Celtics Blog Forums

Celtics Basketball => Celtics Talk => Topic started by: Fred Roberts on November 28, 2012, 09:35:23 PM

Title: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Fred Roberts on November 28, 2012, 09:35:23 PM
I think, at the vet minimum, admitting that we missed on Blatche is the easiest call of the year. This team desperately needed a legit 7 footer behind KG to get boards and have a presence in the post.

Blatche (even with whatever baggage there is) was sitting out there for weeks for the taking. Young, tall, talented for vet min $.

Here he is tonight grabbing boards and posting a double double on us. He's a contributor on a pretty good Nets team. The Celts could really use that to keep KG fresh, and not have a tremendous drop off.

We are simply too short or un-athletic in the post outside of KG in certain match ups. Wish we had him.

[I did hope that we got some of this w/ Darko, but that's another story.]
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: PhoSita on November 28, 2012, 09:37:10 PM
Well, normally I would say despite Blatche's production, it made sense because the Celtics prioritize defense and Blatche has never been good at that.

But the Celtics aren't exactly getting great defense out of their bench so far this season, so at the least they could do to have somebody who can rebound.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Atzar on November 28, 2012, 09:37:21 PM
Hindsight is 20/20.  He was (and still is) just as likely to be a problem as he is an asset.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: wdleehi on November 28, 2012, 09:47:55 PM
Nope.



He is still the same knucklehead. He just hasn't done anything yet this season.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: CelticG1 on November 28, 2012, 09:54:03 PM
Nope.



He is still the same knucklehead. He just hasn't done anything yet this season.

I think you are in denial. Surely he would be better than an empty roster spot...
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Kane3387 on November 28, 2012, 10:04:19 PM
Yeah it was a low risk move. I think doc really disliked him. I wanted him though. Too bad we didn't get him and a rival did.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: alajet on November 28, 2012, 10:05:32 PM
I'd rather pick up a naturally talented knucklehead rather than Jason Collins the nice guy.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Fafnir on November 28, 2012, 10:06:38 PM
Given the stupid comments about the Wizards he just has he's still the same immature jerk as he has always been. He's put up some numbers before, but he's not someone you can count on to contribute.

The worst part of players like him, is that if you don't play him regular minutes he'll completely check out on the team.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: European NBA fan on November 28, 2012, 10:13:09 PM
I hate the guy. But I have to admit that he looks like the pick up of the year so far.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: cltc5 on November 28, 2012, 10:28:35 PM
who gives a crap if he's a knuckle head.  He's a young big who can ball.  We done and didnt have room to be picky.  Shoulda jumped and seen what happened
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Celts Fan 92 on November 28, 2012, 10:33:58 PM
yea man real salty we didnt take a chance on Blatche especially wit Darko dippin out 1st month of da season
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: wdleehi on November 29, 2012, 06:58:26 AM
Nope.



He is still the same knucklehead. He just hasn't done anything yet this season.

I think you are in denial. Surely he would be better than an empty roster spot...


No.  I had to watch him living in the DC area.  Guys like this tease their fans by playing well and behaving well for stints, but eventually, they knucklehead up.


Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Yoki_IsTheName on November 29, 2012, 07:26:54 AM
We missed on him. So as the Spurs who were "reportedly" interested in acquiring him.

But man, we probably would've made his career worse since Doc is not playing the bigs.

I for one believed that a change of scenery is what Dray needed. Well, he still has some knuckle head off court things i can tell you that, but he's been playing well.

Nope.



He is still the same knucklehead. He just hasn't done anything yet this season.

I think you are in denial. Surely he would be better than an empty roster spot...


No.  I had to watch him living in the DC area.  Guys like this tease their fans by playing well and behaving well for stints, but eventually, they knucklehead up.


Im holding off judgment on that. He did however made a bonehead comment about his former team. There might be something in what he said but he shouldn't have said that in public. Outside of that, I've never heard of Lap Dance Tuesdays anymore, lack of effort and everything that he's being told during his days in DC. You might be right Commish, but i'll hold off judgment until he "knuckle head" up again.

But still, he's looking like a great pickup. And we missed on that. I mean, he's doing great in Brooklyn, I'm pretty sure that with a veteran laden team like ours, he would be kept in check. That and his effort to come back.

Quote
@Celticsblog has @DrayBaltche on the Forums page again. Ya'll prolly thinking I should be in your lineup? Well, chowders are pretty ayt but I'd rather be chillin with my cheese steaks #Baltche #Celtics #Nets #Bounceback #Notoverweightanymore
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: celtsfan84 on November 29, 2012, 07:34:49 AM
He's put up some numbers before, but he's not someone you can count on to contribute.

The worst part of players like him, is that if you don't play him regular minutes he'll completely check out on the team.

So like Darko, except with NBA level talent.  Understood.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: pearljammer10 on November 29, 2012, 08:20:32 AM
Nope.



He is still the same knucklehead. He just hasn't done anything yet this season.

I think you are in denial. Surely he would be better than an empty roster spot...

I would much prefer the empty roster spot over Blatche. He is still a bum and always will be. Yes he had a good game last night against a team that didnt show up, but it could have been even better but he missed 3 wide open layups and made some careless plays and dumb fouls.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Moranis on November 29, 2012, 08:29:58 AM
Nope.



He is still the same knucklehead. He just hasn't done anything yet this season.

I think you are in denial. Surely he would be better than an empty roster spot...


No.  I had to watch him living in the DC area.  Guys like this tease their fans by playing well and behaving well for stints, but eventually, they knucklehead up.
maybe he was a knucklehead because he was on the Wizards and they are all knuckleheads without veteran leadership and a coaching staff that lets them do it.  Javelle McGee seems to be a vastly different player away from Washington.  Maybe all Blatche needed was to get away.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Chris on November 29, 2012, 08:53:22 AM
Blatche has been good.  Although his public complaining and excuse making about the Wizards doesn't give me much confidence that you can rely on him not to be a headcase in the longrun. 

