CelticsStrong
Celtics Basketball => Celtics Talk => Topic started by: Clench123 on November 17, 2012, 09:49:00 AM
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For those that are wondering where Darko is and what Doc plans to do with his big man rotation, he offered some brief insight yesterday.
Rivers’ policy with Collins and Milicic is evolving. With the exception of Collins’ appearance Thursday, both players have virtually been nonexistent on game night. "Jason kind of stabilized us. We were going to go with Darko in the second half if we continued to struggle rebounding the ball," Rivers said. "Sometimes we’ll go big. There will be times where I just want Kevin (Garnett) at the 4. If we like the matchup at the 4, then we’ll move Jason or Darko over to the 5."
It is interesting that he gave the minutes to the offensively challenged Collins ahead of Darko. Does that mean he's ahead of him in the depth chart or more likely that Doc saw a matchup that he liked better? Will either Darko or Collins see any time against the Raps? Only Doc really knows.
Collins only got 1 rebound but his presence did appear to help staunch the flow of offensive boards for the Nets.
So...the speculation that Darko's wrist is at its worst isn't true. Doc just chose not to play him. We haven't used him once this season. I was the most excited about this guy during preseason. He proved then that he was a man on a mission. He clogged the paint and considering that we're the worst rebounding team in the league, we could definately use the big boy. No doubt in my mind we wouldn't have lost to the Nets if Darko was clogging the paint and grabbing those rebounds. When it comes to stuff like these, I don't get Doc at all
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Doc...the only way i can understand him, is to think..he only undersands basketball as a guard......hence he cares little for rebounds and big men type players/plays...! Yes, rondo and kg do alley-oop, but kg runs this team sorta anyway..we know that from the years, when kg was out, what happened.....Darko and kg, at the same time....IF doc understood traditional bball....kg posts on one side, darko goes in and out on the other...for the REBOUND.....before ANYONE shoots, big man under the hoop...THIS is a CLASSIC rule...NEVER SHOOT UNLESS SOMEONE IS UNDER THE HOOP......!!! Darko should be in there...but doc has sat amny a player....why....who yet knows.....!
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I have little problem with how Doc is using the big men rotation in the last few games. Problem I had last game was moving Green at the 4 when Humphries was in the floor paired up with another big.
Doc went with Collins instead of Darko when he had the chance, and on that sole regard, I'd have played Darko.
But I'm fine with what he's doing with Bass-Wilcox-Sullinger at the moment, and that's my most important factor.
That said, yes, let's give Darko a run.
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Completely on board with all this. Lets get big. We're missing our intimidation factor in the middle. We need the attitude back on the court.
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I would love to see us use him as an enforcer. I don't see him having the skill set for anything else.
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YES!
Say what you want against Darko, but that dude has some nasty in him. We could really use some nasty.
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Completely on board with all this. Lets get big. We're missing our intimidation factor in the middle. We need the attitude back on the court.
All this !!!
Playing pattsy basketball, taking jump shots with a bunch of short guys isn't Celtics basketball. ???
Can't win like this ( with out Lebron ) anyway ..... even Kobe had to have Shaq, Bynum and Gasol to get it done....
No decent big men , willing to rebound and play in the paint ....No championship
Life sucks and then you die I guess.
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I just dont get it. He should have played over Collins the other night, but what was the deal today. Up 20 and Wilcox and Bass still in the game. This guy gave up more money overseas to help us in the big catagory, and not playing him tonight was somewhat disrespectful...IMO
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I just dont get it. He should have played over Collins the other night, but what was the deal today. Up 20 and Wilcox and Bass still in the game. This guy gave up more money overseas to help us in the big catagory, and not playing him tonight was somewhat disrespectful...IMO
Of all the things I care about in this world, being "respectful" to Darko is juuuussst about at the bottom.
That said, I would like to see what he's got. Maybe he's still nursing the wrist/ out of shape?
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Maybe Darko Milicic is Serbian for Patrick O'Bryant.
