably be replacing them with the SF and PF equivalents of Jason Collins.
Barbosa signed late. Martin is available. Birdman is available. Pietrus was available. All better options than destroying cap space on mediocre players.
How much cap space do you think we'll have with the big three on the books?
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Danny can't play for them or coach them. I think we were ok with the team at least many were prior to the season. You can't beat father time though....
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If Jeff Green or Brandon Bass wouldn't take a 1 year contract then you let them walk. You don't give a lot of years and big money to easily replaceable role players, which is exactly what Bass and Green are and is exactly what the C's did and should not have done.
Given the Celtics cap situation, you'd probably be replacing them with the SF and PF equivalents of Jason Collins.
Barbosa signed late. Martin is available. Birdman is available. Pietrus was available. All better options than destroying cap space on mediocre players.
Knowing now that Barbosa was available for the minimum, I would have retained the MLE and split it between Pietrus and Stiemsma instead of spending it on Terry. Wouldn't have bothered with the Lee trade.
We were kind of stuck with Green though. We needed a combo forward and his agent took us for everything he could get. Would have preferred a Bass sign and trade too, for someone on a shorter deal.
That way we'd have role players on expirings/short-term deals heading into the deadline. Oh well.
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If Jeff Green or Brandon Bass wouldn't take a 1 year contract then you let them walk. You don't give a lot of years and big money to easily replaceable role players, which is exactly what Bass and Green are and is exactly what the C's did and should not have done.
Given the Celtics cap situation, you'd probably be replacing them with the SF and PF equivalents of Jason Collins.
Barbosa signed late. Martin is available. Birdman is available. Pietrus was available. All better options than destroying cap space on mediocre players.
How much cap space do you think we'll have with the big three on the books?
The Big 3 wouldn't have been on the books, just Pierce and Rondo, both of which expire in another year.
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I'm disappointed that the players we have perform way worse than their track record indicates.
which ones? Bass is shooting a bit worse, but everyone else is pretty much the player they have always been.
Well for starters Pierce is having one of his worst starts in his career. Without looking rondo deeply into it im sure the same could be said about Jason Terry as well. Let's not forget that Lee was also shooting 40% from 3 last year and is now below 30%.
Was this a serious comment?
Terry is actually much more efficient than he was last year (though is shooting and playing less so his totals are down a bit).
Lee's 3PT shooting is worse, but his overall FG% is better as are pretty much all of his other numbers over the prior season.
Pierce's FG% is lower, but his 3PT and FT% are about the same as are his totals and per minutes in virtually every other category (i.e. rebounds, assists, steals, points).
Rondo has actually improved pretty much across the board both in efficiency and totals.
Green per 36 is essentially the same across the board.
KG per 36 is pretty much the same as last year.
So yeah, I was serious. Apparently you just think because the team is worse it must mean the players are performing worse, which just isn't the case.
Yet another example of satistics being deceiving. I would think most people would agree the the Celtics biggest issue is they lack of defense this year. I don't know how to measure that but I will say Pierce, and KG, are both a year older and look quite a bit slower on the defensive end than they did last year. I didn't really watch much of Terry last year, but I have seen enough this year to know he can't guard anyone. I would have to say there has been a drop off on their play.
Green didn't play last year, so that's hard to judge. Rondo's D or lack of is pretty clear. To be honest the only one who's defense has been pretty good is Lee in my opinion.
As for the question, I was one of the people who was fairly happy whit the players Danny signed, so I'm not going to be an I told you so now. The one thing I had hoped for than and still do now is a big who can defend and rebound in the middle, but they are not easy to find and don't come cheap.
Boston's defense is worse because they let good defenders go in the off season and replaced them with guys who play terrible defense. Pietrus, Dooling, Stiemer, etc were all much better defenders than the guys that replaced them. Bradley (who has yet to play) is also a very strong defender. When you take away good defenders and put in crappy defenders, of course the overall defense of the team is worse. It also puts more pressure on the better defenders and thus worsens their defense as they have to cover more for others.
Dooling and Pietrus combined missed 60 games last year and played 14 and 20 min a game. Stiemsma played 13 min a game and missed 22 games.
Are you gonna start telling me that we are missing marquis now?
We were 5 min away from making the finals. Danny brought in more and better talent than they lost and according to you that talent is playing at or above their level. How can you blame Danny? If anything you have an issue with Doc or you think we could have somehow signed a superstar. Otherwise you'd rather just tank apparently.
Its kind of irrelevant anyway though since clearly his job nor this season is over yet. It actually has barely started
I said the players this year were playing at essentially the rate they were last year. I never said it was more or better talent or a better team. Bringing in a bunch of role players doesn't make your team better. It may make it deeper just not better.
Last year was a fluke and a result of key injuries to great players (like Rose, Horford, and Bosh). If Horford was healthy there is a good chance Boston loses to Atlanta (that series was vastly different the couple of hobbled games he played). Same thing with Rose and Chicago. I don't think Boston gets by Chicago with Rose and as is barely survived 8th seed Philadelphia. Once Miami got Bosh back that series was over. A fully healthy Bosh and it is a 5 game series. Boston wasn't a real contender but had a deep playoff run because of other teams misfortunes. That run tricked a lot of fans into believe Boston was closer to a title than it was. The reality is Boston is a long way away from a title and the past off season made it even farther away because it took away all short term flexibility. Boston has no real way to get better this summer either and is stuck with this team for awhile.
I'm sorry, but saying that the success of a team that has won one title, two conference titles, and been conferences finalists three times over a five year span is a fluke, well, that's ridiculous.
I didn't say that at all. Good job on the reading comprehension.