Not to mention, I just am not sure how well he would have reacted to playing with KG (or vice versa).  The Nets are kind of embracing the bad boy image, and he is fitting in well with that, but on the C's, I think a lot of the stuff he does wouldn't go over nearly as well.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: wdleehi on November 29, 2012, 09:19:42 AM
Nope.



He is still the same knucklehead. He just hasn't done anything yet this season.

I think you are in denial. Surely he would be better than an empty roster spot...


No.  I had to watch him living in the DC area.  Guys like this tease their fans by playing well and behaving well for stints, but eventually, they knucklehead up.
maybe he was a knucklehead because he was on the Wizards and they are all knuckleheads without veteran leadership and a coaching staff that lets them do it.  Javelle McGee seems to be a vastly different player away from Washington.  Maybe all Blatche needed was to get away.


McGee was immature.  Maybe the right coach can fix that.  He can be basketball dumb on the court.



Blatche is full blown knucklehead.  He is the one coaches bench for the lack of defense.  He is the one that heads to AC when the coach suspends him, and proudly tweets about it.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: CelticG1 on November 29, 2012, 09:24:42 AM
Nope.



He is still the same knucklehead. He just hasn't done anything yet this season.

I think you are in denial. Surely he would be better than an empty roster spot...

I would much prefer the empty roster spot over Blatche. He is still a bum and always will be. Yes he had a good game last night against a team that didnt show up, but it could have been even better but he missed 3 wide open layups and made some careless plays and dumb fouls.

Come on man. What Blatche did last night is probably more than Collins will bring at any point in the season.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: SHAQATTACK on November 29, 2012, 09:28:45 AM
We need big Physical players like Cousins and Gortat to fill the paint.   KG is too old and skinny and unwilling to get killed at his age and I don't blame him.

Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Yoki_IsTheName on November 29, 2012, 09:29:53 AM
Nope.



He is still the same knucklehead. He just hasn't done anything yet this season.

I think you are in denial. Surely he would be better than an empty roster spot...

I would much prefer the empty roster spot over Blatche. He is still a bum and always will be. Yes he had a good game last night against a team that didnt show up, but it could have been even better but he missed 3 wide open layups and made some careless plays and dumb fouls.

All players make careless plays and dumb fouls.

I don't know man, but I'd rather have that bum's 9 points, 5 rebounds, 45% shooting in 17 minutes over an empty roster spot, heck, over Collins.

The man is on a mission to fix his NBA image. Yes that Washington thing and bashing them was dumb but nothing really happened other than that. He lost weight, he's not lazy on the defensive end anymore and he's playing really good basketball in that role.

And we can't use the "well of course he's playing good, he's under a non guaranteed contract" excuse. Washington is still paying his previous contract. He will make 7 million even if he doesn't play. This man is really realizing how much he wasted and is now trying to fix it.

I believe we any let that image of his out of our head. But hey, so far outside of one dumb move he's been good.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: CelticG1 on November 29, 2012, 09:34:54 AM
I think its a complete joke that people are stillin denial about this Blatche thing. He was extremely low risk high reward guy. If it was that big a deal we could have cut him like Darko.

If you are going to hate on Blatche forever than just admit it. There are some people that hate Varejao, pau Gasol, kobe and wouldn't ever want them on the C's but at least they admit they are being irrational.

Give ne a break Sheed wasn't the biggest friggen knucklehead? Zach Randolph wasn't? Mayne they didn't verbatim say and do identical things to Blatche but they are insane knuckleheads.

People still faun over Delonte West and were when he was on this team punching guys in the face. So hypocritical.

Oh yeah big baby knucklehead.

The way some of you talk about blatche makes it seem like you don't even think he's good enough for your ymca league.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Yoki_IsTheName on November 29, 2012, 09:35:25 AM
Nope.



He is still the same knucklehead. He just hasn't done anything yet this season.

I think you are in denial. Surely he would be better than an empty roster spot...


No.  I had to watch him living in the DC area.  Guys like this tease their fans by playing well and behaving well for stints, but eventually, they knucklehead up.
maybe he was a knucklehead because he was on the Wizards and they are all knuckleheads without veteran leadership and a coaching staff that lets them do it.  Javelle McGee seems to be a vastly different player away from Washington.  Maybe all Blatche needed was to get away.


McGee was immature.  Maybe the right coach can fix that.  He can be basketball dumb on the court.



Blatche is full blown knucklehead.  He is the one coaches bench for the lack of defense.  He is the one that heads to AC when the coach suspends him, and proudly tweets about it.

Commish, Avery Johnson seems to not have a problem with him. He WAS all you said. And he can still be, he was amnestied, he gets paid by Wahington, playing or not. he could have Lap Dance Tuesdays and Donut Shop galore all day, and yet there he is playing good, in shape, giving effort. He's trying to fix his NBA image. I believe this realize his mistake.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Yoki_IsTheName on November 29, 2012, 09:39:54 AM
I think its a complete joke that people are stillin denial about this Blatche thing. He was extremely low risk high reward guy. If it was that big a deal we could have cut him like Darko.

If you are going to hate on Blatche forever than just admit it. There are some people that hate Varejao, pau Gasol, kobe and wouldn't ever want them on the C's but at least they admit they are being irrational.

Give ne a break Sheed wasn't the biggest friggen knucklehead? Zach Randolph wasn't? Mayne they didn't verbatim say and do identical things to Blatche but they are insane knuckleheads.