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with the way Wilcox has been playing lately, im not too concerned with him getting the nod over Darko to backup KG
hes good for 2-3 rondo alley-oops a game
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I just dont get it. He should have played over Collins the other night, but what was the deal today. Up 20 and Wilcox and Bass still in the game. This guy gave up more money overseas to help us in the big catagory, and not playing him tonight was somewhat disrespectful...IMO
I've run out of ideas why Darko isn't getting any run at all. Did they just sign him at the last to be their token white guy? I don't understand. You're being annihilated on the glass and can't protect the rim and here's this giant 7'1 275lb center whose best attributes are rebounding and shot blocking and he sits rotting!
Personally I hope he asks for his release and tells Doc to
ES&D!!
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Yeah idk what the deal is with darko.
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Yeah idk what the deal is with darko.
Wrist.
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I just dont get it. He should have played over Collins the other night, but what was the deal today. Up 20 and Wilcox and Bass still in the game. This guy gave up more money overseas to help us in the big catagory, and not playing him tonight was somewhat disrespectful...IMO
Doc trying to build chemistry with the 2nd unit is my guess.
I have a feeling we'll have some timely contributions from Darko sooner or later this year, so I'm not too worried about his lack of playing time right now.
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Tommy mentioned on TV in his ramblings and under his breath , the long minutes the second unit was pulling was on purpose to jell the second squad.
, when a team is abusing the Celtics inside drivng every time down court on KG by himself and the short second team .... I just can't help but think Darko looming in the paint might not SLOW DOWN some of those on slaughts .
If he comes in and ENFORCES and makes people pay for playing in the paint and fouls out might be at least SOMETHING... other than getting destoryed inside by every young and tall team out there.
DArko played great in IMO in preseason appearances . I though he made a NICE impact , made the other teams shoot outside jumpers and got us back in the games.
He must be hurt.
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THIS..is the time of year to try out guys....never judge by practice alone..practice is against your own guys...most play diff against others.....!!! PLAY DARKO...!
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Don't need Darko, with Sully playing the way he is, and Wilcox chipping in too. We looked good today, and keep looking better each game we play. Lots of improvement on the inside D. We're not there yet, but at least you'll see new players pointing to where other players should be on D a bit more often, showing that they not only know their own spot, but theirs as well.
We're getting there, step by step, and I don't think adding Darko will make things easier.
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The unsolved mystery of 2012/2013 season Doc putting Darko in the doghouse after tremendous pre-season.
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Tremendous?
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who still thinks Cs should have run him out of town like we did?
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I'm fine with it. He's not the difference maker in our blow out losses.
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But I think he would've made the difference in some of those loses we've had. He showed a lot of promise preseason...
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But I think he would've made the difference in some of those loses we've had. He showed a lot of promise preseason...
Jeff Green played really well in the preseason as well.
I just think our problems run much deeper than Darko being the answer.
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But I think he would've made the difference in some of those loses we've had. He showed a lot of promise preseason...
Jeff Green played really well in the preseason as well.
I just think our problems run much deeper than Darko being the answer.
i agree. the way the celtics defenders let other players go to the basket was one key. darko would have fouled out in no time trying to prevent those baskets.
i wish darko was still here, but he would not have made a real difference.
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I'm fine with it. He's not the difference maker in our blow out losses.
I'm not buying that. Celtics best years in last 5 were when they legitimate size in their front court. Even last year it was evident any scrubs with size can make an impact. Darko is a lot better player than either Stiemsma or Hollins.
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I'm fine with it. He's not the difference maker in our blow out losses.
I'm not buying that. Celtics best years in last 5 were when they legitimate size in their front court. Even last year it was evident any scrubs with size can make an impact. Darko is a lot better player than either Stiemsma or Hollins.
I think it's a stretch to think we are a Darko away from fixing our problems.
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Darko wouldn't be "the difference maker" right now, but I agree that he'd fill a gaping hole on our team.