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If Jeff Green or Brandon Bass wouldn't take a 1 year contract then you let them walk. You don't give a lot of years and big money to easily replaceable role players, which is exactly what Bass and Green are and is exactly what the C's did and should not have done.
Given the Celtics cap situation, you'd probably be replacing them with the SF and PF equivalents of Jason Collins.
Barbosa signed late. Martin is available. Birdman is available. Pietrus was available. All better options than destroying cap space on mediocre players.
How much cap space do you think we'll have with the big three on the books?
The Big 3 wouldn't have been on the books, just Pierce and Rondo, both of which expire in another year.
So you're pushing for an indeterminate amount of time in the lottery? Awesome.
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If Jeff Green or Brandon Bass wouldn't take a 1 year contract then you let them walk. You don't give a lot of years and big money to easily replaceable role players, which is exactly what Bass and Green are and is exactly what the C's did and should not have done.
Given the Celtics cap situation, you'd probably be replacing them with the SF and PF equivalents of Jason Collins.
Barbosa signed late. Martin is available. Birdman is available. Pietrus was available. All better options than destroying cap space on mediocre players.
How much cap space do you think we'll have with the big three on the books?
The Big 3 wouldn't have been on the books, just Pierce and Rondo, both of which expire in another year.
So you're pushing for an indeterminate amount of time in the lottery? Awesome.
Not at all. I would have signed everyone to 1 year deals and made another free agent run after this season. I was pretty clear in what I would have done in this thread and throughout threads on this board. Don't put words in my mouth and make crap up because you are too lazy to read my posts.
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If Jeff Green or Brandon Bass wouldn't take a 1 year contract then you let them walk. You don't give a lot of years and big money to easily replaceable role players, which is exactly what Bass and Green are and is exactly what the C's did and should not have done.
Given the Celtics cap situation, you'd probably be replacing them with the SF and PF equivalents of Jason Collins.
Barbosa signed late. Martin is available. Birdman is available. Pietrus was available. All better options than destroying cap space on mediocre players.
How much cap space do you think we'll have with the big three on the books?
The Big 3 wouldn't have been on the books, just Pierce and Rondo, both of which expire in another year.
So you're pushing for an indeterminate amount of time in the lottery? Awesome.
Not at all. I would have signed everyone to 1 year deals and made another free agent run after this season. I was pretty clear in what I would have done in this thread and throughout threads on this board. Don't put words in my mouth and make crap up because you are too lazy to read my posts.
I would have loved that, but thats easier said than done. If Danny had held firm at 1 year deals, I think we would be fighting for lottery balls right now, because we wouldn't have been able to sign most of the guys we did.
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If Jeff Green or Brandon Bass wouldn't take a 1 year contract then you let them walk. You don't give a lot of years and big money to easily replaceable role players, which is exactly what Bass and Green are and is exactly what the C's did and should not have done.
Given the Celtics cap situation, you'd probably be replacing them with the SF and PF equivalents of Jason Collins.
Barbosa signed late. Martin is available. Birdman is available. Pietrus was available. All better options than destroying cap space on mediocre players.
How much cap space do you think we'll have with the big three on the books?
The Big 3 wouldn't have been on the books, just Pierce and Rondo, both of which expire in another year.
So you're pushing for an indeterminate amount of time in the lottery? Awesome.
Not at all. I would have signed everyone to 1 year deals and made another free agent run after this season. I was pretty clear in what I would have done in this thread and throughout threads on this board. Don't put words in my mouth and make crap up because you are too lazy to read my posts.
I would have loved that, but thats easier said than done. If Danny had held firm at 1 year deals, I think we would be fighting for lottery balls right now, because we wouldn't have been able to sign most of the guys we did.
We are fighting for lottery balls right now as is, though (Boston is the 8th seed and just 1 game ahead of 9). I think KG and Green probably would have signed 1 year deals for the right dollars. Guys like Bass, Terry, and Lee are easily replaceable pieces and wouldn't have been any great loss (you know Barbosa, Pietrus, Birdman, and K-Mart would have all been fine replacements and all likely could have been had for less money and less years).
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If Jeff Green or Brandon Bass wouldn't take a 1 year contract then you let them walk. You don't give a lot of years and big money to easily replaceable role players, which is exactly what Bass and Green are and is exactly what the C's did and should not have done.
Given the Celtics cap situation, you'd probably be replacing them with the SF and PF equivalents of Jason Collins.
Barbosa signed late. Martin is available. Birdman is available. Pietrus was available. All better options than destroying cap space on mediocre players.
How much cap space do you think we'll have with the big three on the books?
The Big 3 wouldn't have been on the books, just Pierce and Rondo, both of which expire in another year.
So you're pushing for an indeterminate amount of time in the lottery? Awesome.
Not at all. I would have signed everyone to 1 year deals and made another free agent run after this season. I was pretty clear in what I would have done in this thread and throughout threads on this board. Don't put words in my mouth and make crap up because you are too lazy to read my posts.
Ok, going back and reading a couple of your posts, your "plan" was to offer the players contracts that we have no reason to believe that they would have accepted. What if KG doesn't want a one year deal? You've got Rondo, Pierce and no good big man, so that's probably either a 7-8 seed or a late lottery pick. What if KG signs but Bass and Green both leave? You've got a pretty high payroll but not enough depth to be solid contenders.
This year was kind of an "in for a penny, in for a pound" off-season. If you don't sign KG you really need to unload PP and rebuild. If you keep KG you can't really let Bass and Green walk because you don't have the means to replace them and Ray. And there's no evidence that any of those three players (especially Bass and Green) would have signed for short deals.