People still faun over Delonte West and were when he was on this team punching guys in the face. So hypocritical.

Oh yeah big baby knucklehead.

The way some of you talk about blatche makes it seem like you don't even think he's good enough for your ymca league.

I really believe part of it is his image. He sure was a knucklehead.

But I agree, a lot is still in denial that we missed a, like you said, a low risk, high reward guy. It's certainly paying dividends to Brooklyn right now. Most of them still go back to the old @DrayBaltche and not look at what he's been doing right now.

Although, the bashing of the Wizards is not helping, really not. But other than that, he's been a different player. A solid contributor. And a lot of them denies it.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Kane3387 on November 29, 2012, 10:16:22 AM
Nope.



He is still the same knucklehead. He just hasn't done anything yet this season.

I think you are in denial. Surely he would be better than an empty roster spot...


No.  I had to watch him living in the DC area.  Guys like this tease their fans by playing well and behaving well for stints, but eventually, they knucklehead up.
maybe he was a knucklehead because he was on the Wizards and they are all knuckleheads without veteran leadership and a coaching staff that lets them do it.  Javelle McGee seems to be a vastly different player away from Washington.  Maybe all Blatche needed was to get away.

I see some of this. I think all those guys in the middle of the Arenas gun thing needed to get away. They immediately shipped out all their veteran leaders afterwards (Butler, Haywood, Stevenson, Jamison) and never brought in maturity afterwards. When you have immature and young players, you need mature veterans to offset that.

Clearly there was a lot going on in Washington and more to the story. Just look at all the trades and contracts the Wizards have done. It's a poorly run organization.

Sounds like Blatche was somewhat of a scapegoat.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: wdleehi on November 29, 2012, 10:23:08 AM
Nope.



He is still the same knucklehead. He just hasn't done anything yet this season.

I think you are in denial. Surely he would be better than an empty roster spot...


No.  I had to watch him living in the DC area.  Guys like this tease their fans by playing well and behaving well for stints, but eventually, they knucklehead up.
maybe he was a knucklehead because he was on the Wizards and they are all knuckleheads without veteran leadership and a coaching staff that lets them do it.  Javelle McGee seems to be a vastly different player away from Washington.  Maybe all Blatche needed was to get away.


McGee was immature.  Maybe the right coach can fix that.  He can be basketball dumb on the court.



Blatche is full blown knucklehead.  He is the one coaches bench for the lack of defense.  He is the one that heads to AC when the coach suspends him, and proudly tweets about it.

Commish, Avery Johnson seems to not have a problem with him. He WAS all you said. And he can still be, he was amnestied, he gets paid by Wahington, playing or not. he could have Lap Dance Tuesdays and Donut Shop galore all day, and yet there he is playing good, in shape, giving effort. He's trying to fix his NBA image. I believe this realize his mistake.


Yet.



He did this in DC.  Runs of good play followed by the coach/team asking him to stay away.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Who on November 29, 2012, 10:32:21 AM
Seems fairly similar to his strong play while with the Wizards. I don't see why this is surprising. It's about par for the course.

Maybe a little more rebounding but that probably won't last.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: pearljammer10 on November 29, 2012, 10:39:33 AM
Nope.



He is still the same knucklehead. He just hasn't done anything yet this season.

I think you are in denial. Surely he would be better than an empty roster spot...

I would much prefer the empty roster spot over Blatche. He is still a bum and always will be. Yes he had a good game last night against a team that didnt show up, but it could have been even better but he missed 3 wide open layups and made some careless plays and dumb fouls.

Come on man. What Blatche did last night is probably more than Collins will bring at any point in the season.

If Collins played for the Nets he probably could have done what Blatche did against us.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: soap07 on November 29, 2012, 11:47:44 AM
An utter and total miss by the C's to not pick him up. We're holding some bonehead comments against him? Who cares? Delonte did that kind of stuff all the time and we never minded him being on the floor.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: pearljammer10 on November 29, 2012, 11:52:59 AM
An utter and total miss by the C's to not pick him up. We're holding some bonehead comments against him? Who cares? Delonte did that kind of stuff all the time and we never minded him being on the floor.

Delonte West was my least favorite Celtic from the past 10 years. On the court and off.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Fafnir on November 29, 2012, 11:53:15 AM
An utter and total miss by the C's to not pick him up. We're holding some bonehead comments against him? Who cares? Delonte did that kind of stuff all the time and we never minded him being on the floor.
The key is Delonte generally brought it while he was on the floor. You'll also notice after that season he was not brought back even when we needed a backup guard of his caliber.

Blatche has a history of playing at this level for a month or so and then being terrible to the point he's benched.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Fred Roberts on November 29, 2012, 11:55:15 AM
The reason I feel so strongly about this guy is that he brings a lot of what KG can bring. Same height, long, athletic.

Perhaps he's a much worse defender than KG (even 36 year old KG), but I'd argue he's at least as good on offense.

It's our paint presence, or total lack thereof, outside of KG that has me completely worried about this roster. With KG resting, we roll out a totally undersized group that gets wrecked on the glass and relies on perimeter scoring.

We get no paint points. Teams like Brooklyn are able to rest bigs like Lopez and Hump and still have Evans / Blatche to give the Celts a real challenge in the paint.

Raw skills, youth, height, athleticism and vet min status vastly outweigh knucklehead status. Wasn't Randy Moss a knucklehead?
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: alajet on November 29, 2012, 12:27:13 PM
Nope.



He is still the same knucklehead. He just hasn't done anything yet this season.

I think you are in denial. Surely he would be better than an empty roster spot...