I don't know what happened behind the scenes, but from the outside looking in Darko should have been given a spot in the rotation.
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Darko wouldn't be "the difference maker" right now, but I agree that he'd fill a gaping hole on our team.
I don't know what happened behind the scenes, but from the outside looking in Darko should have been given a spot in the rotation.
This. I can't say I'm a big fan of Jason Collins right now. At this point I wouldn't mind Doc putting in Fab and telling him "When you foul out you're out. And if you go ten minutes without a block or 5 minutes without a rebound you're out. Whatever comes first. So just play"
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Darko wouldn't be "the difference maker" right now, but I agree that he'd fill a gaping hole on our team.
I don't know what happened behind the scenes, but from the outside looking in Darko should have been given a spot in the rotation.
This. I can't say I'm a big fan of Jason Collins right now. At this point I wouldn't mind Doc putting in Fab and telling him "When you foul out you're out. And if you go ten minutes without a block or 5 minutes without a rebound you're out. Whatever comes first. So just play"
Oh I'm with this 100%. I hate how Collins is our starting center, if we are going to run out a 7 foot stiff, why not a young 7 foot stiff with potential?
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I don't think you can call Darko's pre-season tremendous, but it's pretty clear that Doc came into this season even more committed than ever to small ball, so it didn't take much for Darko to find himself exiled to the bench alongside Collins.
Mike
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Darko is not walking through that door!
He was mediocre and has been mediocre his whole career.
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Darko is not walking through that door!
He was mediocre and has been mediocre his whole career.
And a mediocre center would be like an all-star compared to what we have now.
Mike
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You guys sound like Washington pols looking to address the deficit: since no individual cuts can balance the budget, why should they bother to make any at all?
Yeah, unless Darko has some deep dark behavioral secret we don't know about, I think Doc should have done more to integrate him into play once he recovered from injury--and kept him in Boston. He'd be a decent backup center with the toughness, beef and intelligence that we are lacking there.
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You guys sound like Washington pols looking to address the deficit: since no individual cuts can balance the budget, why should they bother to make any at all?
Yeah, unless Darko has some deep dark behavioral secret we don't know about, I think Doc should have done more to integrate him into play once he recovered from injury--and kept him in Boston. He'd be a decent backup center with the toughness, beef and intelligence that we are lacking there.
I think that after those losses, when a thread comes up saying "who still thinks Cs should have run him out of town like we did?" it seems like the thread is saying things would be different with Darko.
Atleast that's how it comes off to me.
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Doc...the only way i can understand him, is to think..he only undersands basketball as a guard......hence he cares little for rebounds and big men type players/plays...! Yes, rondo and kg do alley-oop, but kg runs this team sorta anyway..we know that from the years, when kg was out, what happened.....Darko and kg, at the same time....IF doc understood traditional bball....kg posts on one side, darko goes in and out on the other...for the REBOUND.....before ANYONE shoots, big man under the hoop...THIS is a CLASSIC rule...NEVER SHOOT UNLESS SOMEONE IS UNDER THE HOOP......!!! Darko should be in there...but doc has sat amny a player....why....who yet knows.....!
Perfect thought. :)
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In the preseason Dario was the second biggest difference maker after KG defensively. When he or KG was on the court, we were usually playing winning basketball.
When he was on the court he gave us size, strength, shotblocking, rebounding and hustle. Those are things we are sorely lacking this season when KG sits, and while Dario may not have been starter material, he'd have been an absolutely perfect substitute center.
With Darko gone the next player we have who could give us some of those things is Fab Melo. If we want any hope of improvement without a major trade, it unfortunately tests on Fan's shoulders. We NEED a big who is a shotblocking threat and who can defend the paint when KG sits. If we cam get that, then the return of Bradly should help with the rest.
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who still thinks Cs should have run him out of town like we did?
I don't think anybody ran him out of town. If a factor in Darko's leaving was that he couldn't accept not automatically being guaranteed rotation minutes from the get-go, then I say "see ya, Darko, and good luck in Europe."