No.  I had to watch him living in the DC area.  Guys like this tease their fans by playing well and behaving well for stints, but eventually, they knucklehead up.
maybe he was a knucklehead because he was on the Wizards and they are all knuckleheads without veteran leadership and a coaching staff that lets them do it.  Javelle McGee seems to be a vastly different player away from Washington.  Maybe all Blatche needed was to get away.

I agree with this. It's not as if he was part of a championship-caliber team and ruined all the things by himself. That locker room even went through that infamous gun incident, so, they were really out of their minds altogether.

I'm not going to say Blatche himself is a very mature basketball player.
I'm not even going to suggest he's anywhere near being consistent.

All I'm saying is he's incomparably better even if he plays two games in a month like this, if you compare him to whom Celtics picked up; Darko and Collins.
And he has averaged 9 and 5 in 17 mpg so far. Even if he doesn't score another point this season or even if he doesn't grab another rebound, his win share will still be light years ahead the Celtics big men burned in bench.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Yoki_IsTheName on November 29, 2012, 12:43:20 PM
Nope.



He is still the same knucklehead. He just hasn't done anything yet this season.

I think you are in denial. Surely he would be better than an empty roster spot...


No.  I had to watch him living in the DC area.  Guys like this tease their fans by playing well and behaving well for stints, but eventually, they knucklehead up.
maybe he was a knucklehead because he was on the Wizards and they are all knuckleheads without veteran leadership and a coaching staff that lets them do it.  Javelle McGee seems to be a vastly different player away from Washington.  Maybe all Blatche needed was to get away.


McGee was immature.  Maybe the right coach can fix that.  He can be basketball dumb on the court.



Blatche is full blown knucklehead.  He is the one coaches bench for the lack of defense.  He is the one that heads to AC when the coach suspends him, and proudly tweets about it.

Commish, Avery Johnson seems to not have a problem with him. He WAS all you said. And he can still be, he was amnestied, he gets paid by Wahington, playing or not. he could have Lap Dance Tuesdays and Donut Shop galore all day, and yet there he is playing good, in shape, giving effort. He's trying to fix his NBA image. I believe this realize his mistake.


Yet.



He did this in DC.  Runs of good play followed by the coach/team asking him to stay away.

Commish, with all due respect to Flip Saunders but that's on him. He couldn't discipline that team.

That and the fact that there are no veterans and/or leaders to keep him in check probably got his antics worse. And then to top it off, they named him team captain.

I really understand where you're coming from Commish. His history is pretty bad. But, 15 games in to this season he looks focused and willing to come back better than ever.

Like I said, he could've not played in the NBA at all and STILL get 7-8 million dollars from the Wiz because of the Amnesty. And yet there he is, on a non guaranteed contract, trying as best has he can to be at least a respected basketball player. That to me shows better focus and maturity. And yes he'll make some @DrayBaltche mistakes here and there by running his mouth, but I'm definitely sure we will not see the selfish, lazy, Lap Dance Tuesday hosting, no effort blob of a player ever again.

And that's why it's a Big Miss. We could've had him for the minimum.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: wdleehi on November 29, 2012, 12:53:42 PM
The reason I feel so strongly about this guy is that he brings a lot of what KG can bring. Same height, long, athletic.

Perhaps he's a much worse defender than KG (even 36 year old KG), but I'd argue he's at least as good on offense.

It's our paint presence, or total lack thereof, outside of KG that has me completely worried about this roster. With KG resting, we roll out a totally undersized group that gets wrecked on the glass and relies on perimeter scoring.

We get no paint points. Teams like Brooklyn are able to rest bigs like Lopez and Hump and still have Evans / Blatche to give the Celts a real challenge in the paint.

Raw skills, youth, height, athleticism and vet min status vastly outweigh knucklehead status. Wasn't Randy Moss a knucklehead?


It was Flip Saunders who coached both that said Blatche is nothing like KG.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: CelticG1 on November 29, 2012, 12:54:22 PM
Did andray blatche kill a lot of puppies or something?
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Chris on November 29, 2012, 12:57:18 PM
Did andray blatche kill a lot of puppies or something?

He certainly could have.  Who knows what he learned from Gilbert. 
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Bankshot on November 29, 2012, 03:09:39 PM
I'd rather pick up a naturally talented knucklehead rather than Jason Collins the nice guy.

Me too.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Chris on November 29, 2012, 03:16:16 PM
I'd rather pick up a naturally talented knucklehead rather than Jason Collins the nice guy.

Me too.

I am torn on this, because I tend to think the biggest issue the C's have right now, is with their chemistry and cohesion, rather than their talent.  At least that is what is preventing them from being the second tier team that they should be.  But, they also need more talent, if they want to be a really strong contender against the truly elite teams.

I just am not sure if a guy like Blatche would help enough to get them over the top...or enough to make the risk of him imploding things worth it.  They gave Darko a try, and it didn't work out with him. 

At this point, I would be much happier if they focussed on getting everyone on the same page, and playing together, and then tried to find a way to trade for a more reliable impact player to put them over the top, rather than taking a swing with a guy like Blatche.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: indeedproceed on November 29, 2012, 03:30:01 PM
Quote
@DrayBaltch: U still think them fake tweets R funny my dudez? Next tyme I C U at Lap Dance Tuesday, U better kiss the ring!
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Lightskinsmurf on November 29, 2012, 03:41:23 PM
For the vet min you had nothing to lose and everything to gain.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Chris on November 29, 2012, 03:48:12 PM
For the vet min you had nothing to lose and everything to gain.

Well, they didn't have a roster spot.  They gave that spot to Darko. 

And there is something to lose, if you start relying on him, and then he breaks, like he has in the past.  You don't lose money, but that sort of thing can really affect a team.

He is really the riskiest sort of player, because he is the type who can come in, and be great for a stretch, and then totally go off the reservation when you need him most. 
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: wdleehi on November 29, 2012, 03:50:21 PM
For the vet min you had nothing to lose and everything to gain.

Well, they didn't have a roster spot.  They gave that spot to Darko. 

And there is something to lose, if you start relying on him, and then he breaks, like he has in the past.  You don't lose money, but that sort of thing can really affect a team.

He is really the riskiest sort of player, because he is the type who can come in, and be great for a stretch, and then totally go off the reservation when you need him most.


Not to mention, every good thing Sully and Melo can learn from KG can be countered by a bad thing they learn from Blatche. 
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Lightskinsmurf on November 29, 2012, 03:50:41 PM
For the vet min you had nothing to lose and everything to gain.

Well, they didn't have a roster spot.  They gave that spot to Darko. 

And there is something to lose, if you start relying on him, and then he breaks, like he has in the past.  You don't lose money, but that sort of thing can really affect a team.

He is really the riskiest sort of player, because he is the type who can come in, and be great for a stretch, and then totally go off the reservation when you need him most.

You're reaching now.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: alajet on November 29, 2012, 04:03:24 PM
I'd rather pick up a naturally talented knucklehead rather than Jason Collins the nice guy.

Me too.

I am torn on this, because I tend to think the biggest issue the C's have right now, is with their chemistry and cohesion, rather than their talent.  At least that is what is preventing them from being the second tier team that they should be.  But, they also need more talent, if they want to be a really strong contender against the truly elite teams.

I just am not sure if a guy like Blatche would help enough to get them over the top...or enough to make the risk of him imploding things worth it.  They gave Darko a try, and it didn't work out with him. 

At this point, I would be much happier if they focussed on getting everyone on the same page, and playing together, and then tried to find a way to trade for a more reliable impact player to put them over the top, rather than taking a swing with a guy like Blatche.

I agree that cohesion has been an issue. but as far as I know, it has got nothing to do with off-court issues. It's the definition of roles, I suppose. Green has little idea about what to do. He has been put at SF and PF, but that's just a superficial view of the issue, to be honest. He has no defined roles in taking part in the offense other than the isolations drawn for him. Terry has been up and down, and at times, he didn't get enough looks. Lee has shot the ball fairly poorly for his standards, but played the defense as well as he could.
In other words, although there seems to be a lack of energy on the court, I do believe that they are trying. But it's just not happening and they look puzzled and clueless more than someone lacking effort.
Hands down, Blatche would suffer from this, too, easily.

The thing is here he wouldn't be easily imploding the team by his absurd antics. It isn't easy for even Blatche to get out of control in the locker room with KG's presence around.
I'm not suggesting he would be tutored by KG to mature, but he would, for his own sake, have to shut his mouth up and sit down obediently at the very worst case.

And I don't think he's going to try anything funny with so much expectations looming over the Nets this season.
Because if he does that even on a team that has high ambitions, then he's pretty much done for.
To me, a good team with full of veterans was a last chance for Blatche to prove himself in the league that he can play and so far, he showed that he's a quality pickup.

I myself opt to refrain from taking risks as much as possible in reality, but for the Celtics, who live by and die by jumpshots generally, this could be a fairly plausible risk to take.

Anyway, there is no point in beating a dead horse. If any new chance to upgrade the roster to be better overall comes, I have faith in Danny that he'll pull the trigger.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: the_Bird on November 29, 2012, 04:08:36 PM
Did andray blatche kill a lot of puppies or something?

He certainly could have.  Who knows what he learned from Gilbert.

Pretty sure the one thing Agent Zero taught him was to double-check the inside of his shoes before putting them on.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Chris on November 29, 2012, 04:10:25 PM
For the vet min you had nothing to lose and everything to gain.

Well, they didn't have a roster spot.  They gave that spot to Darko. 

And there is something to lose, if you start relying on him, and then he breaks, like he has in the past.  You don't lose money, but that sort of thing can really affect a team.

He is really the riskiest sort of player, because he is the type who can come in, and be great for a stretch, and then totally go off the reservation when you need him most.

You're reaching now.

I am only reaching to try to get across what I consider a very simple point.  The guy is a headcase, and I don't want him anywhere near this team. 
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Lightskinsmurf on November 29, 2012, 04:27:06 PM
For the vet min you had nothing to lose and everything to gain.

Well, they didn't have a roster spot.  They gave that spot to Darko. 

And there is something to lose, if you start relying on him, and then he breaks, like he has in the past.  You don't lose money, but that sort of thing can really affect a team.

He is really the riskiest sort of player, because he is the type who can come in, and be great for a stretch, and then totally go off the reservation when you need him most.

You're reaching now.

I am only reaching to try to get across what I consider a very simple point.  The guy is a headcase, and I don't want him anywhere near this team.

Ok, if he gets out of control you cut him. Like i said, low risk high reward.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: AshyLarry on November 29, 2012, 04:33:43 PM
Did andray blatche kill a lot of puppies or something?

He certainly could have.  Who knows what he learned from Gilbert.

Pretty sure the one thing Agent Zero taught him was to double-check the inside of his shoes before putting them on.

Ohhh, that Gilbert! The Wizards are the new Clippers.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: LooseCannon on November 29, 2012, 05:59:34 PM
The thing is here he wouldn't be easily imploding the team by his absurd antics. It isn't easy for even Blatche to get out of control in the locker room with KG's presence around.
I'm not suggesting he would be tutored by KG to mature, but he would, for his own sake, have to shut his mouth up and sit down obediently at the very worst case.