I did like the Darko signing when it happened, but one of the big issues was always his attitude, and if he thinks he has ever accomplished anything to be guaranteed minutes, then he's completely clueless.
I'm sure he could have earned those minutes, but he'd rather shuffle back off to Serbia than stay and work and prove himself.
Oh well.
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Doc...the only way i can understand him, is to think..he only undersands basketball as a guard......hence he cares little for rebounds and big men type players/plays...! Yes, rondo and kg do alley-oop, but kg runs this team sorta anyway..we know that from the years, when kg was out, what happened.....Darko and kg, at the same time....IF doc understood traditional bball....kg posts on one side, darko goes in and out on the other...for the REBOUND.....before ANYONE shoots, big man under the hoop...THIS is a CLASSIC rule...NEVER SHOOT UNLESS SOMEONE IS UNDER THE HOOP......!!! Darko should be in there...but doc has sat amny a player....why....who yet knows.....!
Perfect thought. :)
if glenn actually thinks this way he is not a good coach and we are in deep deep trouble. :-[
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mediocre center would be like an all-star compared to what we have now.
Mediocre might have been too generous on my part.
6 PPG and 4 RPG in 18 MPG on 45% FG. Yeah, you can pencil in another banner with those career averages, get real!
If he was so good how come he could not crack the lineup?
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His pic is in the dictionary next to draft bust and chronic underachiever.
I have never thought much of his game. DET, MEM, MIN, ORL, NYK and BOS didn't either, career journeyman. I can't believe folks are thinking he could have helped us. He could not even break in the lineup.
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I can't believe folks are thinking he could have helped us.
Some folks realize this guy is our starting center:
(http://redsarmy.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/JCollinsHyperdunk.jpg)
... and think that possibly, Darko could have provided better than 1.5 points, 1.8 rebounds and 29% shooting as a starter. That's without even mentioning the team's 3-8 record in games Collins appears in (2-4 as a starter.)
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6 PPG and 4 RPG in 18 MPG on 45% FG. Yeah, you can pencil in another banner with those career averages, get real!
That's somewhere between double and quadruple the production we're currently getting from our starting center.
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I can't believe folks are thinking he could have helped us.
Some folks realize this guy is our starting center:
(http://redsarmy.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/JCollinsHyperdunk.jpg)
... and think that possibly, Darko could have provided better than 1.5 points, 1.8 rebounds and 29% shooting as a starter. That's without even mentioning the team's 3-8 record in games Collins appears in (2-4 as a starter.)
But, Darko left the team well before that guy became the starter. Who knows, if he'd stuck around maybe Darko would have been our starter right now?
He didn't stick around, though. I'm supposed to be mad at Doc for not babying Darko more and giving him some more minutes to make him feel weally, weally good about himself?
Sorry. Maybe Darko really did leave to tend to his sick mother. If so, good for him. Way to be a family man. If he left partially in a huff over playing time, I blame nobody but Darko.
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I've seen this Philosophy in coaching and management one time before durig the latter Paterno years at Penn State(yes I'm a fan). Sticking with what you know, only change when your forced to, misuse good talent, deemed successful only through the heart and dedication of the team which equals mediocrity 80% of the time and a fanbase making excuses and hoping for next year to be better. Not a place to be. Celtics need a change in philosophy..now
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You guys sound like Washington pols looking to address the deficit: since no individual cuts can balance the budget, why should they bother to make any at all?
Yeah, unless Darko has some deep dark behavioral secret we don't know about, I think Doc should have done more to integrate him into play once he recovered from injury--and kept him in Boston. He'd be a decent backup center with the toughness, beef and intelligence that we are lacking there.
I think that after those losses, when a thread comes up saying "who still thinks Cs should have run him out of town like we did?" it seems like the thread is saying things would be different with Darko.
Atleast that's how it comes off to me.
I think things could be different with Darko here. I'm not trying to make him out to be anything even approaching an All-Star, but having a massive, defensively competent 7-footer with decent mobility and the capability of blocking some shots and grabbing a few boards? That would be a gigantic improvement over our current backup C situation.