What kind of player would Blatche be if he tried to imitate KG and PP, mouth-wise?  How likely would he be to try and do that if he were a Celtic?
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: soap07 on November 29, 2012, 06:07:13 PM
Seriously, if he was such a bonehead and being a cancer/headcase, cut him.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Chris on November 29, 2012, 07:45:02 PM
For the vet min you had nothing to lose and everything to gain.

Well, they didn't have a roster spot.  They gave that spot to Darko. 

And there is something to lose, if you start relying on him, and then he breaks, like he has in the past.  You don't lose money, but that sort of thing can really affect a team.

He is really the riskiest sort of player, because he is the type who can come in, and be great for a stretch, and then totally go off the reservation when you need him most.

You're reaching now.

I am only reaching to try to get across what I consider a very simple point.  The guy is a headcase, and I don't want him anywhere near this team.

Ok, if he gets out of control you cut him. Like i said, low risk high reward.

And like I said, they made their choice on a low risk high reward guy in Darko.  Maybe they made the wrong choice.  I am not sure there was a right choice though.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: ronaldo943 on November 29, 2012, 09:57:29 PM
I dont even know why this thread was madee most of you didnt even want the Celtics to sign him, i was one of the very few
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Yoki_IsTheName on November 29, 2012, 11:40:07 PM
I dont even know why this thread was madee most of you didnt even want the Celtics to sign him, i was one of the very few

You can't blame them. He ha a troubled past of being selfish, a cancer to the team and all.

I wante him here, I think his talents for the minimum are high reward. And the fact that he's on a complete image rebuild makes it low risk. I wanted him before the Darko news came out. And everyone disagreed and said "he'll just be a distraction, a headache". Well, he's proving us wrong in Brooklyn right now (outside of one thing).
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: indeedproceed on January 08, 2013, 12:54:25 PM
http://deadspin.com/5974132/a-member-of-the-brooklyn-nets-is-being-questioned-in-a-sexual-assault-case

Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: mainevent on January 08, 2013, 01:08:13 PM
I dont even know why this thread was madee most of you didnt even want the Celtics to sign him, i was one of the very few

And you can have him, right along with his "associates". I'm SO glad this guy came no where near the Celtics. As Doc states reputations aren't given, they're created. This guys a B-U-M.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Yoki_IsTheName on January 08, 2013, 01:13:25 PM
I dont even know why this thread was madee most of you didnt even want the Celtics to sign him, i was one of the very few

And you can have him, right along with his "associates". I'm SO glad this guy came no where near the Celtics. As Doc states reputations aren't given, they're created. This guys a B-U-M.

A guy for the vet. Minimum. Whos producing better than our backup forward Brandon Bass and making less money? A guy who may have flaws but rebounding is not one of them, which is something we could really use? A guy who seems to be headed on the right path now outside of the Washington commebt and the recent sexual assault, who he may not be a part of, is a bum?

Then what makes the other forwards whos producing less and getting paud more? Ultra bums?
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: indeedproceed on January 08, 2013, 01:17:36 PM
I dont even know why this thread was madee most of you didnt even want the Celtics to sign him, i was one of the very few

And you can have him, right along with his "associates". I'm SO glad this guy came no where near the Celtics. As Doc states reputations aren't given, they're created. This guys a B-U-M.

A guy for the vet. Minimum. Whos producing better than our backup forward Brandon Bass and making less money? A guy who may have flaws but rebounding is not one of them, which is something we could really use? A guy who seems to be headed on the right path now outside of the Washington commebt and the recent sexual assault, who he may not be a part of, is a bum?

Then what makes the other forwards whos producing less and getting paud more? Ultra bums?

Andray Baltche has half a season of good but not great production as a backup 5, with a history of off-court issues and lockerroom cancerfication, in a contract year.

While at this point, it might have played out, and he most definitely would've filled a need, at the point of signing, he looked like a lemon with a rap sheet, and there is still a great chance that's what he'll revert to.

Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: BudweiserCeltic on January 08, 2013, 01:26:34 PM
The thing is here he wouldn't be easily imploding the team by his absurd antics. It isn't easy for even Blatche to get out of control in the locker room with KG's presence around.
I'm not suggesting he would be tutored by KG to mature, but he would, for his own sake, have to shut his mouth up and sit down obediently at the very worst case.

What kind of player would Blatche be if he tried to imitate KG and PP, mouth-wise?  How likely would he be to try and do that if he were a Celtic?

We've already seen it, he failed... in fact, I think KG made him cry or something.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: jowwwman on January 09, 2013, 03:30:58 AM
blatche is helping his team win more games than anyone on the celtics bench. had 20 and 7 in 22 minutes. if jeff green had even one game like this everyone here would be raving about how much of a steal he is.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: bfrombleacher on January 09, 2013, 04:04:49 AM
KG hates him. Bet he hates KG too.

Wish we would have kept Darko. Would have been an upgrade over Collins. I don't blame Doc for everything but he's not perfect.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: cltc5 on January 09, 2013, 04:39:08 AM
I hate to keep harping on it but the mentality of "let's not sign a headcase" amongst the fanbase and seemingly echoed by the team owners is a bit pompous.  A guy with his potential at that cost shoulda been signed and the organization shoulda done what it could to help him fit in.   I respect teams that wanna keep a certian image but sometimes its done to a fault.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: lightspeed5 on January 09, 2013, 04:50:46 AM
what if we did see if he wanted to come and he didnt want to? its not like we can pick and choose which free agents come to boston.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Yoki_IsTheName on January 09, 2013, 05:47:40 AM
I dont even know why this thread was madee most of you didnt even want the Celtics to sign him, i was one of the very few

And you can have him, right along with his "associates". I'm SO glad this guy came no where near the Celtics. As Doc states reputations aren't given, they're created. This guys a B-U-M.

A guy for the vet. Minimum. Whos producing better than our backup forward Brandon Bass and making less money? A guy who may have flaws but rebounding is not one of them, which is something we could really use? A guy who seems to be headed on the right path now outside of the Washington commebt and the recent sexual assault, who he may not be a part of, is a bum?

Then what makes the other forwards whos producing less and getting paud more? Ultra bums?

Andray Baltche has half a season of good but not great production as a backup 5, with a history of off-court issues and lockerroom cancerfication, in a contract year.

While at this point, it might have played out, and he most definitely would've filled a need, at the point of signing, he looked like a lemon with a rap sheet, and there is still a great chance that's what he'll revert to.

I understand the risk. In this game you gotta take risk.

But look at what we're missing, on a vet. minimum deal risk. The reward, which Brooklyn is reaping right now, was well worth it.

That's all I'm saying.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Greenbean on January 09, 2013, 06:59:41 AM
KG hates him. Bet he hates KG too.

Wish we would have kept Darko. Would have been an upgrade over Collins. I don't blame Doc for everything but he's not perfect.

Isn't it more like Darko left than doc got rid of him?
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Celtics4ever on January 09, 2013, 07:32:14 AM
Darko, Blatche I do not think anyone of them would have made a huge difference.   I can not stand Blatche, he thinks he is a small forward.   We have enough jump shooters and prior to this season he was viewed as heartless.

I do not understand the infatuation with Darko.  He is one of the worst picks in NBA history and has won out his welcome on numerous teams. 

I wish we would have got a big like Camby or the like.  You know a guy that defend the rim and double digit rebounds.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: alajet on January 09, 2013, 07:39:17 AM
Didn't we sign Sheed a couple of seasons ago to the MLE, when he was at that stage of his career in which he was taking more three pointers than his total rebounds or something :)

If someone like Sheed couldn't shake up KG's authority in the locker room, someone like Blatche couldn't possibly do it. Granted, Blatche isn't a true C, so, if he backed up KG at C, he wouldn't be doing great, provided he was going to be partnered with Bass/Sullinger. 
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: jdz101 on January 09, 2013, 07:47:34 AM
blatche is helping his team win more games than anyone on the celtics bench. had 20 and 7 in 22 minutes. if jeff green had even one game like this everyone here would be raving about how much of a steal he is.

Jeff has had games like that. They have raved.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: pearljammer10 on January 09, 2013, 07:54:49 AM
Low ball IQ, locker room trouble, questions of heart and desire. A mix between JaVale McGre and Big Baby for me (attitude and smarts wise). I still pass on him no question.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: Bankshot on January 09, 2013, 08:08:03 AM
Low ball IQ, locker room trouble, questions of heart and desire. A mix between JaVale McGre and Big Baby for me (attitude and smarts wise). I still pass on him no question.

Other than possibly attitude (the only attitude I've seen is that he wanted to be a starter), Baby didn't have any of the other problems you listed.  He has a decent to high BBIQ and always plays with heart and desire. 
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: pearljammer10 on January 09, 2013, 08:18:22 AM
Low ball IQ, locker room trouble, questions of heart and desire. A mix between JaVale McGre and Big Baby for me (attitude and smarts wise). I still pass on him no question.

Other than possibly attitude (the only attitude I've seen is that he wanted to be a starter), Baby didn't have any of the other problems you listed.  He has a decent to high BBIQ and always plays with heart and desire.

His IQ on shot selection certainly wasn't as high as you suggest. Heart and desire I can definitely agree with however.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: pearljammer10 on January 09, 2013, 09:00:07 AM
Darko, Blatche I do not think anyone of them would have made a huge difference.   I can not stand Blatche, he thinks he is a small forward.   We have enough jump shooters and prior to this season he was viewed as heartless.

I do not understand the infatuation with Darko.  He is one of the worst picks in NBA history and has won out his welcome on numerous teams. 

I wish we would have got a big like Camby or the like.  You know a guy that defend the rim and double digit rebounds.

Pretty much with you on all accounts here. I'll drop at TP your way. Like I said in other post I just can't stand Blatche.

I think Darko would have been a nice addition for us in the starting lineup however.

But I am definitely with you on Camby however. He would have been the perfect offseason addition to this squad. I mena he played 10 minutes the other night against us and got ten rebounds. Even though he's ancient he still plays efficient ball and doesnt needs the ball on offense to make an impact on the game. Just rebound and provide rim protection, while being in the right place for the easy buckets.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: CelticG1 on January 09, 2013, 09:08:41 AM
what if we did see if he wanted to come and he didnt want to? its not like we can pick and choose which free agents come to boston.

Well there wasn't a single report linking any interest at all with the Celtics and Blatche.

Would be pretty odd. From my knowledge the only team with any interest was the nets. So a lot of teams blew it.

No matter how much you hate him or think he's terrible for a lockerroom or doesn't play defense, he was still worth a vet minimum signing in every way shape and form because there is exactly zero risk.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: soap07 on January 09, 2013, 09:35:12 AM
Blatche has a 23.80 PER. That puts him at 9th in the league. Not that PER is the be all, end all, but the Celtics have one player in the top 30 - Paul Pierce...who is #30.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: RyNye on January 09, 2013, 09:41:24 AM
Blatche is having a good season, but I think it's a bit over-the-top to say that it was a "big miss."

People need to remember that this is a player who had been in the league for 7 seasons, and had been largely terrible in ALL of them. There is a reason that he was sitting on the scrap heap for the vet's minimum. There was no reason in the summer that we should have signed him. Yeah, in retrospect, it looks like he improved his game enough that he would have been a great addition, but that's just hindsight talking.