Maybe Darko wasn't "run out of town"—maybe he would've left for home regardless of how much or how well he was playing—but the important takeaway here is that Doc wasn't going to play him. Period. And that's a shame.
I like Doc, but I think he needs to realize a few things:
1) Small ball works for the Heat because they have LeBron. We don't have LeBron, so it won't work for us.
2) If you're going to even attempt small ball, you've got to push the tempo, not play halfcourt basketball.
3) Size still matters in the NBA, as evidenced by the list of recent NBA champs not named the Heat.
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You guys sound like Washington pols looking to address the deficit: since no individual cuts can balance the budget, why should they bother to make any at all?
Yeah, unless Darko has some deep dark behavioral secret we don't know about, I think Doc should have done more to integrate him into play once he recovered from injury--and kept him in Boston. He'd be a decent backup center with the toughness, beef and intelligence that we are lacking there.
I think that after those losses, when a thread comes up saying "who still thinks Cs should have run him out of town like we did?" it seems like the thread is saying things would be different with Darko.
Atleast that's how it comes off to me.
I think things could be different with Darko here. I'm not trying to make him out to be anything even approaching an All-Star, but having a massive, defensively competent 7-footer with decent mobility and the capability of blocking some shots and grabbing a few boards? That would be a gigantic improvement over our current backup C situation.
Maybe Darko wasn't "run out of town"—maybe he would've left for home regardless of how much or how well he was playing—but the important takeaway here is that Doc wasn't going to play him. Period. And that's a shame.
I like Doc, but I think he needs to realize a few things:
1) Small ball works for the Heat because they have LeBron. We don't have LeBron, so it won't work for us.
2) If you're going to even attempt small ball, you've got to push the tempo, not play halfcourt basketball.
3) Size still matters in the NBA, as evidenced by the list of recent NBA champs not named the Heat.
Who says; "Doc wasn't going to play him. Period."? He stuck around for all of--what--fifteen games or so?
Darko's the one who pulled the plug permanently, not Doc.
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You guys sound like Washington pols looking to address the deficit: since no individual cuts can balance the budget, why should they bother to make any at all?
Yeah, unless Darko has some deep dark behavioral secret we don't know about, I think Doc should have done more to integrate him into play once he recovered from injury--and kept him in Boston. He'd be a decent backup center with the toughness, beef and intelligence that we are lacking there.
I think that after those losses, when a thread comes up saying "who still thinks Cs should have run him out of town like we did?" it seems like the thread is saying things would be different with Darko.
Atleast that's how it comes off to me.
I think things could be different with Darko here. I'm not trying to make him out to be anything even approaching an All-Star, but having a massive, defensively competent 7-footer with decent mobility and the capability of blocking some shots and grabbing a few boards? That would be a gigantic improvement over our current backup C situation.
Maybe Darko wasn't "run out of town"—maybe he would've left for home regardless of how much or how well he was playing—but the important takeaway here is that Doc wasn't going to play him. Period. And that's a shame.
I like Doc, but I think he needs to realize a few things:
1) Small ball works for the Heat because they have LeBron. We don't have LeBron, so it won't work for us.
2) If you're going to even attempt small ball, you've got to push the tempo, not play halfcourt basketball.
3) Size still matters in the NBA, as evidenced by the list of recent NBA champs not named the Heat.
Who says; "Doc wasn't going to play him. Period."? He stuck around for all of--what--fifteen games or so?
Darko's the one who pulled the plug permanently, not Doc.
That's just my belief, of course, but I think it's a justifiable belief: Collins, for example, didn't play until game 8, then sat out the next five, then saw action in three straight, but then sat out six straight before Doc apparently decided that going big is a good idea and started playing Collins consistently. I suppose that if Darko was still here two weeks ago, when Collins started seeing regular minutes, then maybe Doc would've given Darko a try, but I don't think that's certain.