He is having a career year in points, rebounds, steals, shooting percentages, etc. We don't even know if it is sustainable yet, for all we know he will regress for the rest of the season. But still, we are talking about a complete out-of-nowhere renovation of his game. So it's disingenuous to say that it was a "big miss," because based on the way Blatche had played the last 7 seasons there was no reason to want him besides size.

It's like people harping on Danny Ainge accusing him of screwing up by not drafting Deandre Jordan. Yes, with hindsight, we can see that it might have been a good call, but he was drafted in the 2nd round, so literally every other team in the league passed on him as well.

That's the whole point of a surprise draft pick or a surprise MIP-candidate, it's a SURPRISE. Every team passed on Blatche, reasonably considering his career up to that point. The Nets took a gamble, and it ended up working out because he had an amazing turnaround in his level of play. They got lucky. It happens sometimes. But then using it as a flimsy excuse to attack Danny Ainge for somehow not being able to see the future is pointless.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: alajet on January 09, 2013, 09:55:37 AM
He is having a career year in points, rebounds, steals, shooting percentages, etc. We don't even know if it is sustainable yet, for all we know he will regress for the rest of the season. But still, we are talking about a complete out-of-nowhere renovation of his game. So it's disingenuous to say that it was a "big miss," because based on the way Blatche had played the last 7 seasons there was no reason to want him besides size.

Aside from the FG%, he isn't having a career year. Per minute? Possibly. But per game, he isn't having a career year.
And his game didn't go under a complete renovation. This is the same Blatche that was playing a versatile role in the Wizards before he decided to give zero attention to his on-court performance.

That's the whole point of a surprise draft pick or a surprise MIP-candidate, it's a SURPRISE. Every team passed on Blatche, reasonably considering his career up to that point. The Nets took a gamble, and it ended up working out because he had an amazing turnaround in his level of play. They got lucky. It happens sometimes. But then using it as a flimsy excuse to attack Danny Ainge for somehow not being able to see the future is pointless.

It was a gamble, but not in the sense of expecting him to play good basketball. Before the last season's turmoil, he averaged 16.8 ppg, 8.2 rpg, 2.3 apg and 1.5 spg for the Wizards. Granted, the Wizards were still terrible back then, and Blatche's field goal percentages weren't decent enough to call him great (44% FG isn't desirable for a C, even he is taking outside jumpshots).
Nevertheless, it's not like his performance this season came out of nowhere. He was already capable of it, that's why the Nets took the gamble.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: CelticG1 on January 09, 2013, 10:05:58 AM
Blatche is having a good season, but I think it's a bit over-the-top to say that it was a "big miss."

People need to remember that this is a player who had been in the league for 7 seasons, and had been largely terrible in ALL of them. There is a reason that he was sitting on the scrap heap for the vet's minimum. There was no reason in the summer that we should have signed him. Yeah, in retrospect, it looks like he improved his game enough that he would have been a great addition, but that's just hindsight talking.

He is having a career year in points, rebounds, steals, shooting percentages, etc. We don't even know if it is sustainable yet, for all we know he will regress for the rest of the season. But still, we are talking about a complete out-of-nowhere renovation of his game. So it's disingenuous to say that it was a "big miss," because based on the way Blatche had played the last 7 seasons there was no reason to want him besides size.

It's like people harping on Danny Ainge accusing him of screwing up by not drafting Deandre Jordan. Yes, with hindsight, we can see that it might have been a good call, but he was drafted in the 2nd round, so literally every other team in the league passed on him as well.

That's the whole point of a surprise draft pick or a surprise MIP-candidate, it's a SURPRISE. Every team passed on Blatche, reasonably considering his career up to that point. The Nets took a gamble, and it ended up working out because he had an amazing turnaround in his level of play. They got lucky. It happens sometimes. But then using it as a flimsy excuse to attack Danny Ainge for somehow not being able to see the future is pointless.

There were a ton of people on this board alone that wanted him.

Its not like he was some unknown player that came out of nowhere.

Even if he played like he has the last few seasons he would have been worth the vet min. Its the vet min!

I don't even regret signing Darko. We took an extremely minimal risk, it didn't work out for whatever reason and now he's gone. If it would have worked out it would have been great but it didn't and it didn't effect our team at all.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: feckless on January 09, 2013, 10:38:59 AM
Head Case is too mild here--this is a guy who was shot at 4:30 in the morning hanging out at the wrong place, with the wrong people before his rookie year.  Just interviewed and released in a sexual assault investigation.  A head case as a player, lazy, self absorbed, blows coaches off but a gangster, thug, borderline criminal in the locker room and on the streets.  He simply does not bring enough to the table as a ball player to bring a criminal attitude into our locker rooom.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: LooseCannon on January 09, 2013, 03:45:54 PM
Low ball IQ, locker room trouble, questions of heart and desire. A mix between JaVale McGre and Big Baby for me (attitude and smarts wise). I still pass on him no question.

Other than possibly attitude (the only attitude I've seen is that he wanted to be a starter), Baby didn't have any of the other problems you listed.  He has a decent to high BBIQ and always plays with heart and desire.

One thing that might allow people to draw comparisons to Big Baby is that Blatche ballooned up to around 300 pounds by the end of last season.
Title: Re: Big Miss on Blatche
Post by: CelticG1 on January 09, 2013, 04:15:38 PM
Head Case is too mild here--this is a guy who was shot at 4:30 in the morning hanging out at the wrong place, with the wrong people before his rookie year.  Just interviewed and released in a sexual assault investigation.  A head case as a player, lazy, self absorbed, blows coaches off but a gangster, thug, borderline criminal in the locker room and on the streets.  He simply does not bring enough to the table as a ball player to bring a criminal attitude into our locker rooom.

Id still take him.

Wed probably have at least a couple more wins at this point (at the least) and we could just cut him today and never think about it again.